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Old 07-01-2009, 10:45 PM   #46
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Default Re: Harold Johnson - Frightenly Muscular

Originally Posted by fists of fury View Post
But it doesn't happen like that. Meta5 has pretty much summed it up already, and I agree with what he said.

Even pro bodybuilders will struggle to put on just 20 pounds of muscle a year after several years, and they're the genetic elite.

Cast your mind back to 1992. Dorian Yates enters the Mr. Olympia weighing 242 pounds, if memory serves. The next year he came in at 257, which represents only a 15 pound gain in muscle mass.
People could not believe he had put on that much size in only a single year.
Yes, guys like Coleman and Cutler have also done it. but it's rare...very rare. And again, these guys are the absolute elite in building muscle and are also taking copious amounts of steroids. They were never, at any stage of their lives, the proverbial 98 pound weakling. Never.
No Coleman nor Culter have done it. Yates looked terrible with that weight gain. He wasn't as lean, cut or as vascular. Obviously there is a platue but the one guy basically said you are either born to look like Harold Johnson. The truth is most people can get that look. Jay Cutler is another thing. Cutler and Coleman are just a protegy of more gut and size infested group of bodybuilders that are more roid infested. Also nutrition/supplementation and knowledge is even more than it was in the early 90's than what it is now. Who says that you can continiously put on 15 lbs of muscle each year?

Seriously, I can't believe you think any old body can just ingest a lot of protein and do weight training and get big. Bigger yes, but that's relative to the person concerned.
Any old body? Okay, now you're really stretching from the main thesis/point of the original guys argument. He said young people are being fooled into think they can look like Harold Johnson... they're just born like that. Genetics play a part but hard work can get you to look that good. Not everyone can be Jay Cutler or Ronnie Coleman of course, but those guys couldn't be that without the hard work and tons of riods.

If that were the case, there would be legions of big, muscular guys walking around. The opposite is the case. Most gyms have a small minority of big guys, while the vast majority of trainees are struggling to add just 5 pounds of muscle to their physiques, let alone 48.
Thousands upon thousands of guys flock to gyms every year to get big, yet how many big guys do you see walking around?
The percentage is tiny compared to the amount of people trying their butts off.
I'm talking about people not on steroids.
Right, genetics is important. People have headstarts, some people gain far quicker. Doesn't mean hard work won't pay off. The people who got discouraged don't get that. The people who are usually huge get it with much more persistance/dedication (Not all of them). People in terms of nutrition and getting to understand their bodies is also other factors that people negligent or don't understand.

Sure, in a lot of cases you can write it off to lack of effort or a bad routine or both, but many are ticking all the right boxes yet still struggle to add serious size.
You sound like this is an instant want from people. That's the problem. I said hard work of years. Nobody struggles to gain size in years.

As Meta5 said already, the gains become harder to come by year by year. Almost anyone can gain muscle pretty quickly initially, but after 3 or 4 years you hit a plateau and thereafter it is that is extremely difficult to add meaningful size without resorting to drugs.
Wow... I'm done with this conversation if you actually believe that. I am living proof that this is total bs.

In addtion, I've yet to meet anyone who gained significant size without gaining a fair amount of bodyfat. There are few exceptions, in my experience.
So you may after a number of years have the size, but not the shape. That's another story.
Well. That deals with genetics too. Diet, or how hard and how much training the person does. If they go hard with cardio while really cutting carbs and calories the way bodybuilders do for competetions they can get that look. Most people can look like guys on the front of magazine with years and years of hard work. And this is without steroids. The guy you agree with thinks that guys are born a certain way and nobody can look like them with hardwork or steriods. It's foolish and lazy attitude occupied by usually lazy, undedicated people who justify and give excuses for their lack of work. You notice it's usually people who don't look good who say these things. Obviously genetics play a part, but seriously.

Then they were juicing, simple as that. The myth that scrawny guys can get huge, big muscles without drugs is just that.
To be truthful to you. I know scrawny kids that did juice to help them. But they got far without it. And I know scrawny kids that got big without juicing. This isn't a "myth" you view is just a tad narrow-minded.

Either way, do you realize that John guy said that steroids or anything won't do anything. It's "all genetics." Unless I read that wrong, this was the whole argument. Anybody with years of hard work and steroids could probably achieve a profession as a bodybuilder type model. Genetics won't disable this. Genetics just allow for things to come easier for people or for others to be naturally strong/big. Sometimes genetics give you great capacity, but it's more likely you just reach farther since you have solid genes. And I know these gene freaks but I couldn't keep up with in terms of gains. But I could hold my own with them even when they worked half as hard as me.
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