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Old 11-15-2012, 06:17 AM   #31
Flea Man
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Default Re: My 50 Greatest boxers of all time

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Scrutiny is fine. But there's a difference between the way you scrutinise and the way the others scrutinise. Go and read for yourself. Your scrutiny comes with oestrogen fuelled negativity lol
Yeah, well your line of reasoning isn't really that accepted, and it is expected that if you are vouching for something you have your big guns ready in case you're pulled up on it. No room for 'one of my favourites' or 'I'm not sure but....' Try the General forum out, might find them a little less cynical over there

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Originally Posted by McGrain View Post
Man, anyone who has him at #12 doesn't know their ass from their elbow.

Top 5, top 10 at worst.
I have him at no.11. And I'm not taking the piss and I'd hope that you think I know my ass from my elbow
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:20 AM   #32
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You don't know your ASS from your ELBOW.
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:22 AM   #33
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You don't know your ASS from your ELBOW.
Oh, you're very rude, I wouldn't expect that on a forum.
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:26 AM   #34
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Default Re: My 50 Greatest boxers of all time

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Top 50 was difficult, Top 100 will be way too mentally taxing at the moment.

Disclaimer: I don't claim to be an expert whatsoever, and as I learn more about boxing I'd most likely change this in the future. ALSO, this didn't take me that long so I might realise certain things and want to change up. Here goes:

My PERSONAL top 50:
SRR
Ali
Armstrong
Louis
Duran
Tunney
Greb (if brought up in the same generation as Monzon, he'd lose)
Benny Leonard
Johnson
Langford
Gans
Pep
Leonard
Moore
Walker (probably the most interesting resume, especially the weight lol)
Monzon
E. Charles - most comfortable putting him here.
McLarnin
Ross
Canzoneri
Ambers (unsure but hey)
Hagler
Napoles
Wilde (I don't actually know much about him tbh)
Holmes
Dempsey (yes, that's right).
Saddler
Marciano
Sanchez
Foreman
Hearns
Chavez
Frazier
De La Hoya (Leija, J.J.Molina, Paez, Ruelas, G.Hernandez, Trinidad, Quartey, narrow loss to a prime Mosley on steroids but we all know he won on the rematch, with virtually all experts and Mosley even say De La Hoya won, Whitaker, Whitaker looked fast and ODLH landed more power punches so I think ODLH won IMO, Vargas on steroids who was a beast, Camacho, Campas, Chavez who was still great, only legitimate losses in my eyes were against Hopkins and Sturm - and I think he was past his prime at that time also and had no business being at middleweight!) - How many have a resume consisting of this many elite/great fighters like ODLH on this list?)
McGovern
Cerdan
Lewis
Ted Kid Lewis
Holyfield
Spinks
LaMotta
Jones Jr
Hopkins
Griffith
Mayweather (I have Mayweather beating Hearns and Benitez. Duran vs Mayweather and Leonard vs Mayweather will be a very tough one to call - although I have him lower than some of the 90's-2000's stars of all weight divisions, I have him as the best fighter of the generation. I am sure he'd beat Pacquiao, Barrera, Morales, Tszyu, Hamed, Ayala, Whitaker you name them. I'm not completely sure if he can beat Napoles although I'm more inclined to say he can, it would be a dream matchup). Obviously because of natural progression in the sport, I have Mayweather beating someone like Benny Leonard too, but obviously Benny is 'greater' p4p. Another reason why I say this because sparring sessions and the way they fought back then seemed a little inferior. I'm probably stating the obvious here Having said that, I have prime Robinson beating Mayweather).
Conn
Whitaker
Pacquiao (Pacquiao has a better legacy than Mayweather but still...)
Arguello
Cervantes (maybe, maybe not. Huge fan of the guy).


Don't know enough about Kid Galivan, Eder Jofre or Fighting Harada.
As I was looking down the list I was looking and looking for Roy Jones Jnr and couldn't see him anywhere?? Then I found him!! Down at about 45th!??? I probably rate him more than most to be honest haha but thought he might have been a little higher? Will have to do my own list but think in my rough drafts think I had him somewhere in the region of 10-15th (and im pretty sure it was closer to 10) but then some might think that ridiculous? The only other biggie for me is my man Ez Charles - he's a lock for somewhere from 6th to 10th (I think? But again I will have to put up my own list) - can't really argue with any of your top men - Mickey Walker would be high on mine but that just me haha
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:28 AM   #35
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Default Re: My 50 Greatest boxers of all time

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Scrutiny is fine. But there's a difference between the way you scrutinise and the way the others scrutinise. Go and read for yourself. Your scrutiny comes with oestrogen fuelled negativity lol
What do you expect? A good effort? Well done?

The reality is there is barely a position I agree with on your list.

As far as I am concerned when I do this sort of thing, I expect (and want) criticism. But I would like to think even my harshest critic, (which is often Flea Man), would say I come back with an answer, even if they do not agree with it.

Surely that is why you make these things 'public'? Otherwise you would just keep the list to yourself...

Last edited by TBooze; 11-15-2012 at 07:00 AM.
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:34 AM   #36
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Default Re: My 50 Greatest boxers of all time

**** me, my old list got ripped to shreds. It was ABYSMAL (B-Hop was at like, 38 or summat ) but now I feel more comfortable with my top 50.

As people criticised I looked at differentfighters and came up with new criteria. I used to just rate post war fighters and thought the 'old timers' were SHITE but as I researched more and more I realised I was horrendously wrong on many, many counts.

I had Ricardo Lopez top 50! Says it all, I was a noob.
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:41 AM   #37
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Yeah, Ricardo is easily top 30.
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:51 AM   #38
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Yeah, Ricardo is easily top 30.
Anarci I thought you'd left!
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:54 AM   #39
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Default Re: My 50 Greatest boxers of all time

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Originally Posted by TBooze View Post
What do you expect? A good effort? Well done?

The reality is there is barely a position I agree with on your list.

As far as I am concerned when I do this sort of thing, I expect (and want) criticism. But I would like to think even my harshest critic, (which is often Flea Man), would say I come back with answer, even if they do not agree with it.

Surely that is why you make these things 'public'? Otherwise you would just keep the list to yourself...
I dont mind it lol I would like to have criticism also so I can learn, but I kinda want Flea Man to brighten up a bit in general
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:54 AM   #40
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Default Re: My 50 Greatest boxers of all time

So, B-Hop at 38, was that too high or too low ?
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:57 AM   #41
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Default Re: My 50 Greatest boxers of all time

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I dont mind it lol I would like to have criticism also so I can learn, but I kinda want Flea Man to brighten up a bit in general
I'm fine mate, don't you worry.

And Unforgiven way too high my friend
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Old 11-15-2012, 07:01 AM   #42
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And Unforgiven way too high my friend
I would have said so too.
I'm usually out of step with the 'consensus' though.
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Old 11-15-2012, 07:03 AM   #43
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I would have said so too.
I'm usually out of step with the 'consensus' though.
I had him at #29 a couple of years back...
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Old 11-15-2012, 07:14 AM   #44
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Default Re: My 50 Greatest boxers of all time

A high rating of Hopkins is certainly arguable.
I'd be surprised if some regulars on this forum DON'T have him in their top 25 or top 30.
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Old 11-15-2012, 07:44 AM   #45
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Default Re: My 50 Greatest boxers of all time

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Originally Posted by burt bienstock View Post
What the heck do you know about jack Dempsey, that Sam Langford, Gene Tunney, Mickey Walker, Jack Sharkey, Max Schmeling, Ray Arcel, Lou Stillman, Damon Runyon, and the 200 boxing writers who voted him the best heavyweight in the 1950 poll didn't know ? Why would you distort history by
besmirching this great fighter and ignore the opinions of EXPERTS who saw him at his PRIME, and raved about his unique power, viciousness and
innate toughness.? It irks me to read this from someone who is BLIND to history,and who thinks "screw the people who saw him , fought him and
raved about one of the very toughest, meanest SOB's that ever stepped into a ring " .But you somehow no MORE...Oh well !.
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