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Old 09-23-2012, 02:33 PM   #16
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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Originally Posted by EL BULLY View Post
Well, Jones isn't fighting under the same rules as the guys you mentioned is he? So to say it doesn't factor makes no sense. Especially if you consider his DQ loss to Hamil was for illegal elbows so it's obviously a technique that comes natural to him and he cannot use.
And? What's that got to do with anything? The guys i'm citing didn't even use elbows. They ALL used punches in their GnP. Fedor, Coleman, Kerr, Igor.
Your example makes no sense because its spurious. You cant make a statement about 12 to 6 elbows or punches to the back of the head when that never occurred in both fights when Marks opponents crawled out of the ring. Your either saying that just to make a point as one as under Value Tudo rules and the other PRIDE rules (of which the lata never allowed elbows) or because you've never seen the fights. Which only serves to prove my point about their superior GnP over Jones.
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Old 09-23-2012, 02:35 PM   #17
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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If he doesn't finish people with gnp how one earth can he have the best gnp of all time
Exactly?!?! I don't know why the guys arguing the point. You want to see GnP watch what Igor did to Inoue in PRIDE. That GnP was so brutal Inoue ended uo in hospital for 3 months with a swollen brain and couldn't even stand after the bout and had to be helped to his corner by his brother. All those blows were punches. No elbows.
Matter of fact id say Tito's GnP is was better than Jones when he first fought Shamrock. In what at the time was considered one of the most brutal displays of GnP.
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Old 09-23-2012, 02:36 PM   #18
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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If he doesn't finish people with gnp how one earth can he have the best gnp of all time
Um, he has finished people with GNP. Just saying that he can land brutal elbows right at the start of fights when the other guy is still fresh rather than only being able to land GNP when the other guy is hurt and unable to 'intelligently' defend himself. Basically if Jones takes you down you are sustaining serious damage from vicious elbows, simple as that.
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Old 09-23-2012, 02:38 PM   #19
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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Originally Posted by scurlaruntings View Post
Exactly?!?! I don't know why the guys arguing the point. You want to see GnP watch what Igor did to Inoue in PRIDE. That GnP was so brutal Inoue ended uo in hospital for 3 months with a swollen brain and couldn't even stand after the bout and had to be helped to his corner by his brother. All those blows were punches. No elbows.
Matter of fact id say Tito's GnP is was better than Jones when he first fought Shamrock. In what at the time was considered one of the most brutal displays of GnP.
So Robbie Lawler is a better striker than Anderson Silva? Frank Mir is a better submission artist that Royce Gracie? Well Lawler has landed some brutal KO's and Mir has broken limbs so they must be, eh?
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Old 09-23-2012, 02:39 PM   #20
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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So Robbie Lawler is a better striker than Anderson Silva? Frank Mir is a better submission artist that Royce Gracie? Well Lawler has landed some brutal KO's and Mir has broken limbs so they must be, eh?
O ffs
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Old 09-23-2012, 02:41 PM   #21
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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Originally Posted by scurlaruntings View Post
Exactly?!?! I don't know why the guys arguing the point. You want to see GnP watch what Igor did to Inoue in PRIDE. That GnP was so brutal Inoue ended uo in hospital for 3 months with a swollen brain and couldn't even stand after the bout and had to be helped to his corner by his brother. All those blows were punches. No elbows.
Matter of fact id say Tito's GnP is was better than Jones when he first fought Shamrock. In what at the time was considered one of the most brutal displays of GnP.
And the fact the fight wasn't stopped as quick as it would be today had nothing to do with that either.
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Old 09-23-2012, 02:53 PM   #22
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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Um, he has finished people with GNP. Just saying that he can land brutal elbows right at the start of fights when the other guy is still fresh rather than only being able to land GNP when the other guy is hurt and unable to 'intelligently' defend himself. Basically if Jones takes you down you are sustaining serious damage from vicious elbows, simple as that.
I know this but you said its not something he uses to finish opponents with
I wouldn't say he is gnp is upto the level of fedor and a few others yet, he basically only uses elbows, doesn't go for finishing shots so although the has good gnp to say he is the best ever is to much imo.
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Old 09-23-2012, 08:29 PM   #23
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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I said I think he does. You say he actually doesn't. I offer an opinion. You seem to think that you are somehow an oracle and that your word is final.
You are arguing with a guy who, in a "Does Bones have the best GnP in MMA history?" thread, marked Jones down simply because he imagines that his GnP wouldn't be as effective at heavyweight in fights that haven't happened, in a division that Jones has never fought in.

Also he thinks that Shogun went the distance with Jones, and he will tell you that bodybuilding is bigger than MMA.

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Old 09-23-2012, 08:35 PM   #24
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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I know this but you said its not something he uses to finish opponents with
I wouldn't say he is gnp is upto the level of fedor and a few others yet, he basically only uses elbows, doesn't go for finishing shots so although the has good gnp to say he is the best ever is to much imo.
Well, he's fought the cream of his division and nobody has been able to escape getting hit and bloodied up by the elbows.

He is very comfortable with it. Hits people at will with elbows from anywhere on the ground. Cuts them up and often turns them into a bloody mess. And nobody seems to be able to escape it or deal with it.

I don't see why Jones' GnP shouldn't be considered in the very top tier. As stated, he's fought the best available in his division, nobody has been able to avoid the GnP, and it causes a lot of damage to anyone he chooses to use it on.

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Old 09-23-2012, 09:16 PM   #25
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

He made that pretty clear in the interview. He said he took the fight on short notice and took guard to 'rest'.
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Old 09-23-2012, 10:00 PM   #26
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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Well, he's fought the cream of his division and nobody has been able to escape getting hit and bloodied up by the elbows.

He is very comfortable with it. Hits people at will with elbows from anywhere on the ground. Cuts them up and often turns them into a bloody mess. And nobody seems to be able to escape it or deal with it.

I don't see why Jones' GnP shouldn't be considered in the very top tier. As stated, he's fought the best available in his division, nobody has been able to avoid the GnP, and it causes a lot of damage to anyone he chooses to use it on.

He stated he had the best gnp of all time, that not the same as being a top teir guy, he basicaly only uses elbows and isn't a great gnp finisher, how would this make him the best ever
He also needs alot more top fights to show his abilities against different guys, he is doing and if he can mix it up abit then there is no reason he could not reach that level but to say he is the best atg now to me is wrong.
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Old 09-23-2012, 10:18 PM   #27
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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He stated he had the best gnp of all time, that not the same as being a top teir guy, he basicaly only uses elbows and isn't a great gnp finisher, how would this make him the best ever
He also needs alot more top fights to show his abilities against different guys, he is doing and if he can mix it up abit then there is no reason he could not reach that level but to say he is the best atg now to me is wrong.
How can you tell who has "THE" single greatest gnp game ever?

Jones doesn't really use his gnp as a finisher. He uses it to soften up, cut and demoralize an opponent. And it is very effective at this.

Nobody can avoid it or stop him from doing it, and nobody can ride it out without taking massive damage. And it turns fights around or ends them, and does so quickly. In the Machida fight, for example, Machida was doing very well. He was fresh, and gaining confidence. Then Jones threw him down and started with the gnp. Ten seconds later Machida was dazed and had grown a vagina on his face, and he was never in the fight from that point on.

And as already stated, Jones uses his gnp on guys who are still fresh. It's not a case of beating up on a tired opponent. Jones throws them down, brutalizes them and cuts them open while they are still fresh. It's a significant weapon for him, and an important part of his game that no opponent has yet shown they can handle.

Finally, unlike a lot of the dinosaurs Scurla likes to masturbate over, Jones is a well-rounded fighter. His gnp is just one of his tools, not his primary weapon. Rather than look to pound someone out Coleman-style, he'll use his elbows to soften an opponent up while he looks for the submission. Belfort, Machida, Jackson and Bader, all of those guys could have been gnped into bolivian. But they all got beaten down and softened up by the elbows until they are all but helpless, and then the submission hold is slapped on.


Last edited by Haggis McJackass; 09-23-2012 at 10:35 PM.
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Old 09-23-2012, 11:35 PM   #28
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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And? What's that got to do with anything? The guys i'm citing didn't even use elbows. They ALL used punches in their GnP. Fedor, Coleman, Kerr, Igor.
Your example makes no sense because its spurious. You cant make a statement about 12 to 6 elbows or punches to the back of the head when that never occurred in both fights when Marks opponents crawled out of the ring. Your either saying that just to make a point as one as under Value Tudo rules and the other PRIDE rules (of which the lata never allowed elbows) or because you've never seen the fights. Which only serves to prove my point about their superior GnP over Jones.
Skruntling, ok ok , enough about Marks opponents crawling out of the ring, your embarrassing yourself. Your aware whats going on here, your upset how good Jon Jones GnP is and your in denial to it and fighting for that denial. Listen Mark Coleman was awesome in his day but that didnt last. He couldnt GnP Maurice Smith or Pete Williams. Fedors was awesome and by far the best of his time. Jon Jones time is now and he is a monster taking you to the ground. A monster Skruntlings. You know this. When he goes to the ground with you he is ending up in position ontop of his opponent, yes or no Skruntlings ? Yes or No ? What did Coleman do to Maurice Smith when Coleman was ontop of him for the first half of the fight? Not that much. Alot of stupid angled no leveraged punches. Jon Jones uses his strength to outwait and out position his opponent and then unleashes giant shots on the ground. He is awesome.

If you cant take the truth thats one thing but to accuse others of being foolish when your not seeing the truth what does that make you Scruntlings ?

Scruntlings, if you cant confront and deal with the force of reality what your dealing with is the force of bullshit

Dont make me come after you with my TEXT, admit that Jon Jones can take you down and ground you out pretty dam well and you have my word of FONT i will grant you safe passage
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Old 09-23-2012, 11:36 PM   #29
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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Originally Posted by Haggis McJackass View Post
How can you tell who has "THE" single greatest gnp game ever?

Jones doesn't really use his gnp as a finisher. He uses it to soften up, cut and demoralize an opponent. And it is very effective at this.

Nobody can avoid it or stop him from doing it, and nobody can ride it out without taking massive damage. And it turns fights around or ends them, and does so quickly. In the Machida fight, for example, Machida was doing very well. He was fresh, and gaining confidence. Then Jones threw him down and started with the gnp. Ten seconds later Machida was dazed and had grown a vagina on his face, and he was never in the fight from that point on.

And as already stated, Jones uses his gnp on guys who are still fresh. It's not a case of beating up on a tired opponent. Jones throws them down, brutalizes them and cuts them open while they are still fresh. It's a significant weapon for him, and an important part of his game that no opponent has yet shown they can handle.

Finally, unlike a lot of the dinosaurs Scurla likes to masturbate over, Jones is a well-rounded fighter. His gnp is just one of his tools, not his primary weapon. Rather than look to pound someone out Coleman-style, he'll use his elbows to soften an opponent up while he looks for the submission. Belfort, Machida, Jackson and Bader, all of those guys could have been gnped into bolivian. But they all got beaten down and softened up by the elbows until they are all but helpless, and then the submission hold is slapped on.

good post, fair , truthful and funny
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Old 09-23-2012, 11:52 PM   #30
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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Originally Posted by Haggis McJackass View Post
How can you tell who has "THE" single greatest gnp game ever?

Jones doesn't really use his gnp as a finisher. He uses it to soften up, cut and demoralize an opponent. And it is very effective at this.

Nobody can avoid it or stop him from doing it, and nobody can ride it out without taking massive damage. And it turns fights around or ends them, and does so quickly. In the Machida fight, for example, Machida was doing very well. He was fresh, and gaining confidence. Then Jones threw him down and started with the gnp. Ten seconds later Machida was dazed and had grown a vagina on his face, and he was never in the fight from that point on.

And as already stated, Jones uses his gnp on guys who are still fresh. It's not a case of beating up on a tired opponent. Jones throws them down, brutalizes them and cuts them open while they are still fresh. It's a significant weapon for him, and an important part of his game that no opponent has yet shown they can handle.

Finally, unlike a lot of the dinosaurs Scurla likes to masturbate over, Jones is a well-rounded fighter. His gnp is just one of his tools, not his primary weapon. Rather than look to pound someone out Coleman-style, he'll use his elbows to soften an opponent up while he looks for the submission. Belfort, Machida, Jackson and Bader, all of those guys could have been gnped into bolivian. But they all got beaten down and softened up by the elbows until they are all but helpless, and then the submission hold is slapped on.

This was a decent but pointless post, the guy claimed jon jones had the best gnp of all time and i pulled him up on it as i don't agree ( you also seem not to agree as you mention how can you claim anyone to be the best gnp fighter of all time), your points about nobody being able to stop his gnp are weak imo, he has not faced a wide enough variety of fighters or high enough quality at respective points to make such claims.
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