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Old 10-18-2012, 05:19 AM   #61
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

Alright to send me the rest when you get the chance Al'?

Thanks for that, awesome.
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Old 10-18-2012, 05:47 AM   #62
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

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Alright to send me the rest when you get the chance Al'?

Thanks for that, awesome.
I will, i'll start scanning some stuff tonight.
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Old 10-18-2012, 07:23 AM   #63
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

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Here's a start on what of written on the subject, there is plenty more to come but i want to get something down before the thread gets sabotaged.

It's a subject I've wondered about myself and I'm sure dad did. I don't thinkl he would of had a problem finding quality contenders.
Most likely there would of been a return with Harada in London or even Liverpool. Dad really fancied his chances in a return, he felt he could of pressed Harada more and earlier in the fight. He hadn't boxed 15 rounds before and was a bit worried about going the distance, he knew he wasn't a particularly big puncher and always prepared for the full distance with that in mind. He was a big underdog, Harada had won the title against the great Jofrel and the fight was in Japan. As it happens he finished strongly, stronger than Harada with plenty left in the tank.
Trust me, nobody has watched that fight more than me and with dad talking through it. I thought the fight was a lot closer than the two Japanese judges scored it. It was a sign of things to come when did slipped at the end of the first after throwing an overhand right. He'd had a pretty bright start but the 2 Japanese scored it 5-3. Harada took a knee late on in the fight but there was no count for that. There was a lot of quality infighting in this bout, Harada caught dad quite often with lead rights over the top when he was short with the jab. Dad did a lot of effective body shots which took their toll on harada late in the fight when Harada was looking for a breather, grabbing, wrestling and throwing punches in bursts. Dad stood with him in these exchanges and usually got the last shot off. He had good spells where he outboxed Harada throwing left jabs, straight rights and coming back with the left hook to keep H off balance. He was also throwing good body shots from the outside and right uppercuts under the heart. He held centre ring and refused to be bullied to the ropes. Me dad said Harada was one of the strongest he fought and very fast. He had to keep his wits about him at all times and not only was it a physically draining fight it was mentally draining as well. Harada said that dad was the fastest man he'd fought and trying to hit him was like trying to hit a fish in deep water. He didn't consider Harada a particularly big puncher buit he was sharp. There is a good exchange in the 7th where dad was having a good round making H miss, they engaged at one point both landing right hands simultaneously with both of their legs dipping. Dad told me while watching it that he remembered that particular shot but both of them carried on throwing bombs. People don't consider H a big puncher but he's the only fighter I'ves seen really shake Jofre up in that 1st fight, 4th round. I believe that most fighters at that level can hurt you no matter who you are if you can land cleanly.
There is talk of Harada's weight problems and he did balloon between fights. He did taough stay at bantam for another 2 and a half years, he was a former fly champ and still a young man, 22 I think. Judge Nicky Pope scored it 72-70, 5 rounds to 3 with 10 even. You think some of them could of went either way and it shows how competitive it was. All in all, dad didn't argue about the decision, it was over there and maybe he could of done more. He'd put up a good show and had consolidated his world rating. He'd come from nowhere in 65. He started out as British tiltle contender, won the title from Caldwell, former world claimant, shutout reigning European champ and world top 5, Mimoun Ben Ali over 10 in Newcastle, stopped a Mexican and then finished with the shot against Harada. He was awarded the "Ring" prospect of the year award and was on the world scene.

To follow, the other contenders.
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Cheers Al, this is top. Hope there's more to come if/when you have the time.
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Old 10-18-2012, 08:33 AM   #64
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

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Cheers Al, this is top. Hope there's more to come if/when you have the time.
Cheers, there is. I've already wrote something on Jofre, just got to get a moment to get it down on here.
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Old 10-18-2012, 02:51 PM   #65
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

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Eder beat him twice imo. I believe homecooking won Harada the fights. Even though they were fairly close fights. The first one was anyway.

Thought Harada won both tbh. Close though obviously.
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Old 10-18-2012, 02:57 PM   #66
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

Thought Harada won both, certainly no justification in accusing 'home cooking' IMO.
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Old 10-18-2012, 03:12 PM   #67
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

I gave Jofre the first, but it was by a thin enough margin that I don't think he was robbed.
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Old 10-18-2012, 03:12 PM   #68
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

Two different fights, I thought Harada won both as well.
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Old 10-19-2012, 07:14 AM   #69
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

Jofre

Apart from a return with Harada, Jofre was also in the mix for a challenge if dad had beaten Harada.
Dad was in the running for a title fight with for Jofre's crown in 1965 after beating Caldwell and Ben Ali impressively. Harry Levene was trying to bring him over to England. Jofre had the Harada fight to get out of the way first, it wasn't really considered that Jofre would lose his title to Harada so that all fell through. Walter McGowan was also in talks with Jofre's people at this time, he had to get past Joe Medel in what was virtually an eliminator, Medel was no. 1 contender for the title.
Jofre was obviously a great fighter but I think 65-66 would of been a good ytime to fight him. I've wondered wether he really was having problems with the weight, he'd looked great it seems against Carabello and he only weighed 116 for Harada in the return, maybe there's a story behind that. It's possible that he just lost focus round that time, there was the draw with Manny Elias in Brazil though by all accounts he did win that fight but Elias did take rounds of him and was a good pressure fighter. Me dad fought Elias in 68 and shut him out. He did say that Elias was a real tough nut and hard to catch cleanly only offering the top of his head but dad ended up hitting him with every shot in the book and boxed well within himself. It was a good workout, not worth damaging your hands to get a ko on your ledger. Elias went on to box Jofre in 1970 up at feather going down on a clear points decision which sounds like a similar fight to me dad's. Elias had got himself a world rating with the draw against Jofre but back to back losses in Japan to World rated Katsuo Saito and Yoshio Yakane. Both these fights were split decisions so chances are they could of gone either way. Elias with better breaks might of achieved more, a quality fighter.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzsLyuYAoeE[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkMBWR01IBc&feature=relmfu[/ame]

Obviously there is the possibility that Harada was just a stylistic nightmare for Jofre, he might of caused him problems at any time.
All in all and I'm not saying dad would of beat Jofre but 65-66 would of been the best time to fight him, dad came back from the Harada with 3 good wins against Mexicans. Felipe Gonzalez, Edmundo Esparza and Raul Vega. Gonzalez was the first man to take Olivares the distance and ko'd Chucho Castillo in his next fight. Esparza held a points win over Fighting Harada in Japan in 62 only 6 months before Harada crushed Pone Kingpetch to win his first title. Dad said Esparza was real tricky ion the Mexican mould. Early in the fight he was trying to draw dad in to the ropes. A couplre of times dad followed him in only to be met with crunching right uppercuts. He soon got wise and boxed from the centre then closing on Esparza in the second half and taking him to the ropes on his own terms punching out a good points win.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCGPBbSOPnM[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8jAXBFuhRA&feature=relmfu[/ame]


Vega was a good puncher with a few 1st round kayoes on his ledger. Dad was badly cut in this fight needing plastic surgery afterwards. He showed his versatility in taking a good points decision boxfighting and protecting the cuts at the same time.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GsKVZhSgp8[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j76w85FgWY0&feature=relmfu[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cL5xVYHbSuM&feature=relmfu[/ame]

He got the ring fighter of the month on these showings, all 3 fights were within a couple of months.


Rudkin Jofre common opponents

Caldwell Jofre TKO 10 1962
Rudkin TKO 10 1965

Harada Jofre L pts 15 1965
L pts 15 1966
Rudkin L pts 15 1965

Elias Jofre D 10 1965
Jofre W pts 10 1970
Rudkin W pts 10 1968

Corona Jofre W KO 6 1969
Rudkin W TKO 7 1968

Bisbal Jofre KO 2 1972
Rudkin W pts 10 1966

Here's my take on the Jofre Harada fights by the way.

I thought Jofre boxed the wrong fight in the first fight. He didn't/couldn't make the most of his jab, he allowed Harada to bully him to the ropes for long periods and didn't throw enough body shots. He did on the other hand throw some beautiful combinations off the ropes and it was a fight all the way. He seemed to me to be looking for the big shot, maybe he'd seen the Medel fight. I thought Harada won and for me this was the best he looked. Great movement, great footwork, ring generalship, just brilliant boxing, the complete fighter.

Here's my scorecard with notes I made.
Harada Jofre

1 10 9 jab, workrate, body shots

2 10 9 busy busy, Jofre 1st half, close

3 10 9 close

4 10 9 big, Jofgre hurt

5 9 10 clear, untidy but effective hooking

6 9 10 H fighting in bursts, Jofre busier

7 10 9 H picking shots and smothering

8 9 10 slashing left hooks, worked hard

9 10 9 the jab, rights through middle

10 9 10 H coasting

11 10 9 H jab working, close round, Jofre second half

12 10 9 good round, beat J to punch and smothering

13 10 9 busier, J tired

14 9 10 clear

15 9 10 close

Harada 69 Jofre 66

Harada Jofre 2

Harada Jofre

1 9 10 J busier, centre of the ring boxing

2 9 10 centre ring dropping in rights behind the jab

3 10 9 H clear round, bullying and boxing well, rough

4 10 9 H closed the distance, smothered Jofre, boxed well. J on ropes
but lande good counters (close)

5 10 9 H clear round, controlling the tempo, Jofre not happy on
ropes, warning for headwork.

6 10 9 H controlled round off jab, good body shots, j couldn't settle.

7 9 10 very close, h doing his thing but Jofre good counters

8 9 10 H untidy, J landing good shots on the inside. H second half
success on ropes but J counterpunching well. Physical round!

9 10 9 H dominated boxing, J tired, H more relaxed in second half.

10 10 9 Great start to round for Jofre with rights but H steps up for
last 2 minutes, close round

11 9 10 Very untidy round, J cleaner shots, H looking tired

12 9 10 Good Jofre round, jabs and rights over top, centre ring

13 10 9 Hard fought close round, both tired. H more work though some
of it sloppy

14 10 9 Good start to round by J. H catches him with head on cheek
which unsettles J. H finishes round strongly landing flush.

15 10 9 H good first half then smothers J for remainder.

Harada 69 Jofre 66

By the way if anyone wants to do this for the Harada- Rudkin fight, I'd be interested in hearing it, however you see it, no problems.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLpruf2DIO4[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSNCYxFdXsM&feature=relmfu[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEf03Fy5skA&feature=relmfu[/ame]

Last edited by AlFrancis; 10-20-2012 at 05:18 AM.
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Old 10-19-2012, 07:27 AM   #70
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

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Originally Posted by Flea Man View Post
Thought Harada won both, certainly no justification in accusing 'home cooking' IMO.
Same opinion.

Jofre looked past his prime.
Harada looked excellent.
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Old 10-19-2012, 09:13 AM   #71
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

Alan that post is ****ing epic mate.
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Old 10-19-2012, 04:27 PM   #72
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

Thanks for the videos Al.Saw a lot of these at the time but just reminds us what a terrific boxer your Dad was.Remember apart from the close calls abroad him beating Johnny Clark who IMO would have been dominant otherwise in the UK.Were strong at bantam now but even better then.McGowan also was great and was beating Medel till he got caught.My Sunday paper round used to take me ages as after the football or cricket I used to read Frankie Taylors People column in which as youd expect your Dad featured heavily.
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Old 10-20-2012, 04:54 AM   #73
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

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Alan that post is ****ing epic mate.

Cheers Flea
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Old 10-20-2012, 05:14 AM   #74
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

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Originally Posted by TED 822 View Post
Thanks for the videos Al.Saw a lot of these at the time but just reminds us what a terrific boxer your Dad was.Remember apart from the close calls abroad him beating Johnny Clark who IMO would have been dominant otherwise in the UK.Were strong at bantam now but even better then.McGowan also was great and was beating Medel till he got caught.My Sunday paper round used to take me ages as after the football or cricket I used to read Frankie Taylors People column in which as youd expect your Dad featured heavily.
Thanks Ted
You're right about Clark Ted, great little fighter. He was unlucky to be around at the same time as me dad. When dad fought him in 1970 they were both rated in the world top 5. When dad retired in 1972 he did become the dominant champ. Unlucky for him he developed a detatched retina which cost him a shot at Rafael Herrera and his career. I've got a load of Johns fights and he was in some wars. Here he is against dad in 72.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NX20xAsQB5A&list=UUrvak_OQRv9tVeny0orInCQ&index=20&feature=plcp[/ame]

Here he is winning the vacant titles against Paddy Maguire after dad's retirement. This fight is a forgotten classic, what a war!

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0eDJxnjPAs[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n-GeXjmk-8&feature=relmfu[/ame]


Frankie Taylor was a great little fighter. He won a gold in the European ams in 61. The feat wasn't repeated by a british fighter for nearly 50 years. He was a golden boy and him and dad regularly met up as amateurs to spar together. Frank talked dad into signing with Bobby Neill and their stable became the no.1 in Britain. Dad said him and Frank had a war every time they stepped into the ring together(sparring). It was going great for Frank until he ran into an unknown fighter from the Dominican Republic called Carlos Teo Cruz, anyone remember him? That fight finished him really and he retired with eye damage. I last spoke to Frankie two years ago at dad's funeral, he's in good health. Ironically he is now anti boxing though he thinks the amateur game is ok.

Here they as as young lads back in 62-63

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Dad, Bobbie Neill, Frankie, Freddie Hill and Brian McCaffrey.
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Old 10-20-2012, 05:17 AM   #75
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Default Re: If Alan Rudkin had beaten Fighting Harada...

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Originally Posted by TED 822 View Post
Thanks for the videos Al.Saw a lot of these at the time but just reminds us what a terrific boxer your Dad was.Remember apart from the close calls abroad him beating Johnny Clark who IMO would have been dominant otherwise in the UK.Were strong at bantam now but even better then.McGowan also was great and was beating Medel till he got caught.My Sunday paper round used to take me ages as after the football or cricket I used to read Frankie Taylors People column in which as youd expect your Dad featured heavily.
Quality post, thanks for your recollections.

I'll get to uploading Medel Vs McGowan to youtube if you haven't seen it recently? Let me know TED
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