Muhammad Ali vs. Duane Bobick (Signed, Sealed, But Not Delivered)

[Senor Pepe']

Part I

After Muhammad Ali was awarded the decision victory over Ken Norton at Yankee Stadium in September 1976,
he took a much needed vacation, overseas to Europe.

In October of 1976, while in Istanbul, Turkey, Muhammad Ali announced his temporary
retirement from boxing.

At the same time, Teddy Brenner, President and Matchmaker of MSGB
(Madison Square Garden Boxing) were attemting to stage a bout between the
then unbeaten 'White Hope' Duane Bobick and the champion.

Madison Square Garden was attemting to get an agreement and signed contracts to stage a fight
in February 1977 at the famed arena.

In the meantime, Teddy Brenner was also in contact with Bob Biron, Ken Norton's manager in
San Diego, California.
Brenner was hoping that if the Ali vs. Bobick championship bout fell through,
Norton would sign on to fight Bobick for the vacant championship.

[Stevie G]

Originally Posted by Senor Pepe'

Part I

After Muhammad Ali was awarded the decision victory over Ken Norton at Yankee Stadium in September 1976,
he took a much needed vacation, overseas to Europe.

In October of 1976, while in Istanbul, Turkey, Muhammad Ali announced his temporary
retirement from boxing.

At the same time, Teddy Brenner and MSG (Madison Square Garden)
were attemting to stage a bout between then unbeaten 'White Hope'
Duane Bobick and the champion.

Madison Square Garden was attemting to get an agreement and signed contracts to stage a fight
in early-March at the famed arena.

In the meantime, Teddy Brenner was also in contact with Ken Norton,
hoping that if the Ali vs. Bobick championship bout fell through,
Norton would sign on to fight Bobick for the vacant championship.

I remember this magazine and article well.

[Stevie G]

Originally Posted by Senor Pepe'

Part I

After Muhammad Ali was awarded the decision victory over Ken Norton at Yankee Stadium in September 1976,
he took a much needed vacation, overseas to Europe.

In October of 1976, while in Istanbul, Turkey, Muhammad Ali announced his temporary
retirement from boxing.

At the same time, Teddy Brenner and MSG (Madison Square Garden)
were attemting to stage a bout between then unbeaten 'White Hope'
Duane Bobick and the champion.

Madison Square Garden was attemting to get an agreement and signed contracts to stage a fight
in early-March at the famed arena.

In the meantime, Teddy Brenner was also in contact with Ken Norton,
hoping that if the Ali vs. Bobick championship bout fell through,
Norton would sign on to fight Bobick for the vacant championship.

It's good for Bobick that he did n't fight any more of the elite fighters.

[Senor Pepe']

3-days later in Istanbul, Muhammad Ali again changed his mind, and announced
that he would fight the winner of a Ken Norton - George Foreman bout.

Ali was convinced that he could not beat Ken Norton anymore, but was
sure he could out-wit Big George again.

Muhammad Ali figured that Big George would have no trouble in flattening Ken Norton
again, moving Kenny out of the way.

Ali was sure a bout with Big George in Houston, Texas, would be the biggest Superfight
in boxing history, and it would take place sometime in 1977.

But, getting Ken Norton to agree to fight Foreman would not be an easy task.

As for Duane Bobick, Muhammad Ali was getting mixed messages about just how good
the undefeated former amateur star was. If the money wasn't right, Ali would not take the bout.

In the meantime, Teddy Brenner (Madison Square Garden Boxing)
was continuing to work on the Ken Norton vs. Duane Bobick fight. Brenner and Bobick's manager
Eddie Futch went out to the west coast in early-November to start the secondary negotiations
with Ken Norton and his manager Bob Biron.

While there, Kenny agreed to $500,000 for his fight purse, but he wanted other assurances from Brenner
before signing the contract to fight Bobick. Bobick on the other hand, was just a fighter waiting
for an opportunity, and his management team was trying to do their best to get him a shot at the
Heavyweight Championship without going through a litany of contenders.

If Ali had agreed to fight Bobick in February 1977 at Madison Square Garden, Duane would have
received $1,200,000. For the Ken Norton fight, Bobick was to get only $250,000 plus limited expenses.
But, the big prize would be a potential fight with Muhammad Ali.

[Senor Pepe']

In mid-November (November 16, 1976) the negotiations for the
Ken Norton vs. Duane Bobick fight in New York hit an impasse.

With the negotiations stalled, Teddy Brenner contacted Herbert Muhammad,
and said he could arrange for an Ali versus Duane Bobick fight. After some preliminary talks,
a verbal agreement and tentative date was set.

On November 24, 1976, Teddy Brenner flew into Houston, Texas, where Muhammad
Ali was staying. Brenner brought contracts for Muhammad Ali to sign, plus
a $125,000 check from Madison Square Garden Boxing for training expenses.

An agreement with signed documents stated that the fight would take place between
February 1 and February 28, 1977.

Teddy Brenner left Houston thinking he had a Championship Fight lined up, only to
find out a few days later on November 29th, that Muhammad Ali had a press
conference, stating that he would not fight anymore, because he was tired.

With that statement, Brenner quickly moved back to a Norton vs. Bobick venue,
hoping that he could make that for the vacant Heavyweight Championship.

[kenmore]

The Ali-Bobick fight would have been the best possible thing to happen for Duane. Ali was shot by 1977. If Evangelista could last the distance against Ali, Bobick would have done better. I think Ali would have beaten Bobick, but Duane would likely last 15 rounds and make a nice fight out of it. He would have emerged from the fight with an enhanced reputation.

[Senor Pepe']

Originally Posted by kenmore

The Ali-Bobick fight would have been the best possible thing to happen for Duane. Ali was shot by 1977. If Evangelista could last the distance against Ali, Bobick would have done better. I think Ali would have beaten Bobick, but Duane would likely last 15 rounds and make a nice fight out of it. He would have emerged from the fight with an enhanced reputation.

Yes, it would have.

Some articles stated that Muhammad Ali was worried about Duane Bobick's
style of pressure and wearing down opponents. Bobick fought inside, not outside where Muhammad Ali could dominate.

And Bobick did not show that he had any signs of stamina problems.

[kenmore]

Originally Posted by Senor Pepe'

Some articles stated that Muhammad Ali was worried about Duane Bobick's
style of pressure and wearing down opponents. Bobick fought inside, not outside where Muhammad Ali could dominate.

A lot of what was written in those magazines was just crap though. As a kid, I read every single one of them: World/International Boxing, Boxing Illustrated, and Ring Magazine. I swear, some of the writers just didn't know what the hell to say, so they wrote anything in order to make deadline.

I don't believe for one single second that Bobick could have forced his way inside against Ali...even against the faded 1977 Ali. Ali would have been able to keep the fight in center ring for much of the bout.

But Bobick probably would have finished on his feet, in his first really serious fight. The world would have considered Bobick "legit" for this reason...at least until he moved on to face to his first serious puncher.

[Senor Pepe']

kenmore,

Probably just publicity stuff, to help build interest in the fight.

Can't see Bobick winning, but can clearly see him going the distance.

But even Angelo Dundee commented on Bobicks' effectiveness in wearing down
fighters, and ability to take a punch.

On the other hand, I'm sure you could see Duane Bobick stopping Alfredo Evangilista in 1977, while the Spaniard (via Uruguay) went the distance with Muhammad Ali.

[Danmann]

I'm no Ali fan, find him to be most overrated boxer in history. Bobick though, he was not deserving contender by any means. He had best days as amateur, he showed little as a pro. He ko'd Holmes and lyle in amateurs, as pro was a stiff. I an't see him beating even an old Ali, he was just too slow, incapable.

[ETM]

Originally Posted by Danmann

I'm no Ali fan, find him to be most overrated boxer in history. .

Why the most overated?

[Stevie G]

Originally Posted by Danmann

I'm no Ali fan, find him to be most overrated boxer in history. Bobick though, he was not deserving contender by any means. He had best days as amateur, he showed little as a pro. He ko'd Holmes and lyle in amateurs, as pro was a stiff. I an't see him beating even an old Ali, he was just too slow, incapable.

How many previous heavyweight champions do you rate above Ali ?

[Senor Pepe']

More on the Muhammad Ali vs. Duane Bobick Championship Fight

In early December it was apparent that the Muhammad Ali vs. Duane Bobick fight
would not go on.

Teddy Brenner moved quickly to get the Ken Norton vs. Ken Norton signed, and
sealed for a late-February or early-March open date at Madison Square Garden.

While Ken Norton wanted his assurances, Eddie Futch, Bobick's manager just wanted
anybody to get in the ring with Duane, as long as his name wasn't George Foreman.

Futch was convinced that Ken Norton was on his way down, and prime for an upset.
As Eddie was not impressed with the way Norton fought versus a faded Muhammad Ali.

On December 7, 1976, Madison Square Garden Boxing announced that the Norton vs. Bobick
fight was signed, sealed and ready to go.

Muhammad Ali, at the request of Madison Square Gardens publicity director, agreed to participate in
a telephonic press conference, where he simulataneously announced his retirement and would
help promote the Norton - Bobick contest.

[Stevie G]

Originally Posted by kenmore

The Ali-Bobick fight would have been the best possible thing to happen for Duane. Ali was shot by 1977. If Evangelista could last the distance against Ali, Bobick would have done better. I think Ali would have beaten Bobick, but Duane would likely last 15 rounds and make a nice fight out of it. He would have emerged from the fight with an enhanced reputation.

Even though,by 1977,Ali was nowhere near the fighter that he'd been three years previously when he regained the title from George Foreman,I'd still take him to stop Bobick.

Even though Bobick was a lot better than Alfredo Evangelista,Ali would have been fired up more than he was for the Spaniard. The Frazier/Futch connection would have been the spur. "I whupped Joe Frazier and now I'll whup his boy" kind of thing.

[Senor Pepe']

Stevie,,,,,,,

Muhammad Ali wasn't going to stop anybody (that had decent stamina) after 1976.

Duane Bobick, 'the most criticized fighter in the history of boxing' would have been
just as 'fired up'.

One thing in Duane's favor, he didn't have to worry about a 'big right hand' hurting him.