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Old 06-28-2012, 05:37 AM   #16
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

Nobody from 1987 to 1993.............. Ramirez got a gift in '87 overseas.......

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Old 06-28-2012, 07:22 AM   #17
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

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What does strength have to do with out-countering or 'out-skilling' anyone?
Sweet Pea would be afraid to get too close to Emile,,,,,,,

meaning, he would be out-skilled 'mentally'.
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Old 06-28-2012, 08:07 AM   #18
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

Are we selling Floyd Mayweather short?

He's a turd (matter of fact Pernell was a ****y shit also) but skill wise he belongs with Whitaker and his counter punching abilities are second to none.

As a matter of fact I'd almost go as far to say he's as good defesively as Pernell. if not better. At 35 he's had barely a legit KD and up until the Cotto fight hadn't ever been busted up in a fight. Mayweather's ability to avoid and counter an opponents blows with shoulder rolls and subtley of head movement (and unerring punch accuracy) is quite magnificent.

Whitaker-Floyd would really be a fight for the connoisseur's but likely to bore the shit out of everyone else and would be a very close match imo.
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Old 06-28-2012, 08:13 AM   #19
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

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Are we selling Floyd Mayweather short?

He's a turd (matter of fact Pernell was a ****y shit also) but skill wise he belongs with Whitaker and his counter punching abilities are second to none.

As a matter of fact I'd almost go as far to say he's as good defesively as Pernell. if not better. At 35 he's had barely a legit KD and up until the Cotto fight hadn't ever been busted up in a fight. Mayweather's ability to avoid and counter an opponents blows with shoulder rolls and subtley of head movement (and unerring punch accuracy) is quite magnificent.

Whitaker-Floyd would really be a fight for the connoisseur's but likely to bore the shit out of everyone else and would be a very close match imo.
If Floyd is in the fight, it would be due more to speed than skill. He is clearly not as skilled as Whitaker.
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Old 06-28-2012, 08:30 AM   #20
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

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If Floyd is in the fight, it would be due more to speed than skill. He is clearly not as skilled as Whitaker.
Clearly?

I'll agree that Floyd doesn't have that innate radar that Pernell had to avoid incoming punches plus his footwork isn't nearly as good as Whitakers either but that low left hand, shoulder roll is a hard skill to execute for as long as Floyd has and I don't think I've seen anyone do it as successfully as Mayweather either. Plus his ability to counter off the roll is beautiful to watch (it even made his mismatch with Gatti worth a look).

Floyd has very good speed but it isn't his greatest strength it's his ability to combine his defense with a deadly accurate offense with sets him apart from the pack and likely would make a fight between them pretty close (given that Pernell possessed a much higher workrate).

Pernell and Floyd are both absolute masters of their craft all be it employing differing and unique styles but both are very,very highly skilled.
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Old 06-28-2012, 08:54 AM   #21
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

Hurtado, but that was a past prime Whitaker and it was Hurtado's height/range/speed

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Originally Posted by sweet_scientist View Post
If Floyd is in the fight, it would be due more to speed than skill. He is clearly not as skilled as Whitaker.
Faster plus longer arms
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Old 06-28-2012, 12:08 PM   #22
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

I was waiting for PP to say Floyd or for anybody to asy Floyd... I'm honestly surprised it took this long... I don't agree, but still surprised.
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Old 06-28-2012, 12:41 PM   #23
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

Floyd's one of the guys I'd expect to get the better of Pea on the outside. He'd lose due to Whitaker's superior all-around game, but Floyd's a tad quicker, has longer arms, and a great right hand to catch Pea with if they were to just try and out-counter/out-potshot each other at a distance.
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Old 06-28-2012, 03:46 PM   #24
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

Wilfred Benitez,,,,,,,

Could out counter-punch Sweet Pea, either at 140 lbs. or 147 lbs.

Would be one of the 'greatest tactical bouts'.
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Old 06-28-2012, 05:43 PM   #25
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

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Originally Posted by Senor Pepe' View Post
Sweet Pea would be afraid to get too close to Emile,,,,,,,

meaning, he would be out-skilled 'mentally'.
I don't know what this means.
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Old 06-28-2012, 05:48 PM   #26
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

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I don't know what this means.
Maybe I should have said.......'Out-witted'.

To get the better of, by being more intelligent.

Using your brain is a skill too.

Emile would have 'feinted' Sweet Pea into defeat.
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Old 06-28-2012, 07:00 PM   #27
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

Maybe Kid Chocolate.

I only see SRL, SRR, Benitez, Hearns, Leonard, Pep,etc. as clear chances to do this though.
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Old 06-28-2012, 07:13 PM   #28
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

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Originally Posted by Senor Pepe' View Post
Maybe I should have said.......'Out-witted'.

To get the better of, by being more intelligent.

Using your brain is a skill too.

Emile would have 'feinted' Sweet Pea into defeat.
Emile Griffith, when "on" was one smart cookie..as Gypsy Joe Harris and Dick Tiger found out. I think he'd be too strong for the Pea also. Griffith was erratic, but he was extremely intelliget.
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Old 06-29-2012, 11:44 AM   #29
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

Emile Griffith is no Pea... and it really isn't that close.
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Old 06-29-2012, 11:46 AM   #30
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Default Re: What fighter would out counter or out skill Whitaker

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Originally Posted by Senor Pepe' View Post
Sweet Pea would be afraid to get too close to Emile,,,,,,,

meaning, he would be out-skilled 'mentally'.
As opposed to physically, where he stands a good chance to overwhelm Emile.
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