Boxing  

Forum Home Boxing Forum European British Classic Aussie MMA Training
Go Back   Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Classic Boxing Forum


Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-12-2012, 08:15 PM   #16
he grant
Historian/Film Maker
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 7,529
vCash: 1000
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

Quote:
Originally Posted by apollack View Post
I don't think Charles looked like anything fantastic against Louis. He was a very good boxer. He was a very good boxer when he fought Marciano as well, and he didn't do anything more or better against Louis than he did against Marciano. Difference was that Marciano was coming after him nonstop, forcing him to fight hard, whereas Louis jousted with him. Joe was 187 years old at that point, , so old Joe performed pretty well. Prime Louis does away with Charles.
Adam, either way your not building any sort of case for Marciano or Charles here ... Charles may have been in terrific shape for a 33 year old blow up light heavyweight with over 100 fights under his belt but he was not in his physical prime for the Marciano bouts ... in addition, Louis was a completely different match up from a style stand point than Rocky .. Joe was much bigger and still had a decent enough jab to bust up Charles quite a bit ... even though Ezzard won a lop sided decision many of the rounds , especially prior to the championship rounds were very competitive .. the point is that Charles was a great light heavy and a very good but not great heavyweight ...
he grant is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 03-12-2012, 08:22 PM   #17
he grant
Historian/Film Maker
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 7,529
vCash: 1000
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MURK20 View Post
I remember reading an interview in RING magazine with Ted Lowry, who had two close fights with Marciano where he said that he couldn't see Marciano beating a prime Charles or Moore.
Would love to see that article ...
he grant is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2012, 09:42 PM   #18
Dempsey1238
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,015
vCash: 1000
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

Quote:
Originally Posted by doug.ie View Post
dont forget - we havent actually seen all of the first fight with marciano....only 5 or 6 (i think) rounds were filmed....have i got that right ?
But you can listen blow by blow of the first first fight radio broadcast.

Gives you a pretty good ideal how things went down.

Charles rule the first 4 rounds, were Rocky put the gas on the pedel in round 5 and didnt slow down at all it seems.

Charles may have won 1 or 2 later rounds, but Marciano out work Charles.
Dempsey1238 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2012, 10:12 PM   #19
Vic-JofreBRASIL
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 8,697
vCash: 1166
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

Quote:
Originally Posted by McGrain View Post




Charles may have had his best chance in his LHW days. He sure could be quick on his feet back then, and his high energy style seems to have been rather frightening. He could have been trouble.
That would be my main reason to bet in prime Charles at least once in two fights against Rocky......his hand speed also would be a good factor...
Vic-JofreBRASIL is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2012, 10:18 PM   #20
DaveK
Vicious & Malicious
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 1,826
vCash: 1000
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

Quote:
Originally Posted by he grant View Post
Would love to see that article ...

I have it- I'll scan it to post it here....

It is interesting. Basically a nostalgic article featuring Lowry and Keene Simmons and they give their opinions of the Rock, also some personal stories.

Lowry does say that he couldn't fathom Rocky beating Louis in his prime, and he thought Charles and Moore would beat him too.

It's interesting that both picked Marciano over Tyson...
DaveK is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2012, 10:19 PM   #21
DaveK
Vicious & Malicious
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 1,826
vCash: 1000
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

And yes, I believe a younger, fresher version of Charles could have beaten Marciano, although Rocky couldn't be dismissed because of that fight changing/ending power.
DaveK is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2012, 10:40 PM   #22
Seamus
Undisputed Champion
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Lisboa, Portugal
Posts: 12,131
vCash: 1000
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

The Peoples Revolutionary Record Book has spoken.

Marciano 47-2... with many more fights to be reviewed.

We comrades suspect it will end in 38-11.

Morons Coadunare!
Seamus is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2012, 10:57 PM   #23
Hands of Iron
#MSE
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 7,356
vCash: 75
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seamus View Post
The Peoples Revolutionary Record Book has spoken.

Marciano 47-2... with many more fights to be reviewed.

We comrades suspect it will end in 38-11

Morons Coadunare!
The number of times he took on a fighter (eight total) amongst the top ten.
Hands of Iron is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2012, 01:01 AM   #24
Joe E
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Detroit,Mi.
Posts: 1,151
vCash: 1000
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

All other things being the same, the outcome would be the same.
Joe E is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2012, 10:38 AM   #25
The Mongoose
THROW SOME THUNDAAAH!!!!
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Washington D.C.
Posts: 8,535
vCash: 258
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

Charles rose to the occassion for the first Marciano fight. It is often thought of as one of his best performances. Difficult to top that. From the footage that's available we see Charles staying off the ropes and using some fantastic upper body movement to slip Rocky.

Maybe 10 lbs lighter and a few years younger, Charles might make it a closer fight or his lack of mass and HW experience could see him perform worse. Either way, he's not stopping Rocky and he's not keeping up with his punch output for 15 rounds.

Charles was not himself in the second Marciano fight. He put on bulk and went out looking for an early knockout because he said he had no chance of repeating his first performance. He got badly hurt early by a clubbing right and lost almost every round.
The Mongoose is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2012, 10:42 AM   #26
RockyJim
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,386
vCash: 1000
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

I wouldn't bet against Marciano...
RockyJim is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2012, 11:40 AM   #27
kingfisher3
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: south london
Posts: 684
vCash: 500
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

some intelligent points, i am with above. marciano may be a short outsider but i aint betting against that fighting spirit and fitness. he is certainley troubled by the handspeed early but charles has a lot to do to stay fresh and quick past the tenth.
kingfisher3 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2012, 11:55 AM   #28
mr. magoo
Undisputed Champion
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Chicago, Illinois USA
Posts: 13,414
vCash: 1000
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

Only way to answer the question would be if there were some accurate measure of how far Charles had slipped by the time of the Marciano fight, if even at all. I think he was around 32 years of age for the first fight, and following his two bouts with Rocky began fading fast, losing many bouts.
mr. magoo is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2012, 12:03 PM   #29
Hookie
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Chambersburg, PA
Posts: 2,459
vCash: 500
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

Quote:
Originally Posted by apollack View Post
I think Charles was in fantastic shape for both fights, so I don't think he performs any differently.
Charles was past prime but was well prepared for the fight. He trained hard and really wanted to win. He gave it everything he had in both fights. These were Charles' 98th and 99th pro fights... his 11th and 12th loss. He went just 10-13 after facing Marciano twice.

Prime Charles? I'll take Charles by close decision. Younger versions of Walcott and Moore vs. Marciano? I'll still take Marciano.
Hookie is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2012, 12:17 PM   #30
cuchulain
Undisputed Champion
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Muirthemne
Posts: 10,500
vCash: 1000
Default Re: How would a prime Charles have fared against Marciano?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
I think Rocky deserved the first on points and his ko in the rematch is fairly emphatic imo.

However, given that you think Charles beat him in the first...

Are you sure that's what Seamus thinks ?
cuchulain is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Reply

Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Classic Boxing Forum

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump





All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:50 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Boxing News 24 Forum 2013