Are strikers gaining some ground in the UFC?

[Haggis McJackass]

A common complaint about MMA is that it's all ex college wrestler types wrestle****ing strikers to death.

But how true is this?

I seems we're in a bit of a resurgence for strikers.

JDS is basically running through the division with boxing, TDD and nothing else.

Jones uses dynamic, unorthodox striking to confuse and intimidate his opponents and make them hesitant.

Machida just demonstrated (again) that pure wrestling won't do shit against somebody who understands distance and range.

Anderson is STILL there on top.

The rematch between Bendo and Edgar was conducted 90% on their feet.

Aldo is developing quite the legacy, based on a lot of exciting striking.




Is this a good age for strikers in the sport?

Even with some of their best weapons taken away by the rules, strikers seem to be holding their own. It seems like at the top level there is now less lay and pray than there used to be, and fewer fighters are terrified to stand with anybody.

Thoughts?

[Muchmoore]

Not enough wrestlers using wrestling. Bader made no serious attempt to take Lyoto down I mean what the ****

Too many guys abandoning what got them there and hiring "boxing" coaches and then suddenly considering themselves strikers. Another good example is Lesnar trying flying knees and no freightrain takedowns once retard Pat Barry joined Deathclutch. Strikers tend to stick with the sprawl and brawl mentality by contrast.

Too vanila.

[Stoo]

[Haggis McJackass]

Originally Posted by Muchmoore

Not enough wrestlers using wrestling. Bader made no serious attempt to take Lyoto down I mean what the ****

Too many guys abandoning what got them there and hiring "boxing" coaches and then suddenly considering themselves strikers. Another good example is Lesnar trying flying knees and no freightrain takedowns once retard Pat Barry joined Deathclutch. Strikers tend to stick with the sprawl and brawl mentality by contrast.

Too vanila.

It is true that every wrestler who trains three weeks standup thinks they've turned into Junior dos Santos.

But Bader didn't really try to strike with Machida. He was looking for the takedown, he just didn't know how to get it. He learned that Machida kept him too far away to jjust power through a step or two and get the takedown. After he found that out, he was clueless because he didn't have the skill to engage with striking either.

But for years people have bitched that the UFC is wrestler-heavy and excessively wrestler-friendly. But now it seems that people have figured out how to use striking to succeed at the very highest levels. Most of the current champions are more strikers than they are wrestlers.

[Kittikasem]

Originally Posted by Haggis McJackass

It is true that every wrestler who trains three weeks standup thinks they've turned into Junior dos Santos.

But Bader didn't really try to strike with Machida. He was looking for the takedown, he just didn't know how to get it. He learned that Machida kept him too far away to jjust power through a step or two and get the takedown. After he found that out, he was clueless because he didn't have the skill to engage with striking either.

But for years people have bitched that the UFC is wrestler-heavy and excessively wrestler-friendly. But now it seems that people have figured out how to use striking to succeed at the very highest levels. Most of the current champions are more strikers than they are wrestlers.

Way to read Bader's mind and go against the evidence on film there.

[Kittikasem]

Originally Posted by Muchmoore

Not enough wrestlers using wrestling. Bader made no serious attempt to take Lyoto down I mean what the ****

Too many guys abandoning what got them there and hiring "boxing" coaches and then suddenly considering themselves strikers. Another good example is Lesnar trying flying knees and no freightrain takedowns once retard Pat Barry joined Deathclutch. Strikers tend to stick with the sprawl and brawl mentality by contrast.

Too vanila.

[Haggis McJackass]

Originally Posted by Kittikasem

Way to read Bader's mind and go against the evidence on film there.

Well he stood in front of Machida and posed, but he didn't throw shit until he panicked and immediately got KOed. He had a couple of early takedown attempts shrugged off as well, as I recall.

Somehow I doubt that Bader's fight plan was to stand and trade punches and kicks with the Dragon.

[Matty lll]

Originally Posted by Haggis McJackass

Well he stood in front of Machida and posed, but he didn't throw shit until he panicked and immediately got KOed.

Somehow I doubt that Bader's fight plan was to stand and trade punches and kicks with the Dragon.

It was, he said afterwards he wanted to get Machida to respect his power

[LHL]

Muchmoore nailed it. When guys get to the top with their BJJ or Wrestling they start to add things to their game. Not many of them learn stuff and adept it into their game. They seem to go from one extreme to the other. Maia would be a prime example. Bader is similar. I'd say Faber is another. Great submission wrestler but prefers to keep it on his feet (although he is a very good striker)

[Haggis McJackass]

Originally Posted by Matty lll

It was, he said afterwards he wanted to get Machida to respect his power

Should have thrown a punch before halfway through the second round then.

Might have to go back to the tape. As I recall, early on Bader tried for a couple of takedowns set up by strikes, but was denied with such ease that he basically looked clueless from then on.

[LHL]

Just thinking is there that much wrestling blankets these days? There used to be a problem with that in the UFC but I can't really recall too many these days. Fitch comes to mind but there used to be loads of them.

[Haggis McJackass]

Originally Posted by LHL

Just thinking is there that much wrestling blankets these days? There used to be a problem with that in the UFC but I can't really recall too many these days. Fitch comes to mind but there used to be loads of them.

Lay and pray has definitely receded. I think guys have realized that even if they win all their fights with it, they're going to be at the back of the line for title shots because nobody wants to see that shit.

Certainly you see a lot less "striker gets taken down and dry-humped for 15 minutes" now than you used to. Whether that's down to strikers being better at defending the takedown, or wrestlers being more confident on their feet, or both, that's the question to be asked in this thread.

[SugarShane_24]

Well, I think so yeah.

The top contender at 155 is an great striker as well.

So is the interim champ at 170.

The bantamweight champ is more noted as a stand-up guy than anything else, so as the interim champ.

As they say, all fight starts at a stand-up. Especially against Machida, if you can't control distance, you're grappling would mean shit.

[Kittikasem]

Originally Posted by Matty lll

It was, he said afterwards he wanted to get Machida to respect his power

Who cares what he said, Haggis read his mind.

[Haggis McJackass]

Originally Posted by Kittikasem

Who cares what he said, Haggis read his mind.

Eh, I've watched the fight once as it happened. I recall Bader going for a couple of early takedowns from the outside and getting nowhere near Machida, then apparently getting hypnotized.

Maybe I'm wrong, that's always possible. Maybe Bader's plan was to discard his lifelong wrestling base and trade punches from range with Machida. If that was in fact the case, then it seems to me that a) he should have been a lot more active with it, and b) that was a dumb plan to begin with.