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Old 09-20-2010, 03:11 PM   #36
PowerPuncher
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Default Re: Do you consider Juan Manuel Marquez to be an ATG

Quote:
Originally Posted by Addie View Post
Erik Morales actually defeated Pacquiao whereas the best Marquez managed was a draw. Is Pat Cowdell better than Wilfredo Gomez because he was more competitive in losing to Salvador Sanchez?

Ultimately we will all have different criteria but what irritated me about your opening response was how you were omitting obvious facts. Technically you're correct, Marquez and Barrera are practically the same age, but what relevance does that have? We both know Barrera was far more removed from his prime than Marquez was, and thus the win is simply a good one as opposed to great. Likewise, we both know, the world knows, that Casamayor was significantly more faded than the Mexican and thus the win is just a good one, not a great one.

I couldn't give a crap about what belts they held at the time of the defeats, that doesn't even begin to tell the full story and you surely know this.
Saying the best Marquez did against Pacquaio is managing a draw is also omitting facts, he won more rounds than Pac in both fights, and the majority of polls had him winning the rematch, if not the first

As for the MAB/Casa issue, yes they were past prime, and MAB was above his best weight (which in fairness JMM may have been but he carried 130 better). But MAB is an ATG, Casa is a near great. Both have elite boxing skills even if past prime. To write off those 2 wins as 'so what' is very unfair to Marquez. The there is his featherweight tenure, where he took on all kinds of tricky tasks, all the top10 contenders that while not great were good fighters of different styles.

Earlier in his career Marquez suffered from being 'a who needs him' fighter, a promoter (Arum) who didn't want to match him against his cash cow in Morales and bad management that advised him not to take the short money against Hamed/Pacquaio rematch. If he got Pacquaio 6months after the first fight it likely would be a clear cut victory, instead JMM deteriated, Pac got better, and the majority of neutral fans still had JMM winning.

At the end of the day it depends on your definition of greatness, but for my money he probably makes a Top6 Mexican List.
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