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Old 11-01-2012, 01:24 PM   #16
jimmyonebomb
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

At the higher levels of amatuer and in the pros, yes think they could be great.

But feel at a lower level you should use your time more effectively shadow boxing, getting fit, an sharpening skills. For example i will be having my first fight staurday, but also have a job were i reguarly work 12 hours a day, have a young baby etc, so if i get a precious hour a day to train, then ill base it as much on actual boxing with circuts mixed in as possible rather than strength training like squat, weighted pull ups etc. If i had time id do it all and become a contender!!!
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Old 11-02-2012, 09:16 AM   #17
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

Honestly, Chavez probably did have a S&C coach. I dont see very many pro fighters (MMA or Boxing) making it too far without a S&C coach or a coach that has solid S&C knowledge.


A pro fighter without a good S&C program would be like a pro basketball team from the 60's that practiced little to no S&C going up against a pro basketball team from today.


Its not that the teams back then werent as athletic and didnt stay in great shape. Its just that today they have S&C so fine tuned it makes what they did back then look ridiculous. Not only that they have S&C fine tuned to specific sports so a fighters S&C program isnt exacty the same as a basketball players or football players S&C program.


Alot of people say the S&C they have today overtrains people. Its actually the opposite, back in the day the attitude was the more you work the more you gain and the way the worked back then caused way more overtraining than the way we do today.
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Old 11-02-2012, 04:30 PM   #18
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

Alot of people say the S&C they have today overtrains people. Its actually the opposite, back in the day the attitude was the more you work the more you gain and the way the worked back then caused way more overtraining than the way we do today.[/quot
Dont agree there, they knew what they were doing in most cases. My thoughts when young were the same. But over the years talking to the old School, make no mistake, they knew what they were doing as regards condition. They knew when Guys were over trained.
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Old 11-02-2012, 05:19 PM   #19
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

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Alot of people say the S&C they have today overtrains people. Its actually the opposite, back in the day the attitude was the more you work the more you gain and the way the worked back then caused way more overtraining than the way we do today.[/quot
Dont agree there, they knew what they were doing in most cases. My thoughts when young were the same. But over the years talking to the old School, make no mistake, they knew what they were doing as regards condition. They knew when Guys were over trained.
Trainers back in the day did everything, including rubdowns. They didn't have college degrees, or fancy credentials but they knew what they knew through watching and learning and gathering experience. I would say they were pretty successful, look at the long list of HOF, and ATG's they trained without no stinkin' S&C guys. I am not totally anti-S&C guys, I feel they have a place on a team. Lets put it like this, a good boxing coach doesn't need a S&C guy as much as the S&C guy needs a good boxing coach.
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Old 11-02-2012, 05:22 PM   #20
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

It seems nowadays, they are hired to make some tonics
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Old 11-02-2012, 06:02 PM   #21
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

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Originally Posted by scrap View Post
Alot of people say the S&C they have today overtrains people. Its actually the opposite, back in the day the attitude was the more you work the more you gain and the way the worked back then caused way more overtraining than the way we do today.[/quot
Dont agree there, they knew what they were doing in most cases. My thoughts when young were the same. But over the years talking to the old School, make no mistake, they knew what they were doing as regards condition. They knew when Guys were over trained.


Yeah I agree Scrap, when it comes to good coaches especially. I just meant today it is common knowledge that rest is better alot of times. Where as back in the day many coaches could of had a push push push attitude and had no knowledge otherwise (not neccessarily boxing but in sports as a whole).
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Old 11-02-2012, 06:23 PM   #22
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

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Lets put it like this, a good boxing coach doesn't need a S&C guy as much as the S&C guy needs a good boxing coach.


I agree, there has always been S&C, the only difference is today more people specialize in S&C and the overall knowldedge we have on S&C far exceeds that of what was readily available back then.
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Old 11-02-2012, 06:32 PM   #23
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

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Yeah I agree Scrap, when it comes to good coaches especially. I just meant today it is common knowledge that rest is better alot of times. Where as back in the day many coaches could of had a push push push attitude and had no knowledge otherwise (not neccessarily boxing but in sports as a whole).
Look at Jesse Owens in 36, as an example. His Olympic time stood till 1960, and it was not a cinder Track, that it was beaten on. equipment has improved for sure. I use to get invited by a University, which has supposedly the Best Sports Science Department, in the Country. Too discuss the practicality, off what they had learned, Final year students, they were. They had no concept of the practical appliance, of what they had learned, it shook me.
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Old 11-02-2012, 07:51 PM   #24
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

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Look at Jesse Owens in 36, as an example. His Olympic time stood till 1960, and it was not a cinder Track, that it was beaten on. equipment has improved for sure. I use to get invited by a University, which has supposedly the Best Sports Science Department, in the Country. Too discuss the practicality, off what they had learned, Final year students, they were. They had no concept of the practical appliance, of what they had learned, it shook me.


It seems they were at least trying to get people in there who had knowledge on applying what they learned lol. Thats crazy they didnt know anything tho.
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Old 11-03-2012, 11:36 AM   #25
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

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Look at Jesse Owens in 36, as an example. His Olympic time stood till 1960, and it was not a cinder Track, that it was beaten on. equipment has improved for sure. I use to get invited by a University, which has supposedly the Best Sports Science Department, in the Country. Too discuss the practicality, off what they had learned, Final year students, they were. They had no concept of the practical appliance, of what they had learned, it shook me.
What university students in any field have a concept of the practical appliance of what they learned? Especially something as multifaceted as sports science.
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Old 11-03-2012, 02:42 PM   #26
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

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What university students in any field have a concept of the practical appliance of what they learned? Especially something as multifaceted as sports science.
I suppose so , thing is theres not many do, according to one Guy I know that do. He was asked to take over probably, one of the.biggest jobs in Sport. Two weeks later, when was He starting I asked. He said He wasnt because, it would take Him, 18 months to Sack the lot of them, they had not got a clue.
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Old 11-03-2012, 05:15 PM   #27
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

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What university students in any field have a concept of the practical appliance of what they learned? Especially something as multifaceted as sports science.



Good point...
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Old 11-05-2012, 01:01 PM   #28
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

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Good point...
Thats right but thats the first thing they throw at you, their credentials, "I have a master's degree in S&C, from Sakkachips university, and have worked with all kinds of athletes, Hockey Players, football players, basketball, and baseball." Thats fine have you ever trained a boxer? "Er' no but his muscle fiber, twitch muscles, explosive power, blah, blah, blah". Actual conversation with an S&C coach.
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Old 11-05-2012, 04:02 PM   #29
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

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Thats right but thats the first thing they throw at you, their credentials, "I have a master's degree in S&C, from Sakkachips university, and have worked with all kinds of athletes, Hockey Players, football players, basketball, and baseball." Thats fine have you ever trained a boxer? "Er' no but his muscle fiber, twitch muscles, explosive power, blah, blah, blah". Actual conversation with an S&C coach.
And your point is?
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Old 11-05-2012, 05:47 PM   #30
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Default Re: The ATG fighter's didnt need no stinkin' Strength and conditioners

why hasnt anyone mentioned that those ATG's
fought others just like them who
who also did not use S and C coaches


so that kills the whole point of your thread


and as far their coaches being these know it all around
trainers,
well these are the same coaches who though weight training
was evil
and sometimes had their fighters running outside wearing boots
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