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Old 07-27-2012, 03:40 PM   #601
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Default Re: ESB ATGs Muay Thai / KickBoxing fighters Thread

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Originally Posted by stormy0 View Post
Was never a huge fan of Somluck's style overall, but an INCREDIBLE fighter. Him and Samart are probably the most relaxed nak muay I've seen thus far. Just born for the ring.

What's up with Jockygym putting out so many great fighters with slick styles in the past, and why not so much anymore? Off the top of my head...Somluck, Saenchai, Lerdsila, Silapathai?

There are others, but the four above stand out immensely against a backdrop of incredible fighters and competition. I know Dany Bill trained out of there as well and he was a great fighter also.
I think "relaxed" really does sum up Somluck and Samart. They were just are so comfortable in there, I think you see that kind of relaxedness with Seanchai too although it seems abit stifled with his body build. True naturals who probably find it harder to sit still than fight.

Jocky gym is one of many like it, perennial gyms with good pedigree that have good management and money behind them maybe, Police maybe Army, maybe big gangsters or promoting families that have been in boxing for years. Like the wild card or the Kronk in boxing they have highs and lows. In the 90s it was on a high so could afford to buy up quality fighters and if you have a gym like that other quality fighters want to train there like Danny Bill. Gyms in Thailand are like any, if a few good champions train there the gym's hot if the champs move on or the head trainer dies or gets assassinated (Sor Thainikul) it can spell the end of just a deep lull. Look at all the great fighters now, there aren't many with gym names synonymous with the 90s most are fresh gyms or new sponsors. Just highs and lows, what would the wildcard be without Manny Amir and JCC jr?

Jocky gym a great gym yes, but there were others too. I'm not convinced it was so much head & shoulders above all the others. Remember, in terms of the current 90s MT archive available to the west on mainly YouTube is a fragment of what was really going on, many great fighters, gym names and promotions are not there, they are rotting on VDOs in Thailand. Point is the internet history that is getting reworked everyday on forums like this is largely based on what people can see on the internet now and what is volunteered by the few westerners that remember.

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Originally Posted by Flea Man View Post
BoranBKK: could you give me any insight into Khamsing's decision to go to the Olympics? Where was he at in his career going into it???

I know the story is "I couldn't get any big fights" but I think we've addressed that before. Just seems odd that he was chosen, although if I'm not wrong he was already a big star (in Muay Thai terms) before going to Atlanta. Or at least highly respected.

Was he the top MT fighter at the time would you say?
Yep, Somluck was considered a top Muay Thai fighter at the time, just to get fights against guys like Boonlai you had to be top 10. Somluck as you know Flea is his own worst enemy or rather his mouth is, he’s a loose cannon and always has been. Even very recently he got involved in a war or words with another army General who’s head of the national amateur boxing program by publicly saying the guy didn’t know what he was doing. He’s naturally a great fighter but he’s also a master of making enemies and picking fights to!

Pre converting to boxing his MT fight nickname was “Moh Amata” which basically translates as “Forever Boast” showing he was famous for boasting and causing mayhem with his mouth even back then. I don’t know this, but reading between the lines and knowing the way things work out there I reckon he pissed of too many of the wrong people too many times so those in control of the MT world slammed the door on him. Remember, his older brother Somrot Kamsing was an MT fighter who converted to being a top amateur boxer, so with the MT scene looking bleak for Somluck at the time it seems like a logical natural option that he convert possibly put to him by Somrot’s coaches and handlers via Somrot. But I reckon a few chats with the right people in BKK and it wouldn’t be too hard to get to the bottom of it, maybe stop by his gym on your next trip for a week or so. Sorry I can’t be of more help, but I never really thought about it before.

What a match up that would’ve been for the gold in 96 if Mayweather hadn’t been on the wrong side of a dodgy decision eh!

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Originally Posted by RJJFan View Post
My trainer told me that gyms today train their fighters to be more exciting in the ring, rather than build their skills.
This is something you hear a lot, but isn’t really true. Sure there is an emphasis towards certain techniques that are deemed to score highly, clinching and knees etc., but the guys are just as technical as they’ve ever been, Seanchai and Sam-A anyone?

What’s changed is that around the late 90s and early 2000s Premiership football really started to take hold in the country and become readily available to view, this pulled some spectators and more importantly their gambling money away from MT. MT exists solely for the gamblers hence guys post 2000 get paid less very often than guys a decade earlier in the 90s when the sport was at its high point in the 90s. As guys were getting paid less some of the more established names left and a new hungry crop appeared but the big names started to get younger and younger largely due to the liking of the gamblers who prefer the lighter, faster and more supple youngsters who lack the natural man power of their more thoughtful and calculating mature counterparts you’d see in the 90s. Less KOs and more faster back and forth styled bouts favoured the gamblers with more frenzied gambling action. That’s what’s changed, the guys are technically still the best in the world, they just favour certain techniques at the moment for puerly professional resons.

Last edited by boranbkk; 07-27-2012 at 08:45 PM.
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Old 07-28-2012, 07:58 AM   #602
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Default Re: ESB ATGs Muay Thai / KickBoxing fighters Thread

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Originally Posted by boranbkk View Post
I think "relaxed" really does sum up Somluck and Samart. They were just are so comfortable in there, I think you see that kind of relaxedness with Seanchai too although it seems abit stifled with his body build. True naturals who probably find it harder to sit still than fight.

Jocky gym is one of many like it, perennial gyms with good pedigree that have good management and money behind them maybe, Police maybe Army, maybe big gangsters or promoting families that have been in boxing for years. Like the wild card or the Kronk in boxing they have highs and lows. In the 90s it was on a high so could afford to buy up quality fighters and if you have a gym like that other quality fighters want to train there like Danny Bill. Gyms in Thailand are like any, if a few good champions train there the gym's hot if the champs move on or the head trainer dies or gets assassinated (Sor Thainikul) it can spell the end of just a deep lull. Look at all the great fighters now, there aren't many with gym names synonymous with the 90s most are fresh gyms or new sponsors. Just highs and lows, what would the wildcard be without Manny Amir and JCC jr?

Jocky gym a great gym yes, but there were others too. I'm not convinced it was so much head & shoulders above all the others. Remember, in terms of the current 90s MT archive available to the west on mainly YouTube is a fragment of what was really going on, many great fighters, gym names and promotions are not there, they are rotting on VDOs in Thailand. Point is the internet history that is getting reworked everyday on forums like this is largely based on what people can see on the internet now and what is volunteered by the few westerners that remember.


Yep, Somluck was considered a top Muay Thai fighter at the time, just to get fights against guys like Boonlai you had to be top 10. Somluck as you know Flea is his own worst enemy or rather his mouth is, he’s a loose cannon and always has been. Even very recently he got involved in a war or words with another army General who’s head of the national amateur boxing program by publicly saying the guy didn’t know what he was doing. He’s naturally a great fighter but he’s also a master of making enemies and picking fights to!

Pre converting to boxing his MT fight nickname was “Moh Amata” which basically translates as “Forever Boast” showing he was famous for boasting and causing mayhem with his mouth even back then. I don’t know this, but reading between the lines and knowing the way things work out there I reckon he pissed of too many of the wrong people too many times so those in control of the MT world slammed the door on him. Remember, his older brother Somrot Kamsing was an MT fighter who converted to being a top amateur boxer, so with the MT scene looking bleak for Somluck at the time it seems like a logical natural option that he convert possibly put to him by Somrot’s coaches and handlers via Somrot. But I reckon a few chats with the right people in BKK and it wouldn’t be too hard to get to the bottom of it, maybe stop by his gym on your next trip for a week or so. Sorry I can’t be of more help, but I never really thought about it before.

What a match up that would’ve been for the gold in 96 if Mayweather hadn’t been on the wrong side of a dodgy decision eh!



This is something you hear a lot, but isn’t really true. Sure there is an emphasis towards certain techniques that are deemed to score highly, clinching and knees etc., but the guys are just as technical as they’ve ever been, Seanchai and Sam-A anyone?

What’s changed is that around the late 90s and early 2000s Premiership football really started to take hold in the country and become readily available to view, this pulled some spectators and more importantly their gambling money away from MT. MT exists solely for the gamblers hence guys post 2000 get paid less very often than guys a decade earlier in the 90s when the sport was at its high point in the 90s. As guys were getting paid less some of the more established names left and a new hungry crop appeared but the big names started to get younger and younger largely due to the liking of the gamblers who prefer the lighter, faster and more supple youngsters who lack the natural man power of their more thoughtful and calculating mature counterparts you’d see in the 90s. Less KOs and more faster back and forth styled bouts favoured the gamblers with more frenzied gambling action. That’s what’s changed, the guys are technically still the best in the world, they just favour certain techniques at the moment for puerly professional resons.


Somrak pissing the wrong people off would help to explain why he never got a title shot... certainly a possibility.
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Old 07-28-2012, 01:12 PM   #603
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Default Re: ESB ATGs Muay Thai / KickBoxing fighters Thread

I love you! Writing a piece on his Gold for a series of 'Olympic Flashbacks' I'm doing, first one is up now, but not on here

I love this thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by boranbkk View Post
I think "relaxed" really does sum up Somluck and Samart. They were just are so comfortable in there, I think you see that kind of relaxedness with Seanchai too although it seems abit stifled with his body build. True naturals who probably find it harder to sit still than fight.

Jocky gym is one of many like it, perennial gyms with good pedigree that have good management and money behind them maybe, Police maybe Army, maybe big gangsters or promoting families that have been in boxing for years. Like the wild card or the Kronk in boxing they have highs and lows. In the 90s it was on a high so could afford to buy up quality fighters and if you have a gym like that other quality fighters want to train there like Danny Bill. Gyms in Thailand are like any, if a few good champions train there the gym's hot if the champs move on or the head trainer dies or gets assassinated (Sor Thainikul) it can spell the end of just a deep lull. Look at all the great fighters now, there aren't many with gym names synonymous with the 90s most are fresh gyms or new sponsors. Just highs and lows, what would the wildcard be without Manny Amir and JCC jr?

Jocky gym a great gym yes, but there were others too. I'm not convinced it was so much head & shoulders above all the others. Remember, in terms of the current 90s MT archive available to the west on mainly YouTube is a fragment of what was really going on, many great fighters, gym names and promotions are not there, they are rotting on VDOs in Thailand. Point is the internet history that is getting reworked everyday on forums like this is largely based on what people can see on the internet now and what is volunteered by the few westerners that remember.


Yep, Somluck was considered a top Muay Thai fighter at the time, just to get fights against guys like Boonlai you had to be top 10. Somluck as you know Flea is his own worst enemy or rather his mouth is, he’s a loose cannon and always has been. Even very recently he got involved in a war or words with another army General who’s head of the national amateur boxing program by publicly saying the guy didn’t know what he was doing. He’s naturally a great fighter but he’s also a master of making enemies and picking fights to!

Pre converting to boxing his MT fight nickname was “Moh Amata” which basically translates as “Forever Boast” showing he was famous for boasting and causing mayhem with his mouth even back then. I don’t know this, but reading between the lines and knowing the way things work out there I reckon he pissed of too many of the wrong people too many times so those in control of the MT world slammed the door on him. Remember, his older brother Somrot Kamsing was an MT fighter who converted to being a top amateur boxer, so with the MT scene looking bleak for Somluck at the time it seems like a logical natural option that he convert possibly put to him by Somrot’s coaches and handlers via Somrot. But I reckon a few chats with the right people in BKK and it wouldn’t be too hard to get to the bottom of it, maybe stop by his gym on your next trip for a week or so. Sorry I can’t be of more help, but I never really thought about it before.

What a match up that would’ve been for the gold in 96 if Mayweather hadn’t been on the wrong side of a dodgy decision eh!



This is something you hear a lot, but isn’t really true. Sure there is an emphasis towards certain techniques that are deemed to score highly, clinching and knees etc., but the guys are just as technical as they’ve ever been, Seanchai and Sam-A anyone?

What’s changed is that around the late 90s and early 2000s Premiership football really started to take hold in the country and become readily available to view, this pulled some spectators and more importantly their gambling money away from MT. MT exists solely for the gamblers hence guys post 2000 get paid less very often than guys a decade earlier in the 90s when the sport was at its high point in the 90s. As guys were getting paid less some of the more established names left and a new hungry crop appeared but the big names started to get younger and younger largely due to the liking of the gamblers who prefer the lighter, faster and more supple youngsters who lack the natural man power of their more thoughtful and calculating mature counterparts you’d see in the 90s. Less KOs and more faster back and forth styled bouts favoured the gamblers with more frenzied gambling action. That’s what’s changed, the guys are technically still the best in the world, they just favour certain techniques at the moment for puerly professional resons.
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Old 07-28-2012, 01:29 PM   #604
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Default Re: ESB ATGs Muay Thai / KickBoxing fighters Thread

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I love you! Writing a piece on his Gold for a series of 'Olympic Flashbacks' I'm doing, first one is up now, but not on here

I love this thread.
Sound's good, I'll check it out.
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Old 07-28-2012, 05:55 PM   #605
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If it's alright with you I'll send you the Khamsing piece before it goes up, in case I've made any mistakes/left anything interesting out. Cool?
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Old 07-28-2012, 06:35 PM   #606
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If it's alright with you I'll send you the Khamsing piece before it goes up, in case I've made any mistakes/left anything interesting out. Cool?
Yeah, sure mate I'd love to check it out.
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Old 07-29-2012, 10:20 AM   #607
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Top man. Got 5 ahead of him though!
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Old 07-29-2012, 11:49 AM   #608
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Bloody hell Flea, sounds like you're gunning for Buncey's job.
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Old 07-29-2012, 07:29 PM   #609
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Bloody hell Flea, sounds like you're gunning for Buncey's job.
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Old 08-01-2012, 05:06 PM   #610
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Bloody hell Flea, sounds like you're gunning for Buncey's job.
Nah, just trying to get experience for when I finally take a proper stab at the book.

Third one going up now
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Old 08-01-2012, 08:53 PM   #611
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Nah, just trying to get experience for when I finally take a proper stab at the book.

Third one going up now
I've only found one so far, but very good. Impressive.

Corrct that found th other two. Pretty impressive writng and knowledge Flea.
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Old 08-02-2012, 03:23 PM   #612
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Still learning mate, learning how to write is a new thing as well......next up is the African boycott of '76
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Old 08-04-2012, 09:30 PM   #613
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Petrosyan would have IMO taken Parr to school, and I respect Parr a LOT.

I would favour Parr every time.

Petro could never handle Parr's switching from quality hands to quality elbows and would be thrown repeatedly.
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Old 08-04-2012, 10:43 PM   #614
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I would favour Parr every time.

Petro could never handle Parr's switching from quality hands to quality elbows and would be thrown repeatedly.
I agree, Petro couldn't live with JWP in the clinch under full MT, he'd get out muscled and thrown alot. JWP would also be the slightly bigger man and he could take anyhing Petro dished out, JWP's a very durable fighter.

JWP everytime, and like I said before you gotta ask why they never met, and we know JWP never ducked anyone.....

I'd have anticapated a JWP v Petro fight more than a Buakaw v Petro rematch cos we all know Buakaw was robbed.

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Old 08-10-2012, 05:12 AM   #615
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I would favour Parr every time.

Petro could never handle Parr's switching from quality hands to quality elbows and would be thrown repeatedly.


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I agree, Petro couldn't live with JWP in the clinch under full MT, he'd get out muscled and thrown alot. JWP would also be the slightly bigger man and he could take anyhing Petro dished out, JWP's a very durable fighter.

JWP everytime, and like I said before you gotta ask why they never met, and we know JWP never ducked anyone.....

I'd have anticapated a JWP v Petro fight more than a Buakaw v Petro rematch cos we all know Buakaw was robbed.



Who did Petrosyan duck? Petro fought Buakaw when he was tearing the the world of kickboxing apart and at his best, and he has fought and easily handled the much bigger Kyshenko, why should he be afraid of JWP?

Petrosyan is far too good of a fighter to be counted out against anyone, JWP included. I would agree Petro would lose a clinch battle with Parr. the clinch isnt the only factor in muaythai and I dont see any evidence that he would have difficulty with elbows given his defence, movement and the fact that he has fought under FTR before.

under FTR, Petrosyan is the underdog... slightly. Under kickboxing rules however Giorgio is a huge favourite over Parr.

Both fighters have fought under both rules. Fighters are going to gravitate to rules they excel at. This "Petrosyan being scared" shit is garbage.
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