Why did Sonny Liston/his team attempt to cheat Vs a 7-1 underdog and then quit?

Bang on Swag.

I was keeping the bursitis and other injury incurred during the fight separate, as I’ve previously read of them being separate issues - the latter injury incurred during the fight being an exacerbation of another (not the bursitis) pre existing condition .

As for treatment prior to the fight, the bursitis in itself would’ve been sufficiently painful and restricting to cause Liston to back off sparring early I would think - let alone the other issue.

Ironically, it would be Ali who would later have to drop sparring early in several fights due to his chronically bad hands - imagine that, having to favour your main weapons (hands) not just during a fight but also going into a fight.

 

Al Weil was stealing Rocky's money and it is well documented.
Rocky would never quit no matter what, if he would get no money he would still never quit.

 

But two surrenders and cheating with some substances is what we call a quitter and lacking of heart.

Against a man twice smaller than and the man that is a joruneyman bum?
Heart would be if he continued fighting Ali no matter if Ali stopped him or knocked him out.

 

I've heard for years the substance Liston's trainer was using on Sonny that got in Ali's eye was liniment, which is a topical analgesic. You can do a quick search and see all the uses for liniment. It would be something the trainer of an older fighter with a bad shoulder 60 years ago would have used.

You don't have to "prepare" it. But, like Mentholatum Deep Heating Rub (today), you wouldn't want to get it in your eye.

Now, the question of whether it was on Liston's shoulder, and it got in Ali's eye while they were clinching and sweating, or it was poured on Liston's glove, is open to question.

 

It’s easy to say someone should always go out on his shield when you’re not the one lying on the shield.

 

The referee said after the fight that he'd personally checked Liston's gloves at the end of the 4th round and found nothing wrong. If there was some substance soaking the glove potent enough to blind a man, it should have been pretty obvious.

https://ibb.co/XyFb6Nm

 

Hopefully we can finally put this laughable myth to rest, but not sure that's possible when you have agenda-driven tools.

 

Exactlly. If they quickly rubbed Horse Liniment Oil or DMSO on Sonny Liston's shoulder, as my late Grandfather believed, that could have gotten anywhere: on his gloves, in is hair, on his arms, in Muhammad Ali's eyes, anywhere. For the rest, my Grandfather was fond of quoting Vince Lombardi: "Fatigue makes cowards of us all."

 

That's what we call "SSDD"..."Same S**t...Different Day". He did nothing as Champion....and crapped himself in front of the whole world in the 2 biggest fights of his career!

 

Exactly PRW and there are more important things than boxing to risk life and limb for anyway.

 

Great info from Solomon - I’d never read before that ref Felix checked the gloves between 4 & 5.

A lot of versions of Liston vs Ali are edited - I wonder if any vision of Felix’s check between rounds 4 and 5 can be found - that would be very cool to see also. Might have a look/see.

So, if the glove doesn’t fit (coated with lineament) then we must acquit!

However, like you said, those wishing to push the myth will still do so anyway, in the face of all concrete, counter facts otherwise - and, if said individuals choose to perpetuate the myth, it will only serve to heavily impugn their own credibility.

 

So SSDD would aptly describe your frequent claims that Shavers never had a KO past round 7?

Of course it would. Most of your posts are SSDD as you regurgitate the same half a dozen ramblings again and again.

 

I love it when he comes in and slaps revisionists right smack in the face with contemporary facts

 

Does he what? Lol. Comes in like the Lone Ranger, sets things right, then quietly rides off again.

Our man’s knowledge, efficiency and modesty is something I can only dream of.

Out of left field - our McV used to be Tonto as I recall. They’d make a great team!

 

He appears out of nowhere as if sent from the heavens. It's almost Candyman like but with 50's to 60's fibs and revisionism posts the trigger instead of his own name.