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Old 11-02-2012, 11:56 AM   #578
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Default Re: If YOU were Joe Calzaghe, would you come out of retirement to fight Andre Ward?

Originally Posted by Loudon View Post

As mentioned, I can remember hearing it, and thinking, that doesn't make sense. But I can't find it online. It was definitely before 2006 though. In theory he could have fought Tarver, if he'd have beaten Hopkins, but we don't know that. When Roy had lost 3 in a row, he said he'd rather fight him, than Johnson and Tarver, which didn't make a lot of sense. It's all ifs and buts. I just wish he'd have fought Glen Johnson. Maybe if he'd have beaten Glen, putting in a good performance, a fight against Tarver and an earlier fight with Hopkins may have happened?

It did make sense, fighting Jones earned Joe $10m. I'm not sure how much he would have gotten to fight Tarver or Johnson, but we can agree it would have been substantially less!

I can appreciate all of the above, but I didn't like Joe's comment when he said, there was absolutely nothing left to achieve. I suppose you can't blame him for cashing in against Roy, but Dawson would have been a much more competitve fight, that I'm sure fans would rather have seen. But like you say, boxing is a business. He said Pavlik had done nothing to warrant a fight. (he hadn't at 16 But fans would have loved that fight at the time. He also said Dawson had done nothing to warrant a fight. Now if you agree, then that's fair enough. But the thing is, he dismissed them, but chose to fight Roy, who he'd been dismissing from 2004.
I think he embarrassed himself a little, when he pretended that he thought Roy was back to his best etc. A little honesty would have been a lot better. Roy chased him in 2008. He could have said, Roy wants the fight, and the opportunity is too good to turn down etc. That would have been fair enough. But early in 2008, he said he'd be disappointed if Roy was his last fight, and he wasn't a great fighter anymore. Then 6 months later, it's Roy's back! He's had three great wins etc! There was no need for it.

I don't think he embarrassed himself, he was selling a fight. Roy and his camp were saying Roy was sharp again and fighting well. Roy was still a good fighter in 2008, a long way off his best, but still a good fighter

That's fair enough, but again, a little honesty wouldn't have gone amiss.
You would have thought with Joe's style, that he'd have relished a fight against a guy like Kelly Pavlik. I know he was free from Frank when he signed to fight Roy, and they both said that the negotiations were easy to make, because neither fighter was tied in to anyone. But the fight didn't do great PPV. I would assume, that he probably would have got more money against Pavlik, because that fight would have excited everyone, and a lot more people would have been interested in it. I think the PPV figures would have been much higher. Even if he'd have still been with Frank, and he'd have taken a cut, I still think he'd have earnt more in the end. He also would have gained a lot more respect.

I think Joe relished the payday he got from Jones. Pavlik doesn't have a fanbase to compare to Roy's. He would not have gotten $10m to fight Kelly Pavlik, nobody ever has or will. Look at the interest Calzaghe-Jones generated, compared to Hopkins-Pavlik. Hopkins was far more known in the US than Calzaghe, yet people talked about Jones-Calzaghe.

As I've mentioned, I could envisage both guys beating each other.

I don't know about being scared, but again, would he have been up for the fight? He did fight Lacy and Kessler, but would they have posed the same threat?

We can't just automatically assume, that he'd have stepped in with Ward. He could have dismissed him like he did Pavlik.

ok mate we'll agree to disagree here

Despite him destroying Lacy, you can't just ignore the fact that he tried to pull out, till Frank intervened. I think Joe would definitely have seen Andre as the bigger threat, if he'd have been around at the time, and Joe had've seen him fight a few times.
why would Ward be seen as the bigger threat? He's a solid, awkward fighter who works his way inside, and tries to maul opponents on the inside, but at the same time he's feather fisted.

Lacy was a KO artist, who was tearing through the division. Here's a guy who could put your lights out with one shot, being built up as the SMW Tyson

I think a Calzaghe would have figured Ward out and once he settles into the fight, and took him apart in a good fight. The Hopkins that Joe beat was better than Ward. If you look at Ward's best wins - Kessler and Froch, two guys who are flat footed and lack the athletic ability and ring IQ of a Calzaghe.

As said, we'll have to agree to disagree

That's fair enough, I heard that, but again, he also stated that he'd nothing left to achieve. In another interview I heard, he said Dawson was a good fighter, but he'd done nothing. Which again is fair enough, but he'd done a lot more than Roy. Everyone knew Roy's career had ended 4 years earlier.
I see, but in one thread I remember you stating that despite Joe being a great fighter, Jones would have never fought him in 2002 because he had no fanbase to speak of.

Dawson is good, but has no fanbase to speak of.

Yet you state Joe should have fought him. That seems unfair in the context

True, but I don't know the circumstances involved. You'll have to educate me on this. Did he clearly duck him?
Bute called Ward out, and said he was willing to travel to Oakland for the fight.

After Ward beat Froch, Bute was mooted and he said Bute hasn't proved himself

Article Link - http://www.***********.com/?m=show&o...#ixzz2B57tQIZZ
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The president of Sportscene and InterBox, Jean Bédard, made it very clear - IBF super middleweight champion Lucian Bute will not chase after, or wait around, for a unification with Super Six tournament winner Andre Ward. After Ward recently decisioned Carl Froch to unify the WBA/WBC titles, he was challenged by Bute. Bedard was advised by Ward's promoter, Dan Goossen, of their intentions to pursue other opportunities.

"Ward and his promoter were clear, he is looking for a an easier fight and he is not ready for Lucian. We are certainly not going to run after him all year. We have other options," Bedard said.

Funnily enough, after Bute-Froch was signed, sealed and delivered, Ward comes out and says that's a shame because he wanted to fight Bute himself. Which simply wasn't true.

Instead Ward went on to fight a drained Dawson who posed next to no threat

Whilst Bute took the risk of defending his title in his opponents back yard against Froch, a bigger risk than Ward has ever taken

Same to you.


Great debating with you mate!

Regards, Loudon.

Thanks mate, get back to me whenever you can
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