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Old 10-16-2012, 02:58 AM   #16
JMP
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Default Re: Has Canelo's Hand Speed Improved?...

I think so. I started to really notice it during the Cintron fight. He's developed into one of the most explosive and fast combination punchers in all of the sport. Some of his combinations are downright sickening and are very well-timed. I'm really excited to see how his career unfolds, how he polishes the tools he has, and what ripples he adds to his overall game. He's impressing me more and more in every fight. The kid has the makings of a real superstar who can do serious damage at 154 and eventually 160 as he grows.
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Old 10-16-2012, 10:29 AM   #17
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Default Re: Has Canelo's Hand Speed Improved?...

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Originally Posted by JMP View Post
I think so. I started to really notice it during the Cintron fight. He's developed into one of the most explosive and fast combination punchers in all of the sport. Some of his combinations are downright sickening and are very well-timed. I'm really excited to see how his career unfolds, how he polishes the tools he has, and what ripples he adds to his overall game. He's impressing me more and more in every fight. The kid has the makings of a real superstar who can do serious damage at 154 and eventually 160 as he grows.
you have to ask yourself how many fighters that are undersized (canelos true height is 5'7") have been successful at 160+ in the last 20 years? there is a 5'9" tua, 5'10" tyson, 5'7" montell griffin, 5'8" hagler, 5'9" toney and a 5'9" abraham(both 5'7" duran and 5'9"mugabi had limited success over 154). other than griffen, all these fighters possesed one punch power, something canelo does not have.

so if canelo is succesful at 160(something i give 0 chance as he has already been on queer street with gg in sparring with head gear and 16 ounce gloves) then you will be including him in the aforementioned list of ex-fighters.

when you sit down and think about it, thats how truly delusional some people here are on a guy whos best win is a 35-year-old, b-level ryan rhodes who had already been previously (t)ko'd twice.

tyson, tua, hagler, toney, abraham, griffen...canelo?

the stupidity here on the esb forums never ceases to amaze me.

Last edited by Quincy K; 10-16-2012 at 11:23 AM.
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Old 10-16-2012, 10:35 AM   #18
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Default Re: Has Canelo's Hand Speed Improved?...

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He's referring to an alleged street fight that took place between Canelo and Ulises Solis. Reportedly, Canelo accused Solis of stealing his girlfriend and attacked him at a running track down in Guadalajara and broke his jaw.
the word alleged (presunto) was never used here in mexico when this story was presented by the media. it was only datos(facts). and the datos later presented was that canelo tried to say that his brother is the one that sucker-punched archie when there were independent witnesses that told the contrary.

the media press(prensa) and noticias(news) did not portray canelo in a favorable light here as archie is signifigantly smaller than canelo or any grown man for that matter. it wasnt a bully picking on someone smaller but more of a man beating up a little boy and resorting to sucker-punching him in the process.
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Old 10-16-2012, 10:40 AM   #19
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Default Re: Has Canelo's Hand Speed Improved?...

Yeah, his combinations look quicker.
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Old 10-16-2012, 10:47 AM   #20
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Default Re: Has Canelo's Hand Speed Improved?...

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Originally Posted by Quincy K View Post
you have to ask yourself how many fighters that are undersized (canelos true height is 5'7") have been successful at 160+ in the last 20 years? there is a 5'9" tua, 5'10" tyson, 5'7" montell griffin, 5'8" hagler and a 5'9" abraham(mugabi was 5'9" but never had success over 154). other than griffen, all these fighters possesed one punch power, something canelo does not have.

so if canelo is succesful at 160(something i give 0 chance as he has already been on queer street with gg in sparring with head gear and 16 ounce gloves) then you will be including him in the aforementioned list of ex-fighters.

when you sit down and think about it, thats how truly delusional some people here are on a guy whos best win is a 35-year-old, b-level ryan rhodes who had already been previously (t)ko'd twice.

tyson, tua, hagler, abraham, griffen...canelo?

the stupidity here on the esb forums never ceases to amaze me.
I'm not saying Canelo can match up with the historically good to great middleweights. I'm not stupid enough to think he has that type of potential as a middleweight. But fortunately for him, very few real good fighters exist in the division. I'm confident in saying none of them are historically great middleweights. So against a few years down the road against competition like Quillin, Geale, Proksa, N'Jikam, Lee, Pirog, Jacobs, Macklin, Korobov, etc., I think Canelo would be able to pick up a couple title belts (so long as he doesn't run into GGG in my opinion). I'm not really factoring in Martinez as I think he'll be retired by the time Canelo moves up. But as it stands, I'd favor Martinez to beat him and very possibly via stoppage.
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Old 10-16-2012, 11:07 AM   #21
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Default Re: Has Canelo's Hand Speed Improved?...

They need to give Canelo some hormones ala Messi to make him taller. I agree he is too short to compete at 160. Hell with his height he is too short to be at 154. I would like to see him move down to 147 but he is a thick kid so I really doubt that would happen.
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Old 10-16-2012, 11:18 AM   #22
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Default Re: Has Canelo's Hand Speed Improved?...

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Originally Posted by JMP View Post
I'm not saying Canelo can match up with the historically good to great middleweights. I'm not stupid enough to think he has that type of potential as a middleweight. But fortunately for him, very few real good fighters exist in the division. I'm confident in saying none of them are historically great middleweights. So against a few years down the road against competition like Quillin, Geale, Proksa, N'Jikam, Lee, Pirog, Jacobs, Macklin, Korobov, etc., I think Canelo would be able to pick up a couple title belts (so long as he doesn't run into GGG in my opinion). I'm not really factoring in Martinez as I think he'll be retired by the time Canelo moves up. But as it stands, I'd favor Martinez to beat him and very possibly via stoppage.
i dont think he has a chance for anything at 160. his style is to bully people and he has yet to prove that this style will work against legit, true and prime 154's in molina, lara, vanes, trout or kirkland(both pbf and cotto are not true 154's but 147's).

chavez jr, if he stays at 160, simply walks down canelo and easily beats the shit out of him.

you would be simply amazed on how bad canelo would look at 160 as everyone there would simply not respect him or his power (ala dlh versus sturm, winky versus mosely(154), trinidad versus mayorga) and simply walk him down. this is pretty much what happened in the ggg sparring session(if ggg wanted to finsh canelo he certainly couldve).

there is a very good chance that this is going to happen at 154 once canelo faces a legit and in-their-prime 154.
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Old 10-16-2012, 11:35 AM   #23
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Default Re: Has Canelo's Hand Speed Improved?...

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Originally Posted by saul_ir34 View Post
They need to give Canelo some hormones ala Messi to make him taller. I agree he is too short to compete at 160. Hell with his height he is too short to be at 154. I would like to see him move down to 147 but he is a thick kid so I really doubt that would happen.
in the last 20+years, 154 has historically been a 5'9" to 6'0" division. thats the first thing i see when looking at canelos chances of success. the fact that he doesnt have true one-punch power is also troubling. and then there is his plodding footwork. his feet are very slow with those short stumpy legs. he throws good combinations but has done so only against compromised competition. its easy to look good against someone when youre not afraid of getting punched back in the process. he looks like a jmw version of tommy morrison without the commanding power.

agree with you that if he could make 147 he would rule that division.

at 154, i dont think its going to happen and espesially the way gbp is playing his cards with him.

he shouldve already fought either vanes, kirkland(and not the right shoulder injury version), lara or molina by now and at the very least the 5'6" 39-year-old bundrage.
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Old 10-16-2012, 03:56 PM   #24
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Default Re: Has Canelo's Hand Speed Improved?...

[quote=Quincy K;14004160]i dont think he has a chance for anything at 160. his style is to bully people and he has yet to prove that this style will work against legit, true and prime 154's in molina, lara, vanes, trout or kirkland(both pbf and cotto are not true 154's but 147's).

This is a great post & very true...
Great talent who has fought nobody...just blown up Jr WW & WW...
Kind of reminds me of Bute...kind of
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