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Old 10-07-2012, 01:13 PM   #1
SuzieQ49
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Default Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

1. Clarence Henry- 6'1 185lb
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2. Lee Q Murray- 6'3 205lb
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3. Earl Walls - 6'3 200lb
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4. Henry Flakes- 6'0 190lb
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5. Johnny Summerlin- 6'1 195lb
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6. Harold Carter- 6'0 195lb
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7. Mike DeJohn- 6'3 210lb
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8. Omelio Agramonte- 5'11 190lb
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9. Willie Bean- 6'2 205lb
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10. Dan Bucceroni- 6'2 190lb
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Old 10-07-2012, 01:13 PM   #2
SuzieQ49
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

11. Jimmy Slade- 5'11 180lb
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12. Rusty Payne- 6'0 190lb
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13. Pat Comiskey- 6'3 210lb
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14. Sid Peaks- 6'5 220lb
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15. Johnny Haynes- 6'4 220lb
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Old 10-07-2012, 02:23 PM   #3
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

Great List Suzie, a qualified group but its a funny thing thing the deeper you look into their records and who they lost to makes you have a deeper respect for Archie Moore and his heavyweight run leading up to Marciano. Most of the big guys from that era either lost to someone who lost to Archie or were beaten by him.


Sid Peaks 6'5 was beaten by Rusty Payne 2x by KO and he outweighed Payne by 36 lbs, also Colion Chaney was out weighed by 36 lbs but beat Peaks 2x Elmer Ray stopped Peaks but Peaks only had 15 lbs on him. Elmer Ray went on at 192lbs to get KO'd by 175lb Ezzard Charles.

Earls Walls was KO'd by the 6'4 Abel Cestac who Archie Moore beat 2X

Ezzard Charles also KO'd the 6"4 214lb Johnny Haynes in 1949,Haynes weighed 214 and Charles 179lbs, 185lb Jimmy Bivins stopped the 6"4 214 lb Haynes as well

John Holman was Stopped by Embrel Davidson and 2x byBob Satterfeild who in exchange were KO'd by Archie Moore, and Ezzard KO'd Satterfeild as well.

Funny but they were a freaky bunch of 175-up guys that dominated most of the big men back then, but a very talented few such as Harold Johnson,Archie Moore, Ezzard to name a few.

Bucceroni was on a good roll but lost pretty badly to Roland Lastarza in a rematch, making Roland 53-3 and the man that beat everyone that beat him except for Marciano

Pat Comesky was on a good roll 6'3 214lbs but lost to 6' 192lb Henry Flakes by KO, another funny thing about Big Pat was his only other KO loss was to Max Baer KO in 1

Rusty Payne lost to Moore

Flake had a good record only lost and drew with Colion who in turn was KO'd by Bivins,Ray and Archie Moore

Omelio Agramonte was Ko'd in 7 by Jersey Joe Walcott

Last edited by Bummy Davis; 10-07-2012 at 02:43 PM.
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Old 10-07-2012, 04:01 PM   #4
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

Summerlin looked absolutely cracking when I finally tracked him down on film.
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Old 10-07-2012, 04:50 PM   #5
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

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Summerlin looked absolutely cracking when I finally tracked him down on film.
What does cracking mean?
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Old 10-07-2012, 04:51 PM   #6
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

good
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Old 10-07-2012, 04:57 PM   #7
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

Yes, very. He was a good pressure fighter huh? combined with skilled inside fighting ability. He was also physically strong. Good head movement.
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Old 10-07-2012, 05:01 PM   #8
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

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Summerlin looked absolutely cracking when I finally tracked him down on film.
What footage is that? Satterfield and Machen exist.
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Old 10-07-2012, 05:05 PM   #9
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

In my humble opinion the deepest heavyweight era there's been ever which is why I rate Rocky Marciano so highly - please keep this thread going - and add some to the list aswell
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Old 10-07-2012, 05:05 PM   #10
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

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Originally Posted by Flea Man View Post
What footage is that? Satterfield and Machen exist.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sc0vavDS2wA[/ame]


It was just a nice surprise. I expected him to be a bit goofy, but he was pretty good.
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Old 10-07-2012, 10:18 PM   #11
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

Well, I think there are not a lot of underrated fighters from this era, as most of the contenders fought other top contenders (not something which has always happened) and we can pretty much guage their level.

To me, Clarence Henry seems an odd choice for underrated as he has been voted into a hall of fame despite never rising above #3 contender and having his best wins over Baker and the erratic Satterfield. His two chances against lightheavy champs Johnson and Moore ended in defeats, a one-sided one to Moore. An injury could be blamed, but he didn't accomplish that much versus his high rating in my judgement.

Pat Comiskey I would consider probably overrated, a built-up fighter.

Henry Flakes is a great choice.

Kid Riviera--you really blew it leaving him off. One of those odd mystery men of boxing.
Rivera started slow, but after losing to Savold in 1945 went on a solid 25-3-1 run

defeating--Bill Poland, Abel Cestac, Johnny Shkor, Pat Comiskey, Elmer Ray, Sid Peaks, Willie Bean, Omelio Agramonte, Bill Gilliam

and drawing with the 25-0 Bob Baker in 1951.

*Riviera seems to have almost cleaned out your underrateds.

**I say mystery man because after drawing with Baker, he won three in row, including Agramonte and Gilliam, and then just vanished. Do you know what happened to him?

Despite all these victories, Riviera never appeared in the Ring's yearly rankings. He seems to have been genuinely underrated.

Last edited by edward morbius; 10-08-2012 at 05:03 PM.
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Old 10-07-2012, 11:15 PM   #12
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

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Originally Posted by RockysSplitNose View Post
In my humble opinion the deepest heavyweight era there's been ever which is why I rate Rocky Marciano so highly - please keep this thread going - and add some to the list aswell
In my not so humble opinion, a veritable desert of heavyweight talent... if heavyweights they can even be called. When blown up lightheavies are ruling the roost one has to question where the real heavyweight talent has gone... or if it even exists.

Last edited by Seamus; 10-08-2012 at 12:16 AM.
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Old 10-07-2012, 11:49 PM   #13
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

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Originally Posted by edward morbius View Post
Well, I think there are not a lot of underrated fighters from this era, as most of the contenders fought other top contenders (not something which has always happened, and we can pretty much guage their level.

To me, Clarence Henry seems an odd choice for underrated as he has been voted into a hall of fame despite never rising above #3 contender and having his best wins over Baker and the erratic Satterfield. His two chances against lightheavy champs Johnson and Moore ended in defeats, a one-sided one to Moore. An injury could be blamed, but he didn't accomplish that much versus his high rating in my judgement.

Pat Comiskey I would consider probably overrated, a built-up fighter.

Henry Flakes is a great choice.

Kid Riviera--you really blew it leaving him off. One of those odd mystery men of boxing.
Rivera started slow, but after losing to Savold in 1945 went on a solid 25-3-1 run

defeating--Bill Poland, Abel Cestac, Johnny Shkor, Pat Comiskey, Elmer Ray, Sid Peaks, Willie Bean, Omelio Agramonte, Bill Gilliam

and drawing with the 25-0 Bob Baker in 1951.

*Riviera seems to have almost cleaned out your underrateds.

**I say mystery man because after drawing with Baker, he won three in row, including Agramonte and Gilliam, and then just vanished. Do you know what happened to him?

Despite all these victories, Riviera never appeared in the Ring's yearly rankings. He seems to have been genuinely underrated.

I did think of him before I made my list. I opted to leave him off. After further review, I might have made a mistake. In defense, he did lose to a number of men on my list as well. I'll find out more information on him.
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:53 PM   #14
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

nice collection of photos, deep era with a lot of cross-fighting
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:58 PM   #15
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Default Re: Top 15 underrated heavyweights 1945-1960

Quote:
Originally Posted by edward morbius View Post
Well, I think there are not a lot of underrated fighters from this era, as most of the contenders fought other top contenders (not something which has always happened, and we can pretty much guage their level.

To me, Clarence Henry seems an odd choice for underrated as he has been voted into a hall of fame despite never rising above #3 contender and having his best wins over Baker and the erratic Satterfield. His two chances against lightheavy champs Johnson and Moore ended in defeats, a one-sided one to Moore. An injury could be blamed, but he didn't accomplish that much versus his high rating in my judgement.

Pat Comiskey I would consider probably overrated, a built-up fighter.

Henry Flakes is a great choice.

Kid Riviera--you really blew it leaving him off. One of those odd mystery men of boxing.
Rivera started slow, but after losing to Savold in 1945 went on a solid 25-3-1 run

defeating--Bill Poland, Abel Cestac, Johnny Shkor, Pat Comiskey, Elmer Ray, Sid Peaks, Willie Bean, Omelio Agramonte, Bill Gilliam

and drawing with the 25-0 Bob Baker in 1951.

*Riviera seems to have almost cleaned out your underrateds.

**I say mystery man because after drawing with Baker, he won three in row, including Agramonte and Gilliam, and then just vanished. Do you know what happened to him?

Despite all these victories, Riviera never appeared in the Ring's yearly rankings. He seems to have been genuinely underrated.
Kid Riviera was on quite a roll and he dropped out and he beat Gilliam just before Gilliam beat Valdes, beat Bean in the rematch and Sid Peaks as well....curious to see why he dropped out.
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