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Old 09-24-2012, 01:59 AM   #31
EL BULLY
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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This was a decent but pointless post, the guy claimed jon jones had the best gnp of all time and i pulled him up on it as i don't agree ( you also seem not to agree as you mention how can you claim anyone to be the best gnp fighter of all time), your points about nobody being able to stop his gnp are weak imo, he has not faced a wide enough variety of fighters or high enough quality at respective points to make such claims.
Wow. Fights in last year and a half: Rua, Rampage, Machida, Evans, Belfort (should have been Henderson) Stopped 4 of the 5. No variety? Not enough quality? Care to name a fighter than has had a better run than that?

And I didn't say he was the best GNP fighter of all time as it is just one tool in his toolbox. I stated he has the most efficient and effective GNP as he can land it from the very first bell against top named opponents and they can't do shit to stop it whereas some other, more ferocious GNPers in the past would/could only use it when finishing an already hurt or tired opponent. Look, I don't think it's the best in terms of exciting to watch as it is not wild and all out brutality but I think it is the best in terms of he can use it against everyone at any time in a fight and he doesn't gas himself out and he doesn't miss. It is a more refined version than the GNP of old and I don't see a way around it for the guys that have to fight him.
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Old 09-24-2012, 12:32 PM   #32
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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Wow. Fights in last year and a half: Rua, Rampage, Machida, Evans, Belfort (should have been Henderson) Stopped 4 of the 5. No variety? Not enough quality? Care to name a fighter than has had a better run than that?

And I didn't say he was the best GNP fighter of all time as it is just one tool in his toolbox. I stated he has the most efficient and effective GNP as he can land it from the very first bell against top named opponents and they can't do shit to stop it whereas some other, more ferocious GNPers in the past would/could only use it when finishing an already hurt or tired opponent. Look, I don't think it's the best in terms of exciting to watch as it is not wild and all out brutality but I think it is the best in terms of he can use it against everyone at any time in a fight and he doesn't gas himself out and he doesn't miss. It is a more refined version than the GNP of old and I don't see a way around it for the guys that have to fight him.
Totally agree but only because its the truth and well said at that. Those other dudes arguing with you are trapped in denial for their own personal reasons of confused chaos.
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Old 09-24-2012, 12:55 PM   #33
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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This was a decent but pointless post, the guy claimed jon jones had the best gnp of all time and i pulled him up on it as i don't agree ( you also seem not to agree as you mention how can you claim anyone to be the best gnp fighter of all time), your points about nobody being able to stop his gnp are weak imo, he has not faced a wide enough variety of fighters or high enough quality at respective points to make such claims.
your forgetting that GnP has EVOLVED leaps and bounds since the OLD DAYs of Coleman, Kerr, Fedor etc. As well who is it that you feel has SUPERIOUR GnP skills to Jon Jones? Take a guy like Brock Lesner, his GnP is pretty good all things considered BUT how good is he at IMPOSING it upon the TOP tier guys? Carwin? Cain ? Reem ? No i didnt say that Brocks GnP was GREAT, i use him as a point. If ONE cant IMPOSE there GnP on another then their GnP is not that GOOD correct ? Can and does Jon Jones have TROUBLE imposing his GnP on his opponents ? When he goes down does he have TROUBLE remaining in CONTROL on the GROUND while pounding ? The answer is NOT as much as most if not all of the other top tier guys correct ? One could argue that CAINs GnP is top notch however, there again, it didnt help him against JDS who was just too fast for Cain. Jones is also fast however, rather than JDS's style he does so with great striking AND great GnP skills of his own. That makes his GnP even better.
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Old 09-24-2012, 07:46 PM   #34
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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your forgetting that GnP has EVOLVED leaps and bounds since the OLD DAYs of Coleman, Kerr, Fedor etc. As well who is it that you feel has SUPERIOUR GnP skills to Jon Jones? Take a guy like Brock Lesner, his GnP is pretty good all things considered BUT how good is he at IMPOSING it upon the TOP tier guys? Carwin? Cain ? Reem ? No i didnt say that Brocks GnP was GREAT, i use him as a point. If ONE cant IMPOSE there GnP on another then their GnP is not that GOOD correct ? Can and does Jon Jones have TROUBLE imposing his GnP on his opponents ? When he goes down does he have TROUBLE remaining in CONTROL on the GROUND while pounding ? The answer is NOT as much as most if not all of the other top tier guys correct ? One could argue that CAINs GnP is top notch however, there again, it didnt help him against JDS who was just too fast for Cain. Jones is also fast however, rather than JDS's style he does so with great striking AND great GnP skills of his own. That makes his GnP even better.
So if the gnp has evolved leaps and bounds why does joens not mix it up and throw with more variety. To be the very best you have tyo have variety as well as impose yourself on the fighter on the bottom.
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Old 09-24-2012, 07:47 PM   #35
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Wow. Fights in last year and a half: Rua, Rampage, Machida, Evans, Belfort (should have been Henderson) Stopped 4 of the 5. No variety? Not enough quality? Care to name a fighter than has had a better run than that?

And I didn't say he was the best GNP fighter of all time as it is just one tool in his toolbox. I stated he has the most efficient and effective GNP as he can land it from the very first bell against top named opponents and they can't do shit to stop it whereas some other, more ferocious GNPers in the past would/could only use it when finishing an already hurt or tired opponent. Look, I don't think it's the best in terms of exciting to watch as it is not wild and all out brutality but I think it is the best in terms of he can use it against everyone at any time in a fight and he doesn't gas himself out and he doesn't miss. It is a more refined version than the GNP of old and I don't see a way around it for the guys that have to fight him.
So the bit where you say you think jones has the best gnp in mma history doesn't exist despite it being in writing on the first page
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Old 09-24-2012, 07:48 PM   #36
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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So if the gnp has evolved leaps and bounds why does joens not mix it up and throw with more variety. To be the very best you have tyo have variety as well as impose yourself on the fighter on the bottom.
Why?

Are his elbows not effective enough?

Do they not land accurately enough or cause enough damage?

Are they too easy for his opponent to escape from?

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Old 09-24-2012, 07:56 PM   #37
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Why?

Are his elbows not effective enough?

Do they not land accurately enough or cause enough damage?

Are they too easy for his opponent to escape from?

Look m8 jones is a top fighter with top gnp but he is still relatively new, he has some good wins but you have to put them in context to where those guys where at the time (what guys has jones beat at their peak or on there best run of form), im not saying he couldn't beat all the guys but its like a cricketer that comes in and gets 100 runs against a team like Australia now compared to one getting 100 runs against warne and mcgrath at there pomp.
Thats not to say jones couldn't get those wins but he hasn't at the time.

I think you and the other lads are off kilter thinking i have some underlying thing here, im pretty sure i have watched ufc for longer than 99% of the people here and am a big fan, i just don;t agree with everything that is popular at the time.
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Old 09-24-2012, 08:14 PM   #38
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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Originally Posted by dillinja View Post
Look m8 jones is a top fighter with top gnp but he is still relatively new, he has some good wins but you have to put them in context to where those guys where at the time (what guys has jones beat at their peak or on there best run of form), im not saying he couldn't beat all the guys but its like a cricketer that comes in and gets 100 runs against a team like Australia now compared to one getting 100 runs against warne and mcgrath at there pomp.
Thats not to say jones couldn't get those wins but he hasn't at the time.
Mate, he has now won five UFC title fights. The same as Chuck, one behind Tito. He's almost halfway to Anderson Silva's defences, FFS.

Does he need to win 10 or 15 title fights?

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Originally Posted by dillinja View Post
I think you and the other lads are off kilter thinking i have some underlying thing here, im pretty sure i have watched ufc for longer than 99% of the people here and am a big fan, i just don;t agree with everything that is popular at the time.
There it is.

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Old 09-24-2012, 08:22 PM   #39
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Mate, he has now won five UFC title fights. The same as Chuck, one behind Tito. He's almost halfway to Anderson Silva's defences, FFS.

Does he need to win 10 or 15 title fights?



There it is.

Im not saying he is not a great fighter but to be the very best and show all his attributes against the best variety of fighters it will take another couple of years.

The point about watching the sport longer is alot of the time you have a good argument and make good points but you don't see some of the wins in the context they are at the time. An example is the run shogun went on to win the middleweight gp, he went through jackson (at his best), nogeuira, overeem and then arona. At the time to win 4 fights on the run against the guys and there form at the time was amazing (belfort didn't even make it out of the first round of the tournament and this is 7 years ago). Jones has some great wins but he hasn't had a run as good as this, its maybe not even his fault because he is that good but until he gets another few its hard to put his streak up as the very best imo.
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Old 09-25-2012, 07:21 AM   #40
EL BULLY
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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So the bit where you say you think jones has the best gnp in mma history doesn't exist despite it being in writing on the first page
You are obviously quite stupid. Read that last one again. I said I never said he was the best 'GNP FIGHTER' of all time. The best GNP fighter of all time was probably Coleman or Kerr as that was 90% of their game. Jones GNP is one tiny part of his game but it is unstoppable and plays a factor in every single one of his wins. And read the first page again. I qualified my opinion by saying it was the most effective and efficient but not the most excitingly vicious. Then a few people started saying it's not as exciting as others when I had already stated that. So, you know, you are a retard or something.
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Old 09-25-2012, 10:36 AM   #41
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You are obviously quite stupid. Read that last one again. I said I never said he was the best 'GNP FIGHTER' of all time. The best GNP fighter of all time was probably Coleman or Kerr as that was 90% of their game. Jones GNP is one tiny part of his game but it is unstoppable and plays a factor in every single one of his wins. And read the first page again. I qualified my opinion by saying it was the most effective and efficient but not the most excitingly vicious. Then a few people started saying it's not as exciting as others when I had already stated that. So, you know, you are a retard or something.
You can't even read your own quote, 'i think he truly has the best gnp n mma history' so **** right off. You come with your pathetic insults so grow the **** up you pathetic little child.
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:06 AM   #42
EL BULLY
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

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You can't even read your own quote, 'i think he truly has the best gnp n mma history' so **** right off. You come with your pathetic insults so grow the **** up you pathetic little child.
Oh Jesus.
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:25 AM   #43
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Default Re: why did Belfort go down there at the end?

He pulled missionary just to confuse PH|LLA.
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