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Old 09-20-2012, 05:51 AM   #106
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

Why do people think hand stand pushups are progression for pushups?
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Old 09-20-2012, 06:15 AM   #107
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

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Why do people think hand stand pushups are progression for pushups?

ok then, i one guy here wrote that.. nvm, if you do push ups with push up bar you go deeper and you you feel that forearm is pumping, during push ups.more diffuclty to do push ups with the bars.
what you thinka bout wall stand push ups? my head is exploding,
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Old 09-20-2012, 06:41 AM   #108
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

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I don't think plyometrics are good for hypertrophy. The muscle doesn't spend long enough under stress. Thus it's a great exercise for sports people but there is little value other then function. Think that's right and I'm hoping I've made sense with my answer as I've literally only read your post puma.
That's an excellent point. I would argue that Mountain climber Plyo pushups would be better for hypertrophy as the chest is under constant stress.

Oh great....it's time to get ready for work. Blah. Good luck on your upcoming bout!
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Old 09-20-2012, 06:57 AM   #109
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That's an excellent point. I would argue that Mountain climber Plyo pushups would be better for hypertrophy as the chest is under constant stress.

Oh great....it's time to get ready for work. Blah. Good luck on your upcoming bout!
Thanks Carlos hope ur well mate
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Old 09-20-2012, 07:15 AM   #110
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

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Thanks Carlos hope ur well mate
What you think about pull ups, and then wait 3 minutes and do push ups (bar push ups) ? and then add plymoetrics push ups?
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Old 09-20-2012, 10:57 AM   #111
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

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What you think about pull ups, and then wait 3 minutes and do push ups (bar push ups) ? and then add plymoetrics push ups?
What do you mean by think about them? Whats the objective?
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Old 09-20-2012, 10:59 AM   #112
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

I use ever-last perfect push up handles.
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Old 09-20-2012, 11:15 AM   #113
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

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Originally Posted by brown bomber View Post
I don't think plyometrics are good for hypertrophy. The muscle doesn't spend long enough under stress. Thus it's a great exercise for sports people but there is little value other then function. Think that's right and I'm hoping I've made sense with my answer as I've literally only read your post puma.
Plyos and speed work can be very useful tools for hypertrophy. If you can improve your explosiveness, it's going to benefit your strength gains, which is obviously good for muscular hypertrophy. I like to include strength, power and 'hypertrophy' work into my routine, as they all go great together.

[ame]www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlSDeWrNZY0[/ame]

I'd advise subscribing to that channel too, there should be some unrivalled content coming out over the coming months.
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Old 09-20-2012, 11:46 AM   #114
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

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Plyos and speed work can be very useful tools for hypertrophy. If you can improve your explosiveness, it's going to benefit your strength gains, which is obviously good for muscular hypertrophy. I like to include strength, power and 'hypertrophy' work into my routine, as they all go great together.

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

I'd advise subscribing to that channel too, there should be some unrivalled content coming out over the coming months.
Thanks mate - can you explain the science of how Plyometric exercise leads to hypertrophy. As I understand Plyometrics utilise the bodies stretch reflex to enable more explosive contraction then can be generated from a 'standard' starting position.

Muscular explosiveness is more to do with the nervous system then any increase in muscle size so whilst doing plyometrics might make you more agile and fast- it certainly won't increase your muscle size significantly according to any studies I have seen.
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Old 09-20-2012, 11:56 AM   #115
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

Lets say for example somebody has a 2:1:1 ratio of hypertrophy, power and strength work with the goal of skeletal hypertrophy, the speed work will have a direct benefit on their strength, which in turn is going to allow you to further overload the muscles on your hypertrophy training days, since you are able to move more weight. Some people may just do hypertrophy and strength days, which is good, but adding in some explosive movements with sub-maximal weight is going to benefit your strength training.

Similarly, Dr Zourdos in that video talks about how hypertrophy work is going to benefit a powerlifter, as your going to increase cross sectional muscle area, however the ratios of training will differ, for example 2:1:1 in favour of strength training.

Those are just brief examples though, my knowledge on the subject is way, way inferior to somebody like Dr Zourdos on the subject, but I've always aimed to undulate my weight training either daily or weekly.

Last edited by Jdsm; 09-20-2012 at 12:06 PM.
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Old 09-20-2012, 12:51 PM   #116
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

I've been doing alternating single arm medicine ball push ups as well as regular push ups using push up bars, elevated feet push ups, and diamond push ups for a total of 100-120 reps for all exercises about once a week after I'm done with my boxing training (should I do this more frequently?). I'm happy with this routine so far, but all this talk of plyometric push ups has got me interested. If I understand this right, plyometric push ups are better for explosiveness/speed than regular push ups? Other than the medicine ball push ups I'm doing, are any of the other push up variations I'm doing particularly beneficial for boxing?

Alternating Single Arm Medicine Ball Push Ups (1 min mark):

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfu8lwPHisU&t=1m0s[/ame]


I'm thinking about adding this into my regular routine:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=651Kqtf-rqE[/ame]


And any thoughts on this work out?

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LktGfODugjg[/ame]


I'm not sure if I'd be able to do this one the whole way though. Won't know until I try it. You think replacing my regular routine with multiple sets of this one would be better for boxing? Or if possible, maybe one set after my regular routine?
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Old 09-20-2012, 02:31 PM   #117
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

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Originally Posted by Jdsm View Post
Lets say for example somebody has a 2:1:1 ratio of hypertrophy, power and strength work with the goal of skeletal hypertrophy, the speed work will have a direct benefit on their strength, which in turn is going to allow you to further overload the muscles on your hypertrophy training days, since you are able to move more weight. Some people may just do hypertrophy and strength days, which is good, but adding in some explosive movements with sub-maximal weight is going to benefit your strength training.

Similarly, Dr Zourdos in that video talks about how hypertrophy work is going to benefit a powerlifter, as your going to increase cross sectional muscle area, however the ratios of training will differ, for example 2:1:1 in favour of strength training.

Those are just brief examples though, my knowledge on the subject is way, way inferior to somebody like Dr Zourdos on the subject, but I've always aimed to undulate my weight training either daily or weekly.
Thanks for the reply mate -just at work i'll have a proper read later
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Old 09-20-2012, 04:23 PM   #118
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

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What do you mean by think about them? Whats the objective?
strenght, endurance,.But wbu muscle gain?
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Old 09-20-2012, 04:28 PM   #119
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

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Originally Posted by Jdsm View Post
Lets say for example somebody has a 2:1:1 ratio of hypertrophy, power and strength work with the goal of skeletal hypertrophy, the speed work will have a direct benefit on their strength, which in turn is going to allow you to further overload the muscles on your hypertrophy training days, since you are able to move more weight. Some people may just do hypertrophy and strength days, which is good, but adding in some explosive movements with sub-maximal weight is going to benefit your strength training.

Similarly, Dr Zourdos in that video talks about how hypertrophy work is going to benefit a powerlifter, as your going to increase cross sectional muscle area, however the ratios of training will differ, for example 2:1:1 in favour of strength training.

Those are just brief examples though, my knowledge on the subject is way, way inferior to somebody like Dr Zourdos on the subject, but I've always aimed to undulate my weight training either daily or weekly.
Ok thanks mate read through properly now... How would sub maximal explosive work make any difference to ur strength?

Not being pedantic I just don't get it- if I do a sub maximal explosive exercise then how is it going to allow me to lift any heavier? If I don't lift heavier then hypertrophy is not going to be achieved surely...
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Old 09-20-2012, 04:55 PM   #120
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Default Re: The limits of bodyweight training?

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Ok thanks mate read through properly now... How would sub maximal explosive work make any difference to ur strength?

Not being pedantic I just don't get it- if I do a sub maximal explosive exercise then how is it going to allow me to lift any heavier? If I don't lift heavier then hypertrophy is not going to be achieved surely...
Because using sub-maximal weight can still allow you to apply the same amount of force that you would be applying to a heavier weight. So doing speedwork with say 65% of your 1RM, you can still apply the same amount of force to that weight that you could to a much heavier weight by focusing on a very explosive concentric. Obviously you aren't going to see massive strength gains with only speed work, but speed work is going to improve your strength gains in the presence of strength training too.

So with heavier training and sub-max speed work, you'll see it translates into better strength gains. Then with increased strength gains, it's going to allow for more overload on your hypertrophy days. If you were doing purely the typical hypertrophy rep range 8-12, then strength progression is going to be much slower; the incorporation of strength specific workouts, with additional speed work allows for more progression on hypertrophy days. Hope that makes more sense mate
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