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Old 07-04-2008, 05:43 AM   #31
zadfrak
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Default Re: I Larry Holmes had never been

Yeah Bummy, but the big X factor in all of this is still Cooney. I would've liked to see him nutured very early on by an Eddie Futch or Gil Clancy or Angie Dundee. And have those guys do their sculpting with him from day 1. If anyone was capable of a lot of defenses, it just may have been that particular version of a Gerry Cooney, if he had that type of boxing pedigree.

Thoughts?
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Old 07-04-2008, 03:08 PM   #32
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Default Re: I Larry Holmes had never been

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Originally Posted by zadfrak
Yeah Bummy, but the big X factor in all of this is still Cooney. I would've liked to see him nutured very early on by an Eddie Futch or Gil Clancy or Angie Dundee. And have those guys do their sculpting with him from day 1. If anyone was capable of a lot of defenses, it just may have been that particular version of a Gerry Cooney, if he had that type of boxing pedigree.

Thoughts?

Cooney had his weaknesses but his hook and size were strengths. I dont think Gerry really had the utmost confidence. I do agree that a fighter trained early on by a great master makes a Large difference. Joe Louis had Chappie Blackburn, Marciano had Charley Goldman, Ali had Dundee,Duran had Arcel and Brown. Victor Vallee did a good job with Gerry but 2, 1 rd blowouts in 2 yrs did not really prepare Cooney for a 15 rd fight with Holmes but The wacko twins wanted to make the money with an undfeated fighter as opposed to a prepared one. Jerry Quarry was another guy who had a natural Solid chin and Power but early on mistrained by his father and later on trained by Clancy but his body was in decline. Fighter with great assets like Nick Wells (power) were ruined as pro's and Willie Dewitt from Canada was ruined by taking Mark Tessman as a trainer instead of a master to mold a talent. Mark Breland, and Howard Davis Jr. could have been better fighters with a Master in there corner
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Old 07-05-2008, 03:52 AM   #33
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Default Re: I Larry Holmes had never been

Agreed.

You just rarely see the C grade corner coming out with the win against the A corners. And you also need a guy that'll listen to the corner===but you have had the rare breeds that do it all their own way like later day Foreman & Eubank.

I always look at the corner/manager/promoter of a guy. And in that Holmes fight, that Cooney braintrust was in way over their head. Just like the downhill skier, these guys were way over the tip of their ski's and it's hard to not crash land. I'm not sure even if you reversed corners that Holmes still wouldn't jab the guy to death though.
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Old 11-05-2012, 01:38 PM   #34
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Default Re: I Larry Holmes had never been

Norton would hold on to the title for 7-9 months until a fight with Shavers creates a loss.Shavers loses the fight to the first really talented fighter he faces, but if Jimmy Young is added into the equation, say late '78-early '79, he decisions Shavers, and then makes a couple of sucessful defenses, then loses to Michael Dokes in early '81.Dokes holds on to the belt for 3 years, losing to Mitch Green in an upset.Green then quickly loses the belt in a rematch to Dokes, who then loses to Carl Williams.
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Old 11-05-2012, 01:48 PM   #35
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Default Re: I Larry Holmes had never been

I would answer your question, but I'm too busy thinking about Larry Holmes as a skater now... he always did have pretty nice legs...
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Old 11-12-2012, 03:47 AM   #36
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Default Re: I Larry Holmes had never been

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I get the feeling that Mike Weaver might have slipped through the net at some point.
Exacly what i thought he definatley could have, dont think he would of been champion for long though
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Old 11-12-2012, 07:11 AM   #37
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Default Re: I Larry Holmes had never been

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Say that Larry Holmes had taken up figure skating instead of boxing.

This is a rather interesting what if when you look at the eratic talent of the 80s. Clearly the lineal title would have changed hands frequently like it did in the early 30s.

My questions to those more knowledgable about the 80s than myself are-

What would the lineage of the heavyweight title have been?

Who would have capitalized on Homses absence to become "the man"?

Could anybody have been a dominant force even breifly?

If Holmes had taken up Figure Skating,his left jab would have cut the ice to shreds !!


In this scenario,Muhammad Ali's long overdue retirement would have left a vacuum which would have seen no single dominant heavyweight until Mike Tyson arrived on the scene. The WBC crown would have changed hands as often as it's WBA counterpart.
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