View Single Post
Old 11-06-2007, 11:04 AM   #20
ChrisPontius
March 8th, 1971
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Holland
Posts: 9,643
vCash: 238
Default Re: Joe Frazier as a puncher.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Senya13
Stopping Quarry how exactly? Stopping Chuvalo how exactly? Stopping former middleweight Ellis is impressive indeed, how were both fights stopped? Knocking glass-chinned HW Bob Foster is even more impressive.
By knocking them senseless. Ellis was floored twice and had nothing left. Quarry i believe was floored once but like Ellis, all steam was taken out of him. If Frazier was an average puncher, then they wouldn't have looked like they gone to war after a mere 5 rounds while they went the full 15 against each other without much trouble.

Chuvalo's jaw was swollen horrific. He was only stopped twice in his entire career, one being a huge puncher in Foreman, the other being Frazier. I think it goes without saying that this seperates Frazier fom a lot of others.



I think you miss a key point here. You should not treat each piece of evidence seperatly.

A fighter who knows down Ali once need not be a great puncher.
A fighter who knocks Foster senseless in two rounds need not be a great puncher.
A fighter wins 27 out of 32 fights within the distance need not be a great puncher (for instance, if those were 27 tomato cans and 5 contenders)


BUT

A fighter who consistently stops world class, tough contenders or champions like Quarry, Ellis, Ali, Foster, Machen and Chuvalo AND is the only one to knock down Ali when he was in his prime AND is the only one of two to stop Chuvalo AND wins 27 of 32 within the distance AND is called a puncher by most accounts of the time, then a pattern starts to occur: Frazier carries a good punch.

Now i wouldn't classify him as a strict puncher but more as a swarmer. But that doesn't mean he can't punch. I wouldn't say he has big one-punch KO power (claims that a focused Lewis would be out after a single Frazier hook are ridiculous in my opinion), but he still has excellent power.


You can go on about how Ali had been knocked down before, but the fact is that only Cooper and Frazier knocked him down when he was in his prime, despite having faced a LOT of big punchers even further past his prime (Shavers, Foreman, Liston, Norton) yet they couldn't floor him!

Similar case with the Foster and Chuvalo stoppages: Chuvalo was only stopped once again in something like 80 fights and that took another huge puncher, Foster was never knocked out so hard and fast, excepting his last fight.
ChrisPontius is offline  Top
Reply With Quote