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Old 08-04-2012, 01:52 PM   #1
Kittikasem
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Default Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

Been watching some videos of Jones this week.

His GnP is absolutely lethal.

Fast, vicious, accurate, varied, relentless.

Those elbows are insane.

Against Rua, he was facing a very tough, very clever, very experienced fighter, and he smashed him to bits on the ground.

Against Machida, he was getting outslicked and outstruck on the feet until he got a takedown, and all it took was one elbow to the head to cut Machida and change the fight.

I think Bones will prove to be the most deadly exponent of GnP ever.

Can you guys think of anyone better at this?
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Old 08-04-2012, 02:03 PM   #2
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

I think Fedor's punches on the mat were equally insane too, especially combined with his later aptitude at submissions and his ability to roll with the guy on the bottom to maintain position and just keep punching has to be up there

Hughes to control and gnp was very good. Not as concussive as Fedor's punches or as lethal JJ's eblows, Matt was just relentless. Hughes had the rare ability for a wrestler around that time to pass guard and once he got into side control he was brutal in his relentlessness

JJ, Hughes and Fedor were all great on the mat, could tap you and strike. Probably the top 3 offensive fighters on the ground for me
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Old 08-04-2012, 02:12 PM   #3
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

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I think Fedor's punches on the mat were equally insane too, especially combined with his later aptitude at submissions and his ability to roll with the guy on the bottom to maintain position and just keep punching has to be up there

Hughes to control and gnp was very good. Not as concussive as Fedor's punches or as lethal JJ's eblows, Matt was just relentless. Hughes had the rare ability for a wrestler around that time to pass guard and once he got into side control he was brutal in his relentlessness

JJ, Hughes and Fedor were all great on the mat, could tap you and strike. Probably the top 3 offensive fighters on the ground for me
Great post.

But where would Sonnen come in that list?
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Old 08-04-2012, 02:13 PM   #4
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

Who?
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Old 08-04-2012, 02:15 PM   #5
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

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Who?
The American Gangster/Limp-Wristed Fly-Swatter.
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Old 08-04-2012, 02:59 PM   #6
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

Geez what a fail thread. JJ best GnP? Honestly i despair for MMA...
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Old 08-04-2012, 03:04 PM   #7
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

I guess people forgot all about Mark Kerr, Coleman and all the other wrestlers from some years ago
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Old 08-04-2012, 03:14 PM   #8
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

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I guess people forgot all about Mark Kerr, Coleman and all the other wrestlers from some years ago
Coleman Kerr and Fedor were dam near decapitating dudes with their GnP. **** it even prime Tito's GnP is/was better than Jon Jones.
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Old 08-04-2012, 03:24 PM   #9
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

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Coleman Kerr and Fedor were dam near decapitating dudes with their GnP. **** it even prime Tito's GnP is/was better than Jon Jones.
Come on Scurla, that's nonsense.

Coleman and Kerr were uncultured clubbers.

Tito's GnP would never be able to land on and obliterate a guy of Shogun's calibre the way that Jones's did.

I'm not a fan of Jones either, but his elbows on the deck are fantastic, and his groundwork so often makes the difference vs fighters better than the guys that Coleman, Kerr and Tito were beating.

Can you post me a video where these guys clinically brutalized anyone as good on the ground as Shogun? The sequence where Jones beat Rua up on the mat which led to Shogun's final retreat and the end of the fight was extremely evil GnP.
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Old 08-04-2012, 03:31 PM   #10
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

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Come on Scurla, that's nonsense.

Coleman and Kerr were uncultured clubbers.

Tito's GnP would never be able to land on and obliterate a guy of Shogun's calibre the way that Jones's did.

I'm not a fan of Jones either, but his elbows on the deck are fantastic, and his groundwork so often makes the difference vs fighters better than the guys that Coleman, Kerr and Tito were beating.

Can you post me a video where these guys clinically brutalized anyone as good on the ground as Shogun? The sequence where Jones beat Rua up on the mat which led to Shogun's final retreat and the end of the fight was extremely evil GnP.
It's not nonsense. Slice it dice it which ever way you want it. The reality is JJ is NOT known for his GnP. And neither is his GnP up their with the likes of Kerr Fedor etc who when they started punching you in the face on the mat invariably had stoppage a few seconds later against top ranked opposition.
You on the other hand seem quite enamoured by Jones victory over a clearly shot and pass prime Shogun. Why on Earth you're then comparing that with Tito head to head i haven't got a clue.
The fact Jones was unable to stop Shogun speaks more about Jones GnP head to head with guys like Fedor et al, as opposed to Shoguns toughness.

Bottom line is Tito was infamous and well renowned in the MMA world at that time for his GnP. In his super fight with Ken the first time that same GnP stopped Ken in one of the most brutal fights and losses Ken had ever been on the end of. Your memorys too short. Go and watch Tito's early fights and watch what he did to guys in his guard. Likewise do the same with Fedor, Coleman Kerr and Vovchancyn.
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Old 08-04-2012, 03:40 PM   #11
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

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It's not nonsense. Slice it dice it which ever way you want it. The reality is JJ is NOT known for his GnP. And neither is his GnP up their with the likes of Kerr Fedor etc who when they started punching you in the face on the mat invariably had stoppage a few seconds later against top ranked opposition.
You on the other hand seem quite enamoured by Jones victory over a clearly shot and pass prime Shogun. Why on Earth you're then comparing that with Tito head to head i haven't got a clue.
The fact Jones was unable to stop Shogun speaks more about Jones GnP head to head with guys like Fedor et al, as opposed to Shoguns toughness.

Bottom line is Tito was infamous and well renowned in the MMA world at that time for his GnP. In his super fight with Ken the first time that same GnP stopped Ken in one of the most brutal fights and losses Ken had ever been on the end of. Your memorys too short. Go and watch Tito's early fights and watch what he did to guys in his guard. Likewise do the same with Fedor, Coleman Kerr and Vovchancyn.
You're fixating way too much on reputations, and what people may or may not have thought about someones' style. Jones has a multi-faceted style, so his GnP does not garner the same attention as someone as one-dimensional as Tito, but why does that mean Tito's is better? Tito may have relied on his more, but that's because he was not as varied or as well-rounded as Jones, it doesn't in any way mean that Tito's was better.

Shamrock? Jones would put him in a bodybag with a flick of his wrist on the ground. This is silly.
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Old 08-04-2012, 03:48 PM   #12
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

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Originally Posted by Kittikasem View Post
You're fixating way too much on reputations, and what people may or may not have thought about someones' style. Jones has a multi-faceted style, so his GnP does not garner the same attention as someone as one-dimensional as Tito, but why does that mean Tito's is better? Tito may have relied on his more, but that's because he was not as varied or as well-rounded as Jones, it doesn't in any way mean that Tito's was better.

Shamrock? Jones would put him in a bodybag with a flick of his wrist on the ground. This is silly.
No i'm not. My opinion is based on what i saw in those mens fights. GnP is GnP which ever way you want to paint it. If Jones GnP was that good people would be talking about it the same way we talked about Fedor's. Therefore your comparison in my eyes is completely invalid.
Again Tito finished more of his fights with soild GnP. Laugh at it all you want but Ken Tito WAS a super fight and Ken was giving the worst beating of his life. If you was watching MMA circa 2002/3 you'd know that and would't be making light of it just to make a semantic and specious point about what you perceive to be a more varied GnP.
When Jones does what Vovchancyn did to Inoue who he left in a hospital for 3 months with a swollen brain let me know. As the last i checked Shogun survived 5 rounds with your apparent 'flick of the wrist' on the ground.
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Old 08-04-2012, 03:55 PM   #13
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

I don't think Jones has the best GnP due to the fact that the majority of the shots he lands are due to his opponents not being able to adjust to having such a long fighter in their guard. I say this with the experience of having been in that position myself. That said - once people begin to adjust to the mix of Jones' size and skill - I'd like to see how he performs then.
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Old 08-04-2012, 04:00 PM   #14
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

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I don't think Jones has the best GnP due to the fact that the majority of the shots he lands are due to his opponents not being able to adjust to having such a long fighter in their guard. I say this with the experience of having been in that position myself. That said - once people begin to adjust to the mix of Jones' size and skill - I'd like to see how he performs then.
He enjoys plenty of physical advantages at 205. Advantages that too many fans are tripping and falling over themselves for in their attempts to offer gushing praise. Up at heavy everyone of those physical advantages goes away. And i'm dam certain he'd start to look very pedestrian.
The ability to throw a few elbows does NOT constitute Ground and Pound. Certainly not when you think of the fighters that automatically come to mind when discussing GnP.
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Old 08-04-2012, 04:06 PM   #15
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Default Re: Does Jon Jones have the best GnP in MMA history?

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He enjoys plenty of physical advantages at 205. Advantages that too many fans are tripping an falling over themselves for. Up at heavy everyone of those physical advantages goes away. And i'm dam certain he'd start to look very pedestrian.
The ability to throw a few elbows does NOT constitute Ground and Pound. Certainly not when you think of the fighters that automatically come to mind when discussing GnP.
You always go against the grain Scurla Although I think you are correct in this instance. I don't know if I'd go so far as to say he'd look pedestrian but it seems to me(I don't compete in MMA so I could be wrong) that a lot of his success comes with his physical advantages. He wouldn't get away with as much at HW where guys would be bigger than him.

At the same time though, reach doesn't just make a good fighter. I mean look at Stefan Struve. Jones obviously is a great fighter and has bteean a lot of great fighters like Shogun, Rampage, Machida and Evans
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