How were old timers so good? - Page 10

Seamus · 10-10-2012, 02:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagnaNasakki

People just say he'd "Pressure Wlad and walk him down and fight him because he has the harder chin and he's tougher!" Wlad would want him to do that. Coming forward, onto the jab? Plays completely into his hands. Walking through punches to brawl and break a guy down, Rocky Marciano style, isn't all that easy. It's incredibly difficult, and more often then not, you take too many punches to accomplish your ultimate goal. Younger K is an awful style match up for bigger K.

People, please read this and try to understand.

bremen · 10-10-2012, 02:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagnaNasakki

The trainers were lifers; Guys who fought themselves, who learned from the best, and then dedicated themselves to doing it for others.

The list of guys like this is growing shorter then anybody is comfortable admitting.

Also, experience. Boxing IS experience. There is only so much to learn, actually: How to punch, how to move, how to block and parry, and when to punch. The rest of it is comfort, awareness, presence, conditioning, and all that lovely stuff that 99% of men can only get through rounds. Sparring serves this purpose some, but ultimately, to get a true comfort level and a solid identity as a prizefighter, you need to prizefighter.

Archie Moore, as an overall athlete, doesn't look all that impressive on film. But he is a perfect technician; He dictates fights in every sense. That is experience, grit, and a steely mind that people still talk about. I've heard old timers say that when you sat ringside at a Moore fight, you watched his eyes, his feet, and his waist, and you saw artistry.

This is, in fact, what boxing is actually about, and this mindset is dying out.

You know, when I was a kid my dad used to take me to soccer games. I remember these games as flawless and exciting soccer performances. Then, I started playing myself and then the games never looked perfect anymore. I started seeing mistakes, ways to improve and how I would play it differently. May be the new generation lost it or may be I just did not know any better. Who's to say.

KillSomething · 10-10-2012, 01:57 PM

Any trainer'll tell you that experience is what makes a fighter...sparring, fighting. Back then you had guys straight up fighting all the damn time and sparring in between that. Guys were thrown in with other good fighters regularly. So you had guys fighting more, and their average quality of opponent was way higher. Leads to more mastery of the sport.

thistle1 · 10-10-2012, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillSomething

Any trainer'll tell you that experience is what makes a fighter...sparring, fighting. Back then you had guys straight up fighting all the damn time and sparring in between that. Guys were thrown in with other good fighters regularly. So you had guys fighting more, and their average quality of opponent was way higher. Leads to more mastery of the sport.

BINGO!

and as I said earlier, add to that the Mental Toughness that came with Poverty & Hard times, Very Hard times... everybody was tougher, more resilent and austere.

mochabuzz · 10-10-2012, 02:30 PM

Old Timers were more dedicated & had way less distractions than modern boxers. (especially since the Jet age revolution in the 1960's & the internet revolution of the 1990's).
Modern distractions: smart phones, sports cars, social mediA, etc. It is amazing how a smart phone can be so distracting & completely stop you from having a good ' marvin hagler style' training session.

In short. Old time boxers could focus on their crAft & were less likely to be derailed by societal distractions.

YUZO WANTANABE · 10-10-2012, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mochabuzz

Old Timers were more dedicated & had way less distractions than modern boxers. (especially since the Jet age revolution in the 1960's & the internet revolution of the 1990's).
Modern distractions: smart phones, sports cars, social mediA, etc. It is amazing how a smart phone can be so distracting & completely stop you from having a good ' marvin hagler style' training session.

you know its hard for me to really think of any fighter today who gives me that impression of total sacrifice to the sport anymore. just a guy who lives for the craft of boxing. these guys fight once a year if theyre busy that year. how dedicated can you be to this when you fight once a year and youre already millionaire before the bell ever rings.

KillSomething · 10-10-2012, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YUZO WANTANABE

you know its hard for me to really think of any fighter today who gives me that impression of total sacrifice to the sport anymore. just a guy who lives for the craft of boxing. these guys fight once a year if theyre busy that year. how dedicated can you be to this when you fight once a year and youre already millionaire before the bell ever rings.

Ward actually strikes me that way...guy just works his ass off, is 100% committed, true student of the game, and chills with his family in his free time.

steve w · 10-10-2012, 06:15 PM

Desperation was a factor, victories meant food on the table in real haard times, these guys did not sleep in silk pyjamas and regardless of their fame and status felt an obligation to fight as frequenly as possible, with this, came the extension of their skill set, for the likes of Robinson, Armstrong as examples to fight once or twice a year was unthikable.

YUZO WANTANABE · 10-10-2012, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillSomething

Ward actually strikes me that way...guy just works his ass off, is 100% committed, true student of the game, and chills with his family in his free time.

perhaps of ward but what about his opponents?

Seamus · 10-10-2012, 06:31 PM

The modern boxers are by far the more shredded, more developed and perfected athletes. Their relative prosperity has afforded them more science and thus, more shred. The shreddedness of those old timers leaves just too much to be desired. Seriously, this guy wasn't shredded at all and was a world beater:

Meanwhile, in modern times, we have the most shredded athletes in the history of history. Guys with shred like this are a dime a dozen now.

Compare and contrast the shred and draw your own conclusions.

bremen · 10-10-2012, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillSomething

Any trainer'll tell you that experience is what makes a fighter...sparring, fighting. Back then you had guys straight up fighting all the damn time and sparring in between that. Guys were thrown in with other good fighters regularly. So you had guys fighting more, and their average quality of opponent was way higher. Leads to more mastery of the sport.

Boxing record (amateur + pro) :
W.Klitshcko 192-9
J.Louis 116-7

1974 Word boxing Championship: 274 boxers from 45 countries participating.
2011 Word boxing Championship: 685 boxers from 127 countries participated.

What do you make from that?

dealt_with · 10-11-2012, 03:35 AM

Have you people actually watched the old timers? They most certainly weren't better.

Pachilles · 10-11-2012, 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thistle1

BINGO!

and as I said earlier, add to that the Mental Toughness that came with Poverty & Hard times, Very Hard times... everybody was tougher, more resilent and austere.

I woulda beat the shit out of a prime you

thistle1 · 10-11-2012, 09:26 AM

of course you would have Pach, but not all the other people who think the past was better, ehh?

don't know what your bone is with me, that's a couple of times you've been ignorant to me, though I know one thing for certain, your a credit to your race

.

Flea Man · 10-11-2012, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dealt_with

Have you people actually watched the old timers? They most certainly weren't better.

Have you?

What do you think of Canzoneri Vs Chocolate?

10-10-2012, 01:57 PM	#138
KillSomething Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 3,541 vCash: 157	Re: How were old timers so good? Any trainer'll tell you that experience is what makes a fighter...sparring, fighting. Back then you had guys straight up fighting all the damn time and sparring in between that. Guys were thrown in with other good fighters regularly. So you had guys fighting more, and their average quality of opponent was way higher. Leads to more mastery of the sport.
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10-10-2012, 02:30 PM	#140
mochabuzz Journeyman ESB Jr Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 247 vCash: 1000	Re: How were old timers so good? Old Timers were more dedicated & had way less distractions than modern boxers. (especially since the Jet age revolution in the 1960's & the internet revolution of the 1990's). Modern distractions: smart phones, sports cars, social mediA, etc. It is amazing how a smart phone can be so distracting & completely stop you from having a good ' marvin hagler style' training session. In short. Old time boxers could focus on their crAft & were less likely to be derailed by societal distractions.
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10-10-2012, 06:15 PM	#143
steve w Gatekeeper ESB Full Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 411 vCash: 500	Re: How were old timers so good? Desperation was a factor, victories meant food on the table in real haard times, these guys did not sleep in silk pyjamas and regardless of their fame and status felt an obligation to fight as frequenly as possible, with this, came the extension of their skill set, for the likes of Robinson, Armstrong as examples to fight once or twice a year was unthikable.
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10-10-2012, 06:31 PM	#145
Seamus Undisputed Champion East Side VIP Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Lisboa, Portugal Posts: 10,091 vCash: 1000	Re: How were old timers so good? The modern boxers are by far the more shredded, more developed and perfected athletes. Their relative prosperity has afforded them more science and thus, more shred. The shreddedness of those old timers leaves just too much to be desired. Seriously, this guy wasn't shredded at all and was a world beater: Meanwhile, in modern times, we have the most shredded athletes in the history of history. Guys with shred like this are a dime a dozen now. Compare and contrast the shred and draw your own conclusions. Last edited by Seamus; 10-10-2012 at 07:28 PM.
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10-11-2012, 03:35 AM	#147
dealt_with Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 3,695 vCash: 500	Re: How were old timers so good? Have you people actually watched the old timers? They most certainly weren't better.
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10-11-2012, 09:26 AM	#149
thistle1 Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 3,213 vCash: 1000	Re: How were old timers so good? of course you would have Pach, but not all the other people who think the past was better, ehh? don't know what your bone is with me, that's a couple of times you've been ignorant to me, though I know one thing for certain, your a credit to your race .
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