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Old 03-22-2012, 07:19 PM   #31
Vano-Irons
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Default Re: New Harry Greb picture?

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The problem with Fitz ahead of Duran is that Fitz was unquestionably the best middleweight and heavyweight in the world, but also, for a brief spell, the best light-heavyweight in the world, way, way past prime, I mean so old he doesn't even belong in the ring at that point. NP JD is probably the popular choice for p4p #1 all time up until he met Fitz - and Fitz destroyed him. I mean Fitz absolutely buried him. I mean, that fight wasn't competitive at all. It was an embarrassment, a one-sided thrashing so complete as to indicate a wide gulf in class. Fitz out-boxed the greatest pure-boxer to have lived up until that point without breaking sweat.

Furthermore, he is likely the best puncher ever to have drawn breath.

Duran's win over Leonard is astonishing, it's often forgotten how astonishing, but it is posisble that, allowing for the manner of the victory, it wasn't as impressive as what Fitz did to NP JD. And I have to say, I think a one-punch KO victory over the world heavyweight champion by a former lightweight might be the single greatest victory in the history of the sport - I think there is clear daylight between Fitz and Duran, personally.
Dempsey was a little past his best tho was he not? That's not meant to take away from his victory, as it was truly a great great win, the greatest win of the era without a doubt (until Fitz knocked Corbett out that is)

Fitz was a tremendous fighter, no queation. Nothing like what he done will ever be carried out again. No chance.

But, for me, Duran is the greatest fighter we have a large collection of footage of. His blend of attack and defensive, body work and head shots, footwork and ring smarts, are all there to be seen. His victory over Ray (a great p4p fighter in his own right), may well be the greatest victory ever.

I think both Fitz and Duran deserve to be mentioned alongside each other in a bracket of fighters that stand out.
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Old 03-22-2012, 07:25 PM   #32
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Default Re: New Harry Greb picture?

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Dempsey was a little past his best tho was he not?
I think he was, though it wasn't seen that way by the majority at the time (Fitz was favoured though). It doesn't really matter though. How often do you see a p4p #1 and incumbent champion outclasssed? It hasn't happened since.

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But, for me, Duran is the greatest fighter we have a large collection of footage of. His blend of attack and defensive, body work and head shots, footwork and ring smarts, are all there to be seen. His victory over Ray (a great p4p fighter in his own right), may well be the greatest victory ever.
Comparing them for skill/head to head etc. is obviously frought with difficulty because we have snatches of Fitz competing under very different rules and that is all, but in a general sense, I don't see Duran running away with the eye-test in the way you do. I think he has plenty of company, and I'd include Whitaker, who inhabits the same division - which is to say, I don't think Duran is unequivocally the most skilled fighter ever to appear in his own division. I think it's a brave man who makes that call.

I do think the way he seams attack and defence together are as special as anything I've ever seen in that regard though, his instinct there was asonishing, his greatest strength in his prime.


As for the greatest victory of all time, as i've said, it's up there, but i'd take the one punch ko of a former lightweight over the reigning HW champion and put it a sliver above.
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Old 03-22-2012, 07:36 PM   #33
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Default Re: New Harry Greb picture?

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I think he was, though it wasn't seen that way by the majority at the time (Fitz was favoured though). It doesn't really matter though. How often do you see a p4p #1 and incumbent champion outclasssed? It hasn't happened since.



Comparing them for skill/head to head etc. is obviously frought with difficulty because we have snatches of Fitz competing under very different rules and that is all, but in a general sense, I don't see Duran running away with the eye-test in the way you do. I think he has plenty of company, and I'd include Whitaker, who inhabits the same division - which is to say, I don't think Duran is unequivocally the most skilled fighter ever to appear in his own division. I think it's a brave man who makes that call.

I do think the way he seams attack and defence together are as special as anything I've ever seen in that regard though, his instinct there was asonishing, his greatest strength in his prime.


As for the greatest victory of all time, as i've said, it's up there, but i'd take the one punch ko of a former lightweight over the reigning HW champion and put it a sliver above.



Whitaker also makes my top 15 last time I done one

I just felt Duran had more variety in his work, and seemed to master every side of boxing. If Pea had the power of Duran, who knows. The lightweight division is perhaps the most stacked division of all time. Duran, Pea, Ike, Gans, Benny, Welsh, Packey, Ortiz, Joe Brown, Battling Nelson, Beau Jack etc. Damn what a list of fighters
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Old 03-22-2012, 08:02 PM   #34
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Default Re: New Harry Greb picture?

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How old is he here?
Harry Greb was 31 years old in this hospital picture in 1925...Little did Greb know that he would be dead ONE YEAR later from an operation to help a nasal problem as a result of an auto accldent [in hospital photo] or to
reconstruct some eye problems [blind in one eye]. Irrespective , Greb's brave heart gave out due to anesthesia, complications...
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Old 03-23-2012, 10:13 AM   #35
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Default Re: New Harry Greb picture?

Burt, are you confirming this picture was indeed taken in 1925?
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Old 03-23-2012, 10:31 AM   #36
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Burt, are you confirming this picture was indeed taken in 1925?
V,I have never seen this picture before, but I DO KNOW this is a photo of
Harry Greb. In 1925 Greb who lived life to the hilt,was in a severe auto accident,and suffered a nose injury restricting his breathing..Even in the hospital Harry Greb was vain about his looks as shown with his slicked back hair...Little did he know that one year later he would be dead by a failed operation possibly related to this auto accident...Such is fate !
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Old 03-23-2012, 01:53 PM   #37
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Default Re: New Harry Greb picture?

Thanks Burt.
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Old 03-23-2012, 02:10 PM   #38
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Default Re: New Harry Greb picture?

Harry had alotta car wrecks AND an early attempt at cosmetic surgery presented to the public as recovering from a car wreck.
Yes Gene Tunney was on the money when he said, Greb was curiously sensitive in pride, oddly vain.
This pic of Harry has definitely seen daylight before. It was in his Cleveland obits.
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