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View Poll Results: prime years
16-20 0 0%
21-25 4 5.41%
26-30 65 87.84%
31-35 5 6.76%
Voters: 74. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-30-2012, 07:58 PM   #61
irishny
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Default Re: Boxers Prime years

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Originally Posted by Ripper11 View Post
or maybe you've never actually seen him fight?



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Watch Mike in his prime how he would jab his way inside instead of just walking forward or swinging for the fences. Or he'd slip Holmes's punches to get closer.
Larry did fairly well at first too and Mike wasn't having too much success, but he was still doing the basic things Cus and Rooney taught to him.

Mike in his prime tried to break you down to the body and throw combinations constantly. Mike used to be one of the best combination punchers in boxing history, but he wasn't known for that after prison or his amazing headmovement.

Only somebody blind or a hater can't see this
Yes,he looked awesome against this over the hill version of Holmes who was semi retired.

Lewis's win over Holyfield(twice really) was better than anything Tyson ever did. Deal with it.

Spinks had a grand total of 4 fights at heavyweight.

If Tysons win over Ruddock was better than Lewis's win over Vitali, then what about Lewis destroying Ruddock a year later in much more dominating fashion.

Listen, I know Tyson was a fine fighter. Probably the most dynamic of heavyweights there has been, but he was never as good as his fans made him out to be, and Prime Lewis vs Prime Tyson, Lewis wins every time. Its like Lewis said in the interview on this site. Tyson only knew one way to fight, he had to come forward,jab,weave,get inside and KO you. He could outbox people because he was too short. Did you ever see Tyson dance around the ring flicking out the jab? Of course not, he didnt have the physical tools to do it. His feet were quite slow in the sense of moving around the ring. Lewis on the other hand had the tools to do everything.

Whe Tyson was looking amazing in the late 80s and even when he first came out of prison, he NEVER fought anyone like Lewis, so shoing me clips of these fights are meaningless. There was no one like Lewis back then.

A prime Holmes,maybe but not the old one coming off 2 losses that Tyson beat.

Its easy to say,he would have ducked,weaved,jabbed, but Tyson never had to go into a ring with anyone like Lewis back then. Its easy to look like a superstar when the opposition is sub standard.

The 90s had a pretty stacked heavyweight division. Tyson came through in a pretty mediocre one on the mid to late 80s.

He won his titles from Trevor Berbick, James Smith and Michael Spinks.

None of these guys would even be considered in the top top 50 of all time heavyweights, maybe not even in the top 100.

Spinks was a good LHW.

Holyfield however, would prob be a top 20 all time heavyweight. Vitali too.

The only all time ranked heavyweight that Tyson beat was Larry Holmes and he was way past it.

I dont want to come off like im bashing Tyson. Im simply saying there was no shame in being beaten by Holyfield who was a top fighter.

The fact was that Tyson was made out to be this unstoppable wrecking machine that he just wasnt. And the Holyfield fights were a wake up call for his fans as to what his true level was.

Lets be clear,I love watching those Tyson KO highglights as much as the next man!

Last edited by irishny; 09-30-2012 at 08:09 PM.
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Old 09-30-2012, 08:07 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by KidDynamite View Post
Also Lewis never really beat McCall. It was clear that there was something going on in that rematch.

McCall barely even fought back and was probably ordered to throw the fight ... so much for "avenging" his defeat against McCall.

The Lewis fight with Golota is also controversial ... Golota was supposedly drugged up for that fight.

The only big win for Lewis was Holyfield. The rest are all Tyson leftovers.
Wow, you are clearly being biased. I am a huge Tyson fan too, but you barely give Lewis credit for his wins against Golota and McCall. What about Mercer, Morrison, and V. klitschko? It's clear that your opinion is irrelevant. Look at your ****ing name and yes I'm aware I have a picture of Tyson as my avatar. I am a Tyson fan but I won't be saying bullshit in order to elevate one of my favorite fighters.

May I recommend tysontalk.com? That forum is more suited for your bullshit words.
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Old 09-30-2012, 08:16 PM   #63
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Default Re: Boxers Prime years

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Originally Posted by irishny View Post
Yes,he looked awesome against this over the hill version of Holmes who was semi retired.

Lewis's win over Holyfield(twice really) was better than anything Tyson ever did. Deal with it.

Spinks had a grand total of 4 fights at heavyweight.

If Tysons win over Ruddock was better than Lewis's win over Vitali, then what about Lewis destroying Ruddock a year later in much more dominating fashion.

Listen, I know Tyson was a fine fighter. Probably the most dynamic of heavyweights there has been, but he was never as good as his fans made him out to be, and Prime Lewis vs Prime Tyson, Lewis wins every time. Its like Lewis said in the interview on this site. Tyson only knew one way to fight, he had to come forward,jab,weave,get inside and KO you. He could outbox people because he was too short. Did you ever see Tyson dance around the ring flicking out the jab? Of course not, he didnt have the physical tools to do it. His feet were quite slow in the sense of moving around the ring. Lewis on the other hand had the tools to do everything.

Whe Tyson was looking amazing in the late 80s and even when he first came out of prison, he NEVER fought anyone like Lewis, so shoing me clips of these fights are meaningless. There was no one like Lewis back then.

A prime Holmes,maybe but not the old one coming off 2 losses that Tyson beat.

Its easy to say,he would have ducked,weaved,jabbed, but Tyson never had to go into a ring with anyone like Lewis back then. Its easy to look like a superstar when the opposition is sub standard.

The 90s had a pretty stacked heavyweight division. Tyson came through in a pretty mediocre one on the mid to late 80s.

He won his titles from Trevor Berbick, James Smith and Michael Spinks.

None of these guys would even be considered in the top top 50 of all time heavyweights, maybe not even in the top 100.

Spinks was a good LHW.

Holyfield however, would prob be a top 20 all time heavyweight. Vitali too.

The only all time ranked heavyweight that Tyson beat was Larry Holmes and he was way past it.

I dont want to come off like im bashing Tyson. Im simply saying there was no shame in being beaten by Holyfield who was a top fighter.

The fact was that Tyson was made out to be this unstoppable wrecking machine that he just wasnt. And the Holyfield fights were a wake up call for his fans as to what his true level was.
I didn't show the fight to say "Oh look at how Tyson just blew through this guy!!"
I showed it to show the things Tyson would actually do in his prime that he no longer did after prison. It has absolutely nothing to do with the opponent. Just look at Tyson and his demeanor. You can even look at the fights after prison that weren't difficult, and you can tell the difference.

And I'm not arguing Tyson against Holyfield and Lewis. I think prime for prime, Tyson loses to both. My argument is just that Tyson wasn't prime when he fought them.

And you're wrong, Tyson could win a decision, but not in the way you describe of dancing around the ring. He can and has won decisions just by applying pressure and breaking his opponent down over 12 rounds.
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Old 09-30-2012, 08:16 PM   #64
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Wow, you are clearly being biased. I am a huge Tyson fan too, but you barely give Lewis credit for his wins against Golota and McCall. What about Mercer, Morrison, and V. klitschko? It's clear that your opinion is irrelevant. Look at your ****ing name and yes I'm aware I have a picture of Tyson as my avatar. I am a Tyson fan but I won't be saying bullshit in order to elevate one of my favorite fighters.

May I recommend tysontalk.com? That forum is more suited for your bullshit words.
How about hyping up very bottom end "world ranked" fighters to make it look as though Tyson had anything left in the tank before the Lewis fight, but then dismiss his prime run when he had at least eight wins over fighters rated in the Top 2 of the division. Makes no sense. Who was he supposed to fight? Dismissing Spinks is ridiculous considering he beat an undefeated Holmes (clearly the first time), dismissing Holmes is ridiculous considering he beat an undefeated Mercer four years after the fact and won several rounds against peak Holyfield, going the distance. Even dismissing someone like Pinklon Thomas is silly considering Holmes looked him over (he was the #1 contender) and tried to pick his way to 49-0 against 'LHW' Spinks to a huge backfire, a green Carl Williams gave him hell, it goes on and on...
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Old 09-30-2012, 09:02 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by irishny
Listen, I know Tyson was a fine fighter. Probably the most dynamic of heavyweights there has been, but he was never as good as his fans made him out to be, and Prime Lewis vs Prime Tyson, Lewis wins every time. Its like Lewis said in the interview on this site. Tyson only knew one way to fight, he had to come forward,jab,weave,get inside and KO you. He could outbox people because he was too short. Did you ever see Tyson dance around the ring flicking out the jab? Of course not, he didnt have the physical tools to do it. His feet were quite slow in the sense of moving around the ring. Lewis on the other hand had the tools to do everything.
Where's the other 215-220 lb fighters who were more coordinated or who moved so fluidly. He was not up against men of much more similar physical dimensions as the lower weights and he was never going to be able to put on back-foot boxing clinics against world-rated HWs. That's only a recipe for defeat and runs the risk of possibly getting himself KTFO in that division. He was cursed to be a come-forward, aggressive natured fighter. It was obviously not a philosophy of his to use his face as a mode of defense and he often effectively jabbed his way in, slipped and countered shots to near perfection, used a variety of angles and planes of movement to create openings, simultaneously able to shuffle his feet quickly into position to gain full leverage on his combinations to the body and head. His defense I do believe was slightly overstated, if energy wasting and used as a tool to get himself into his mid-range sweet spot but it's hard to argue it's effectiveness up through his first 35-37 fights over which he cleaned out most of the division. I think Mike's aggressive style, work rate, effective defense, good chin and lightning quick hands make him just as adept to taking wide points decisions as the next guy and it happened on a few ocassions. He was the P4P #1 fighter - the inaugural actually - for a reason.
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Old 09-30-2012, 09:04 PM   #66
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World class ones round about 31 I'd say
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Old 09-30-2012, 09:07 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by Classic Boxer View Post
Wow, you are clearly being biased. I am a huge Tyson fan too, but you barely give Lewis credit for his wins against Golota and McCall. What about Mercer, Morrison, and V. klitschko? It's clear that your opinion is irrelevant. Look at your ****ing name and yes I'm aware I have a picture of Tyson as my avatar. I am a Tyson fan but I won't be saying bullshit in order to elevate one of my favorite fighters.

May I recommend tysontalk.com? That forum is more suited for your bullshit words.

Calm down, what I said was nothing but the truth. Watch the McCall vs. Lewis rematch and tell me there isn't something wrong with McCall there. And its documented that Golota was injected with lidocaine, a local anesthetic.

Golota even sued his doctor over it

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What about Vitali? Vitali beat him for 6 rounds and the fight was stopped due to a cut. Lewis was getting hammered and everyone knew it. He didn't have the courage to even give him a rematch and ducked into retirement. Many people think Mercer beat Lewis and Morrison was nothing special.

Pinklon Thomas, Tony Tucker, an older Larry Holmes, Michael Spinks, Trevor Berbick and the rest were all good to great fighters. Mike didn't become undisputed champion of the world and the youngest champion ever by beating nobodies. Pinklon Thomas had an iron chin and had never been KOed before ... Tucker was undefeated and was supposed to be the type of fighter Tyson would lose too but Mike beat him clearly .... Larry Holmes resume up to that point was honestly no better than Tyson's and he wasn't that past his prime, as his record after Mike indicates.

Spinks was the linear champion and beat Larry Holmes TWICE and just came off a win over Gerry Cooney. Berbick tried to push and bully Mike around which was supposed to lead to his magical collapse but was hammered so badly he couldn't even get up.
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Old 09-30-2012, 10:44 PM   #68
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Holyroid's cheating antics exposed

Bit someone in an amateur bout

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shows off one of his best combos

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3oyrq4Q5gM&feature=player_embedded[/ame]

Chronic user of steroids and HGH.

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Used his HGH enhanced head as a battering ram, especially in the Tyson bouts where he opened cuts over Mike's eyes in both fights

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1YEUENDwNY[/ame]

Butted Rahman which led to this massive hematoma to develope

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Old 10-01-2012, 04:25 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by KidDynamite View Post
Calm down, what I said was nothing but the truth. Watch the McCall vs. Lewis rematch and tell me there isn't something wrong with McCall there. And its documented that Golota was injected with lidocaine, a local anesthetic.

Golota even sued his doctor over it

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What about Vitali? Vitali beat him for 6 rounds and the fight was stopped due to a cut. Lewis was getting hammered and everyone knew it. He didn't have the courage to even give him a rematch and ducked into retirement. Many people think Mercer beat Lewis and Morrison was nothing special.

Pinklon Thomas, Tony Tucker, an older Larry Holmes, Michael Spinks, Trevor Berbick and the rest were all good to great fighters. Mike didn't become undisputed champion of the world and the youngest champion ever by beating nobodies. Pinklon Thomas had an iron chin and had never been KOed before ... Tucker was undefeated and was supposed to be the type of fighter Tyson would lose too but Mike beat him clearly .... Larry Holmes resume up to that point was honestly no better than Tyson's and he wasn't that past his prime, as his record after Mike indicates.

Spinks was the linear champion and beat Larry Holmes TWICE and just came off a win over Gerry Cooney. Berbick tried to push and bully Mike around which was supposed to lead to his magical collapse but was hammered so badly he couldn't even get up.

You are a ****ing retard. You know that?
One. go look at the tko6 thread. You didn't even watch the fight did you?
You some kind of Klittard in disguise as a Tyson fan faggot? So you can bash Lewis without backlash?

Vitali had one 'clear' round that he won, Lewis was coming back in the 2nd half of the fight and was going to knock Vitali the **** out with that one eye blind going on. Lennox was in the worst shape of his life, 259 pounds fight night weight, and 37 soon to be 38. He was also inactive for over a year. Vitali was hit with an upper cut and hanging on for dear life.


As for Lennox's resume?



Let me break it down for you mr faggot.



Lennox Lewis's career break down
Lewis have the honor of being the only modern day heavyweight to defeat every man he ever faced. He avenged both his fluke defeats in spectacular fashion and have a great resume.
In the case of Lennox, it is not 1 or 2 wins that stands out but his amazing collective body of work that really puts him ahead of the pack. Lewis in his 15th fight fought a undefeated power puncher name Gary Mason. Gary Mason was 35-0 with 34 Knock outs. Let's think for a moment about just how special that is.

Gary Mason's 'padded record' stage consists Tyrell Biggs, James Tillis, Lorenzo Boyd, Alfonzo Ratliff, Ricky Parkey, Donnie Long, James Pritchard, Mark Wills, Everett Martin, Louis Pergaud, Hughroy Currie, Terry Armstrong, David Jaco and Jess Harding. Mason had a 99% knock out ratio heading into the Lewis fight. Lewis was a virtual youngster and he ended up knocking out the knock out artist.

Lewis went on to ko Biggs and Weaver and put up a string of very good performances before entering a 4 men elimination tournament which consisted of

Bowe-Holyfield
Lewis-Ruddock.
Razer Ruddock was one of the most feared punchers in the division and a solid favorite to beat the relatively unknown Brit. Lennox ended up destroying Ruddock in 2 rounds. What followed was one of the most despicable acts known to mankind as Riddick Big ***** Bowe decided to duck Lennox and throw his belt into the trashcan. Cheating Lewis of a possible career defining trilogy. Bowe was dominated by Lewis in the Olympics and never ever wanted to get within 200 miles of Lewis's fists ever again.
Lewis lost motivation, but still managed to come from behind and knock out Frank Bruno (who is a very solid HW and would have been champion today). He also beat Tony Tucker, who is one of the most under rated heavies of the last 3 eras, Tucker went the distance with a prime Tyson and had Tyson fighting confused for stretches.

He lost to Oliver Mccall via a debatable stoppage, regrouped and came back to dominate another underrated fighter in Tommy Morrison. Prime Ray Mercer followed. I hear some people joke about how Mercer was a split decision nail biting fight. These people don't know **** about boxing and should re watch the fight. The match was close and a prime Mercer fought his heart out, but lost steam starting from Round 5 and was eating Lewis right hands, combinations, along with long jabs to the face again and again.
Lewis-Mercer was a very competitive 7-3 affair.

Lewis went on to beat Mccall in the rematch, Lennox caused some sort of mental melt down from Mccall(some people say drugs, I say Lewis's right hand)
Lennox went on to KO the very feared Golota in one round. Golota beat the living crap out of Riddick Bowe for 2 straight fights. His low blows was disgraceful, but it don't change the fact Golota won 90% of the rounds and beat Bowe half to death.
Lewis was a under dog and knocked out Golota in 1 round.

Željko Mavrović was a undefeated iron chin super champion from Europe and Lennox beat him 9-3. At best you can say it was a 8-4 fight. Zeljko had a lot of talent, heart and chin. What happened after the Lewis fight was a shame, a damn shame. To this day, Lewis was the only guy to have beaten Mavrovic, so many others tried, they all failed. With the exception of Lennox.
Prime Shannon Briggs was knocked down numerous times and destroyed by Lennox in the fifth. Some of the most surreal shoulder roll defense was shown by Lewis in that fight. A decade later, a shot Briggs went 12 with a Prime Vitali.

Lewis dominated and embarrassed a still elite Holyfield and won 10-2 on every score card imaginable to the human race. He was cheated by sand Devil Demon Don King. He went on to beat Holyfield again, albeit not as dominant as the first time.

Michael Grant was hyped beyond belief. This ****er was the original Lucian Bute of the HW'S and he was Froched by Lennox. Grant was also 6'8 and a giant super HW with great athletic abilities. People say Golota and Grant didn't do anything after Lennox fought them, of course they didn't. Lewis broke them, they were done.

Lennox went on to fight murderous super puncher David Tua and made Tua look like some kind of fat sparring partner. I had it 12-0 Lewis in the widest most dominant performance of all times when it comes to UD'S.

If you think Wladimir dominated Haye, go watch Lewis-Tua, that is what true domination is all about. Oh btw, that version of Tua would have knocked out Haye in 4-5 Rounds tops.

Lewis avenged his defeat against Rahman by throwing quite possibly one of the most ruthless 1-2 in boxing history and went on to dominate Mike Tyson. Lewis vs Mike is like Calzaghe vs Jones.
Both Mike and Jones was shot, but Calzaghe and Lewis were past their best days as well.

Lennox retired by beating Vitali, despite being a very fat 256+ and heavily under trained. HBO repeatly mentioned how fat and how under conditioned Lewis looked.
Lewis against a Prime Vitali was a war and Lennox was coming on strong in the end. Rounds 4-6, Lennox was pouring it on and Vitali would not have survived past the 8th if the fight was not stopped.


Lennox Lewis is a top 5 ATG Heavyweight.
The boxing world knows this and it is set in stone.
He is a top 1-3 H2H Heavyweight.
Lennox Lewis will beat any version of Tyson.
Lennox Lewis will dominate any era.
Deal with it bitch and don't make me come back to utterly face **** roll you into oblivion.
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Old 10-01-2012, 05:09 AM   #70
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Lewis would dominate any era.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IZtF5sYEKPw"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IZtF5sYEKPw[/ame]
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Old 10-01-2012, 06:03 AM   #71
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I dont think I was ever saying Tyson was prime against Lewis. He was past his best(although arguably so was Lewis).

But that excuse doesnt hold for Holyfield. Tyson was young coming off a brutal win over Bruno for the WBC title. There was a reason he was heavy favorite.

People only made up the past prime thing after the fact.
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Old 10-01-2012, 12:09 PM   #72
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I dont think I was ever saying Tyson was prime against Lewis. He was past his best(although arguably so was Lewis).

But that excuse doesnt hold for Holyfield. Tyson was young coming off a brutal win over Bruno for the WBC title. There was a reason he was heavy favorite.

People only made up the past prime thing after the fact.
how about you use your eyes to see he was past his prime instead of using boxrec
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Old 10-01-2012, 12:27 PM   #73
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More often than not its probably 26-30 but every single person is different & lots of fighters peak early or late depending on circumstances as well as genetics.
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Old 10-02-2012, 04:25 AM   #74
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how about you use your eyes to see he was past his prime instead of using boxrec
How about accpeting that he just came up against a guy he couldnt physically intimdate and walk through and who was simply a far better fighter than anyone else he fought before prison, instead of believing all the hype on tyson.

Its easy to look like an amazing fighter when the guys are scared shitless before they even get in the ring with you.

Its different when they push you back and take your shots and willing to rough YOU up
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Old 10-02-2012, 09:38 AM   #75
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Default Re: Boxers Prime years

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How about accpeting that he just came up against a guy he couldnt physically intimdate and walk through and who was simply a far better fighter than anyone else he fought before prison, instead of believing all the hype on tyson.

Its easy to look like an amazing fighter when the guys are scared shitless before they even get in the ring with you.

Its different when they push you back and take your shots and willing to rough YOU up
So youve never seen prime Tyson have you?
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