Originally Posted by edward morbius
"Childs, Russell, Craig, Ferguson, Griffin, Armstrong"
How impressive is this list of names.
Frank Craig--weighed 154 on 9-10-1900 against George Gardner. Was on a six bout losing streak when ko'd twice by Martin in 1902 when Martin was perhaps the outstanding contender.
Fred Russell--had lost to Joe Kennedy, and Joe Choynski, and was coming off a ko defeat to Tom Sharkey. Martin beat him on a 10 round DQ.
Sandy Ferguson--ok, but hard to judge how good he was in 1902
Hank Griffin--I agree with Boilermaker that he might well be the best of this lot. Drew with Childs and ko'd Johnson and was a consistent winner.
Frank Childs--was a small man even by the standards of the time. He had Armstrong's number, but was ko'd by Choynski and later beaten by him again, and drew with Joe Kennedy. Not much here to claim he would be a worthy opponent for the 50 lb heavier Jeffries.
Bob Armstrong--by far the most erratic. His ko's of Slavin and Martin were impressive, but he also had scads of bad defeats.
Joe Kennedy--fought two draws with Griffin and one with Childs. Why exactly should they be considered superior? Went out in a quick two against Jeffries. Because he was white, he did get a shot at Jeffries.
**Perhaps there weren't that many interracial fights, but for the most part this group didn't do that well when they got such a fight. Childs was ko'd by Choynski and Creedan. Armstrong and Griffin lost to Jeffries. Craig lost to almost everybody.
I just think trying to build this group up as somehow in the same class as Jackson, Langford, Jeannette, McVea, Wills, Godfrey, Gains, etc just doesn't fly.
They seem to have been basically trial horses, with the possible exception of the smallish Childs. I don't think he was a top heavyweight, but he might have been one of the elite against opponents at his own weight.
You keep harping on about Childs being small, he was heavier than Choynski, and Fitz, and on a par with Sharkey when Sharkey first met Jeffries.
Griffin never kod Johnson, he beat him by 20rds dec.
You miss the point entirely.I'm not trying to build them up as good as Langford etc.
I'm implying that they were at least as deserving of title shots as Finnegan ,Munroe, Kennedy and Corbett ,and in most cases more deserving.