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Old 10-19-2012, 07:30 AM   #27
Big & Slow
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Default Re: 2 guys both same weight and speed, one is strong one isnt, do they hit with = pow

Originally Posted by Diomedes View Post
But you're forgetting about the delivery of the force.

...other guy hits, but instead of delivering all of the force at the end of a solid arm, his weaker arm "buckles"...
In this example the force wasn't delivered by the second boxer, for reasons as you mentioned. Like I said in my example, all things being equal, including the delivery, the outcome can be predicted every single time.

In your example, and in a real life example like the OP proposes, all things will not be equal. If one guys arm buckles, obviously he's not going to hit as hard as someone with a solid punch.

However, my point is, arm strength (beyond the amount needed to deliver the punch in a technically perfect way) has nothing to do with it.

Originally Posted by OMGWTF View Post
Thanks for your answer mate! Can you explain the following tho?

So how do you explain a guy like george forman hitting harder than mike Tyson, depite both men in their prime weighing the same and Tyson being MUCH faster with better technique and George being slow?

Sure thing:

I don't think anyone who fought both would say George was a bigger puncher than Tyson, for the reasons that you mentioned. I'd wager that if both were in a lab having punching power measured that Tyson would blow George out of the water.

Can you explain why Earnie Shavers hit the hardest out of everyone despite not weighing much for a HW and despite not being that fast?

Because he had good technique that allowed him to put more of his body mass into his punches.

Can you explain why rocky marciano hit so hard for am man his size who was small and no especially fast.

Same as above

Can you explain why Julian Jackson hit so much harder than Roy Jones Jr despite weighing less and being slower, ?
Because Roy had ****ty punching technique. He threw a lot of arm punches while he was off balance. The reason he was successful was because of blinding hand speed, which allowed him to land shots the other guys didn't see coming. Those are always the ones that **** you up.

Originally Posted by dealt_with View Post
How do you overcome inertia/accelerate mass? With strength
Talking about physics
Force is essentially the equivalent of strength. Have you never seen a force-velocity curve?
Look, dumbass. You obviously don't know **** about phsyics, so let me school your simple ass before you clog this guys thread up with more irrelevant nonsense.

1. Mass and weight are not the same thing.

The mass of an object refers to the amount of matter that is contained by the object. The weight of an object is the force of gravity acting upon that object.

Mass is related to how much stuff is there and weight is related to the pull of the Earth upon that stuff.

The mass of an object (measured in kg) will be the same no matter where in the universe that object is located. Mass is never altered by location, the pull of gravity, speed or even the existence of other forces. For example, a 2-kg object will have a mass of 2 kg whether it is located on Earth, the moon, or Jupiter; its mass will be 2 kg whether it is moving or not (at least for purposes of our study); and its mass will be 2 kg whether it is being pushed upon or not.

On the other hand, the weight of an object (measured in Newton) will vary according to where in the universe the object is. Weight depends upon which planet is exerting the force and the distance the object is from the planet. Weight, being equivalent to the force of gravity, is dependent upon the value of g - the gravitational field strength. On earth's surface g is 9.8 N/kg (often approximated as 10 N/kg). On the moon's surface, g is 1.7 N/kg. Go to another planet, and there will be another g value. Furthermore, the g value is inversely proportional to the distance from the center of the planet. So if we were to measure g at a distance of 400 km above the earth's surface, then we would find the g value to be less than 9.8 N/kg. (The nature of the force of gravity will be discussed in more detail in a later unit of The Physics Classroom.) Always be cautious of the distinction between mass and weight. It is the source of much confusion for many students of physics.

2. Force, Strength and Power are not the same thing.

Force is the capacity to perform work. It has both quantity and direction. We would speak of "the force of gravity" for example. It is measured in newtons (N).

Power is the rate at which work is done, commonly measured in Watts (W).

Strength is generally the ability to resist deformation. It cam be measured in a number of ways, crushing strength for example may be measured in megapascals (MPa).

Originally Posted by dealt_with View Post
Tendon properties, level of CNS activation, muscle wisdom, technique, lack of co-activation, muscle pennation, fascicle length, point of tendon insertion, muscle stiffness etc. etc.

This is a stupid question that can't be answered (especially not with the level of understanding being displayed here) because there are too many factors and individual circumstances. But if you'd like to listen to idiots claim that it's all about a simple equation like body weight x velocity then go ahead.
Obviously you are that idiot. Assuming that your brain didn't explode trying to understand this post, do us a favor and go read a book with your simple ass.

Originally Posted by OMGWTF View Post
Nice, is there anyway to get a full picture of what makes a powerful punch with all the factors included, or is it simply not known to anyone?

How do you find out the answer to this complex question? What do you study to know? Is there any literature specific in answering this question or is it mainly theories and no one really knows?
Brother, I gave you the answer in my first post. If you don't believe me, go to any gym and watch people hit the bag. Its obvious in seconds that technique = punching power.

If you don't want to watch the entire video, just watch the from where they show Houston Alexander to the end. They explain the entire process scientifically and very clearly. If it wasn't true then how do you explain a 140lb woman with a great ass punching harder than a 200lb male MMA fighter with ripped muscles?

Its not magic. Its easily explainable by science. Don't let the 15yr old, ****ing to porn in their rooms trolls on ESB sway you into thinking otherwise.


Last edited by Slacker; 10-19-2012 at 07:40 AM.
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