The "Whine About Mayweather/Pacquiao" Express!!!!!!

[turbotime]

Originally Posted by JohnAnthony

yes, that's a good one actually

Although Jones is Borderline. Plus i'd say Calzaghe is borderline too.

Not sure what point youre even trying to prove with this thread

Beating a prime ATG doesn't make you an ATG, anyways. Resume needs to be judged as a whole.

[ROACH]

Floyd has an opportunity to fight an ATG who is at least close to his prime, so it may very well happen in the near future.

[tliang1000]

Originally Posted by JohnAnthony

we're looking back at there careers now. The career doesn't have to be over to know they are going to be an ATG.

Listen, you obviously can't figure this out, so i reccomend you move on before you pop a brain cell.

You need some brain cells. You don't even know wtf are you on about.

[JohnAnthony]

Originally Posted by turbotime

Not sure what point youre even trying to prove with this thread

Beating a prime ATG doesn't make you an ATG, anyways. Resume needs to be judged as a whole.

they don't have to have beaten them. My point is, is floyd the only fighter at his level, thats fought through the amount of weight classes he has, but never hat to face any prime ATG's his whole career.

Or are there others that I can't think of.

[tliang1000]

John, I do want to hear your Answer on how can Trinidad be considered as an ATG when he fought Oscar when the only guys on his resumes were Whitker and Camacho who were both way out of prime? now how is ur example not bullcrap?

[JohnAnthony]

Originally Posted by tliang1000

John. Answer me this how can Trinidad be considered as an ATG when he fought Oscar when the only guys on his resumes were Whitker and Camacho who were both way out of prime? now how is ur example not bullcrap?

yes but knowng what we know now. He was a prime ATG. I see what your saying. But floyd has basically had his career now, he's past his prime so everything that happens now is mute. We're looking back.

[JohnAnthony]

Originally Posted by tliang1000

John, I do want to hear your Answer on how can Trinidad be considered as an ATG when he fought Oscar when the only guys on his resumes were Whitker and Camacho who were both way out of prime? now how is ur example not bullcrap?

THis is the last time i'll explain it. I'm not saying they have to have been thoughto of as an ATG the day they fought.

But looking back now, we know which fighters were ATG and we know when there primes were.

We know Trinidad is an ATG, and we know his prime was at 147 - 154.

They weren't calling him an ATG when he was fighting Oscar but thats not what i'm asking.

[JohnAnthony]

I disagree with people saying there were never options.

I'd say he had chances with Kosta, Manny, Sergio, but thats probably it.

And this isn't a thread about why those fights didnt happen

[Xerant]

Originally Posted by JohnAnthony

definetly one theory. Are there any other fighters at his level that have fought in as many weight classes, ranked as high, yet never had to fight a Prime ATG?

since your trying hard at beeing serious on this,heres my take. Floyd had a shit load of skillz coming up. All his,way up to DLH he owned good fighters. After DLH he just cash in on all the hate and he,was calling the shot. So would you jump off your house for 1 million or would you jump of your car for the same money. It sucks very much I agree that in this diva generation we could not get the best matchup we could. Have fun getting bitch at and love.

Gotta hate negociation

[tliang1000]

Originally Posted by JohnAnthony

yes but knowng what we know now. He was a prime ATG. I see what your saying. But floyd has basically had his career now, he's past his prime so everything that happens now is mute. We're looking back.

I know u see what i'm saying, you just didn't think this thread through. It is a sad attempt to discredit Floyd.

If you think Trinidad by him beating up some past prime = ATG then you need some serious help.

Floyd was fighting undefeated in prime dude in Corrales which is much tougher achievement than beating up past prime. If anything Floyd deserves more credit.

[JohnAnthony]

Originally Posted by Xerant

since your trying hard at beeing serious on this,heres my take. Floyd had a shit load of skillz coming up. All his,way up to DLH he owned good fighters. After DLH he just cash in on all the hate and he,was calling the shot. So would you jump off your house for 1 million or would you jump of your car for the same money. It sucks very much I agree that in this diva generation we could not get the best matchup we could. Have fun getting bitch at and love.

Gotta hate negociation

I agree with all you said.

I don't think any one has played it as well as floyd.

And if i could have had anyone's careers in Boxing id' pick floyd.

Guy will probably retire with alot of money and his health in tact. With every sucking his nuts about how good he is.

[tliang1000]

Originally Posted by JohnAnthony

I agree with all you said.

I don't think any one has played it as well as floyd.

And if i could have had anyone's careers in Boxing id' pick floyd.

Guy will probably retire with alot of money and his health in tact. With every sucking his nuts about how good he is.

John, i've seen ur posts for a long time to know that you favor pac and discredit Floyd's. Just like this thread. You throw Pac name out as if he achieve the beating a "in prime ATG" which he didn't but yet u still throw his name out. Not too mention that both of their resume are practically identical. The only thing that seperates Floyd and Manny is that Manny have more weight divisions and more past prime greats. I could easily look at Pac's resume on paper and give him a higher ranking than Floyd but in reality he cherry picked much better than Floyd fighting guys who is coming off losses and weight drains them. Those matches hurt Pac's legacy. If he didn't cherry pick so much i would've rank him higher than Floyd.

[Webbiano]

Tliang your an idiot. Yes an ATG is decided when someone's career is done and dusted, however there is a specific point I someone's career where they are in their 'prime' for example: Foreman in 73, Holmes in 79-82, Ali in 67, Frazier in 69-70, SRL at WW from 79-82, Tommy Hearns at LMW from 82-84, Mayweather from 98-01 at SFW, Mosley from 97-99 at LW etc. That is a definition of a prime ATG (depending how you feel about Mosley and Floyd obviously) a great fighter, fighting at their best weight, at the best stage of their career.

Now we have that dumbass issue out the way of what a prime ATG is and let's look through Floyds resume. The two fighters that could be considered ATGs that where in their prime is Jose Luis Castillo (personally I feel he was slightly before his very best) but that is being a bit picky. The other is obviously Corrales, however if you believe the weight issues Diego was having, then you could strike that from the record. (again could be me being a it picky)

They are the only two, however I'm aware a few names may come up so I'll deal with them accordingly. Genaro Hernandez: not good enough to compete with the very best in the world, JMM: his best weight was either Super Feather or Lightweight, Hatton: past
his best slightly and light welterweight is clearly his best weight and Mosley: yes he looked good against Margarito, but his best days at welterweight where well past him, let alone his best days in his career as a whole which where at lightweight.

[JohnAnthony]

Originally Posted by Webbiano

Tliang your an idiot. Yes an ATG is decided when someone's career is done and dusted, however there is a specific point I someone's career where they are in their 'prime' for example: Foreman in 73, Holmes in 79-82, Ali in 67, Frazier in 69-70, SRL at WW from 79-82, Tommy Hearns at LMW from 82-84, Mayweather from 98-01 at SFW, Mosley from 97-99 at LW etc. That is a definition of a prime ATG (depending how you feel about Mosley and Floyd obviously) a great fighter, fighting at their best weight, at the best stage of their career.

Now we have that dumbass issue out the way of what a prime ATG is and let's look through Floyds resume. The two fighters that could be considered ATGs that where in their prime is Jose Luis Castillo (personally I feel he was slightly before his very best) but that is being a bit picky. The other is obviously Corrales, however if you believe the weight issues Diego was having, then you could strike that from the record. (again could be me being a it picky)

They are the only two, however I'm aware a few names may come up so I'll deal with them accordingly. Genaro Hernandez: not good enough to compete with the very best in the world, JMM: his best weight was either Super Feather or Lightweight, Hatton: past
his best slightly and light welterweight is clearly his best weight and Mosley: yes he looked good against Margarito, but his best days at welterweight where well past him, let alone his best days in his career as a whole which where at lightweight.

thanks, i'm done trying to explain. 5 pages, and he still don't get what a prime ATG is.
And i agree in Coralles and Castillo are his 2 best wins and were in prime. (i'm happy to give fighters longer primes than most) Most posters on here think fighters are prime for one fight)

I think floyd has 4 wins of prime HOF'ers (Cotto, Hatton, Coralles and Castillo)
None of these are 1st ballot imo and none are ATG;s

[MichiganWarrior]

Pacquiao.

Barrera past his best. As was Morales. JMM arguable iffy decisions