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Old 12-24-2012, 10:18 AM   #49
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Default Re: How does your current P4P top 10 look

Originally Posted by thewinfella View Post
Clearly you like the word "objectively", and I always debate "objectively" other than when talking about BJ Penn, who was the inspirational drive behind my love for MMA, so i sort of always lean towards him and maybe my heart can tend to rake over

Jonny Hendricks is riding the crest of a wave and has momentum, Barao is slightly different circumstance, he is genuinely "elite" in skill-set but lacking in achievement, Hendricks is not and i believe never will be "elite" in skill-set, and St Pierre will absolutely decimate him

Machida has been a UFC champion, in a division housing superstars, and when he was the champion, 205 was unequivocally the elite division in world MMA, to compare Hendricks to somebody like Machida is like comparing Ricky Burns to Miguel Cotto, its ludicrous!

Lets look at his current run of form

Shogun - Loss by KO 1, Shogun at this time was rooted in the top 5 P4P and will go down as probably the #1 or #2 LHW of all time, as it stands, not a great deal of shame in that

Rampage - Loss UD, You my friend are not looking at this objectively, and ill tell you why .......... this was the best version of Rampage since he fought Forrest Griffin IMHO, if you have studied Rampage which i have, its easy to pick the fights he was in shape for, and this was one of them, fleet footed, good movement, no cardio issues, striking was crisp, this was a good version of Rampage, no doubt about it, and Machida beat him 2 rounds to 1!

Couture - Win by KO - Not much to say, other than another showcase of what Machida can do, Randy was a static target and couldn't get his range to apply strategy, therefore it was straight forward for Machida.

Jones - Loss Sub 2 - Machida claims he was ordered not to fight buy his Family doctor due to illness, whatever! he lost decisively to the current champ who is frankly looking rather special! and underlines the word elite

Bader - He has his limits, and yes he's probably B class at best, but ill say this, the way Machida dealt with him underlines his ability, Bader had no business being in the same cage, another straight forward win for him!

All this by the way was preceded by a 15 fight win streak leading to the demolition of Rashad Evans!

Machida is the elite of the sport, he's been a champion and may be a champion again, Hendricks is only just reaching top contender status, and will never be a dominant figure in the WW division, further to that, he will not finish top guys one after the next at the very top level the way Machida has and will do in the future

Im praying for Phil Davis or Alexander Gustaffson to step up and fight him, because they will be surgically picked to shreds, Gustaffson is being haled as the next coming of Anderson Silva, and Davis is is a highly regarded top level fighter who isnt on Machida's list of victims!

Im sorry they dont compare
You have different criteria to me, and to the vast majority of the MMA world I think.

I agree that Machida is an elite talent, for sure. But that isn't a reason to keep him in the p4p top 10 when his last convincing victory over a top 10 opponent was May 2009, and it's December 2012. I think Sergei Kharitonov would knock out Frank Mir annd Big Nog, but it doesn't mean he takes their place in the top 10, he hasn't beaten a top guy in years either (Overeem in '07).

Form is a critical factor in MMA, you have to give guys the recognition they deserve for going into tough fights and beating the best opponents. While Lyoto has beaten two non top 10 guys, Hendricks has beaten Fitch, Koscheck and Kampmann, Condit has beaten Diaz, Kim and MacDonald, Barao has beaten Faber, Jorgensen and Pickett.

Using my criteria (and I would say, the majority criteria), there is no argument for having Machida above these guys. The difference in quality of opponent and result is too great. And I believe Lyoto is a better fighter than Hendricks or Condit, probably better than Barao too.
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