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Old 07-08-2007, 02:55 PM   #31
RAMPAGE0017
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Default Re: Frazier Nearly Destoryed Ali -

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Originally Posted by miamite
I would have to disagree - considering the fact that Foreman faught better fighters, bigger punchers, and had a longer career and was still stopped a lesser amount of times than Louis. Plus, the one time Foreman did get stopped was largely due to exaustion, rather than purely his chin.

Foreman had the chin to rush out to the middle of the ring and be unafraid to slug and bomb out Joe Frazier. Louis did not.
I think Foreman definitely has a better chin that Louis, but I think Louis getting knocked down often in his career has more to do with a shakey defense than his chin. Louis wasn't hard to hit, and sometimes he would just get caught off balance. As a matter of fact, his fight with Galento is a perfect example of that.
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Old 07-08-2007, 03:11 PM   #32
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Default Re: Frazier Nearly Destoryed Ali -

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Originally Posted by RAMPAGE0017
[Only registered and activated users can see links. ] A foot off the canvas? Let's not go too overboard.
It takes serious power to do that.

Quote:
There's more to offense than knockout power.
The point is that Louis had the whole package. Power, speed, faultless execution, delivery, accuracy. There is no atribute that he lacked as an ofensive fighter and that is what makes him uneique.
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Old 07-08-2007, 03:16 PM   #33
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Default Re: Frazier Nearly Destoryed Ali -

[quote]
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Originally Posted by miamite
I would have to disagree - considering the fact that Foreman fought better fighters, bigger punchers, and had a longer career and was still stopped a lesser amount of times than Louis.
Only a verry low percentage of Foremans fights were against ranked contenders compared to Louis.

Foreman fought better fighters?

He fought two better fighters but apart from that the average quality of his opponents was abysmal.

Quote:
Plus, the one time Foreman did get stopped was largely due to exaustion, rather than purely his chin.
Remember I am not saying that Louis had a better chin I am sying that he might have been harder to stop taking into acount recuperative powers and stamina.

Quote:
Foreman had the chin to rush out to the middle of the ring and be unafraid to slug and bomb out Joe Frazier. Louis did not.
Louis was no shrinking violet when it came to taking big punches. Against Max Baer for example he was prepared to take a few to land his own.
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Old 07-08-2007, 03:21 PM   #34
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Default Re: Frazier Nearly Destoryed Ali -

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Originally Posted by RAMPAGE0017
I think Foreman definitely has a better chin that Louis, but I think Louis getting knocked down often in his career has more to do with a shakey defense than his chin.
Perhaps it has something to do with the huge volume of ranked oponents he fought during his career.

The fact is that no heavyweight champion even aproaches Louis in terms of sheer number of fights against ranked oponents except Muhamad Ali.
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Old 07-08-2007, 03:36 PM   #35
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Default Re: Frazier Nearly Destoryed Ali -

Joe Frazier’s limitation is all he had was that left hook, which was fine against a retreating Ali at whom he could swing to his heart’s content. But mid-range against a two-fisted dynamite puncher like Louis, with that chin sticking out, spells disaster for Frazier. I see Louis’ accurate power punches denting Frazier’s head much too often for a TKO win inside 10.

To the thread’s point, Frazier would bring out the best in Louis, who had the basics and power to exploit Frazier’s bull rushes. Louis would prove he could turn back a dangerous, determined left hooker thanks to his polished skills.
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Old 07-08-2007, 04:13 PM   #36
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Default Re: Frazier Nearly Destoryed Ali -

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To the threadís point, Frazier would bring out the best in Louis, who had the basics and power to exploit Frazierís bull rushes. Louis would prove he could turn back a dangerous, determined left hooker thanks to his polished skills.
"Joe Louis told me that I would beat Joe Frazier and he told me exactly how"

George Foreman
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Old 07-08-2007, 05:30 PM   #37
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Default Re: Frazier Nearly Destoryed Ali -

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Originally Posted by janitor
Perhaps it has something to do with the huge volume of ranked oponents he fought during his career.

The fact is that no heavyweight champion even aproaches Louis in terms of sheer number of fights against ranked oponents except Muhamad Ali.

I think it has more to do with a shakey defense.

And if Tony Galento was ever ranked then that doesn't say too much about the level of opposition during Louis' reign.
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Old 07-08-2007, 06:01 PM   #38
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Default Re: Frazier Nearly Destoryed Ali -

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I think that Foreman did have the better pure chin of the two but ironicaly Joe Louis might have been harder to stop.

Louis had incredible recuperative powers. He could be wobled and dropped but then he would be dangerous again in five seconds.

Yes.

In fact I read a story today about Louis fighting the final two rounds v Schmeling whilst basically unconscious. I'd heard the same thing about Dempsey v Firpo, but this is the first time i'd heard this story.
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Old 07-08-2007, 06:04 PM   #39
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Default Re: Frazier Nearly Destoryed Ali -

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Originally Posted by NickHudson
On balance, Frazier by late attrition stoppage.

I'm quite surprised to see people picking Frazier, didn't expect that when I started the thread - i was more interested in seeing what people thought Frazier could bring from Louis on the way to defeat (maybe valiant).

For the record I think the great Frazier is exactly the type of fighter that Louis would eat alive, piece by piece.
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Old 07-08-2007, 06:28 PM   #40
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Default Re: Frazier Nearly Destoryed Ali -

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I think it has more to do with a shakey defense.
Erm. No.

You have to take facts into acount.

Louis fought more ranked heavyweights than anybody outside of Ali by a ratio of 2 to 1.

That has to be taken into consideration when talking about the number of times he was on the canvas.

Quote:
And if Tony Galento was ever ranked then that doesn't say too much about the level of opposition during Louis' reign.
Tony Galento had one of the hardest left hooks in history.

He would probably have knocked out Ken Norton for example.
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Old 07-08-2007, 06:34 PM   #41
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Default Re: Frazier Nearly Destoryed Ali -

[quote=janitor]
Quote:
Tony Galento had one of the hardest left hooks in history.

He would probably have knocked out Ken Norton for example.

A more proper analysis of that is " Tony Galento had one of the sloppiest left hooks in history ".
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