Old school training routines seem to be the simplest and most effective!

[pecho26]

Originally Posted by dempsey1234

'Er hampsters, huh????? Is that more S&C mumble jumbo??

Yeap,hampsters are used in s&c programs.

[pecho26]

Originally Posted by Jdsm

No, thankfully my coach never did, but there are a lot with that mentality.

There is A LOT of boxing coaches who cant even do a proper WARM UP,i had so much moronical advices and one was from a guy with 3 aibas stars.
I read a work of his in one conditioning journal,it was called specific strength for boxers,first 2 pages were a witch hunt on weights and accusations that weights and "fitness" trainers were the downfall of mike tyson and how boxing matches are cut down from 15 to 12 rounds because of "fitness" guys (that motherfucker couldnt even guees a proper name for S&c coach).And so on and so on....

[dempsey1234]

Originally Posted by pecho26

Yeap,hampsters are used in s&c programs.

'er pardon my ignorance how do you use hampster and how are they or it incorporated into an S&C program. Is this one of S&C's new school ideas?
I sure am glad I stuck to old school methods.

[viru§™]

Originally Posted by dempsey1234

Pecho, Thanks for including that link, it makes a lot of good points against S&C guys. Thanks for this also "he is a phenomenal boxing coach,but when he talks about "imbalances" of the body of Amir khan i laugh like hell cause im sure he doesnt know what the hell he is talking about." Hunter I would think has more insight into things when it concerns his fighters than an S&C guy. You laugh like hell at Hunter's 'er lack of knowledge, this is exactly why I dislike S&C guys, they are arrogant to the extreme. Everybody is ignorant but them. In that article it mentioned a guy I have had dealings with personally, Alex Ariza. The guy is totally out of control, working the corner as a cutman, and working more as a cornerman. When he has absolutely no experience in boxing. This has been my experience with different S&C guys after awhile they think they are also boxing trainers then they second guess everything. Ariza, wanted to train my guy, which at first I thought that was a good thing, to have Ariza working my guy, wow! Then Ariza started working my guys corner while sparring and giving instructions, wtf. Ariza is a S&C guy he has no business trying to train or give a fighter instructions between rds. Ariza just took over, well I ended that. Another time a S&C guy was brought in and he dumped on everything, right from the get-go. My last post included something about Salvador Sanchez, he had old school trainers, who did things the old fashioned way, a lot of hard work. Elite Mexican trainers always had a private doctor on hand to ck heartrate from the early sixties maybe even before that. These doctors weren't out front, like today's S&C guys. You never saw guys, doing bodybuilder poses at weigh in's now fergitboutit. It has become the standard. Hunter's saying that while fighters look good externally what about internally? If S&C guys would not try to take over then they are welcome. Otherwise they are not needed and if they are than it has to be just conditioning. If The S&C guys accept their roles as support staff then I agree they can be very helpful. If those old Mexican dinosaurs can work with a doctor they can work S&C guys. S&C guys should ck their ego's at the door to the gym and stay out of corners.

I love the way you've met a few bad eggs so of course they're all bad. How ignorant of you.

I know one or two strength and conditioning coaches, personal trainers, fitness instructors, many professions from many industries. Some are extremely good in the areas they specialize in, others are complete shite. If I took your attitude I'd have label them all as crap because of the few bad ones I know of. How the fuck does that make any sense? Please explain to me why they're all bad because of that few, that's exactly what your argument boils down to.

Edit: After reading this fully (I only read half of it first time and got bored of the same argument typed out again) I noticed the red part. That's what everyone is saying. If that's the case this entire thread and debate is entirely pointless.

[pecho26]

Originally Posted by dempsey1234

'er pardon my ignorance how do you use hampster and how are they or it incorporated into an S&C program. Is this one of S&C's new school ideas?
I sure am glad I stuck to old school methods.

Nah its one of the old school ideas.I brought it up for you cause i see you have forgot it.ccccc

Originally Posted by viru§™

I love the way you've met a few bad eggs so of course they're all bad. How ignorant of you.

I know one or two strength and conditioning coaches, personal trainers, fitness instructors, many professions from many industries. Some are extremely good in the areas they specialize in, others are complete shite. If I took your attitude I'd have label them all as crap because of the few bad ones I know of. How the fuck does that make any sense? Please explain to me why they're all bad because of that few, that's exactly what your argument boils down to.

Dude dont even bother,he is generalizing.Its a done deal.

[dempsey1234]

Originally Posted by pecho26

Nah its one of the old school ideas.I brought it up for you cause i see you have forgot it.ccccc

Dude dont even bother,he is generalizing.Its a done deal.

The difference may be in real world experience. The part in red was always there, in one way or the other.
S&C are just a new name for an old task, there have always been conditioners throughout boxing history. Educate yourself, on boxing history, there has always been a head trainer and his asst, and a conditioner, duh.
You'll be surprised what these old school guys done and how advanced they were, in fact some of the stuff they were using is still be used today.
There is nothing but self servicing, self righteous BS about S&C guy and their arrogance. The title of this thread is "Old school training routines seem to be the simplest and most effective", they are, but you continue to use buzzwords to make your points, saying generalizing and blanket statements, like it means something, I hate to tell you, but you are also guilty. I will let you figure out how.

[pecho26]

Originally Posted by dempsey1234

The difference may be in real world experience. The part in red was always there, in one way or the other.
S&C are just a new name for an old task, there have always been conditioners throughout boxing history. Educate yourself, on boxing history, there has always been a head trainer and his asst, and a conditioner, duh.
You'll be surprised what these old school guys done and how advanced they were, in fact some of the stuff they were using is still be used today.
There is nothing but self servicing, self righteous BS about S&C guy and their arrogance. The title of this thread is "Old school training routines seem to be the simplest and most effective", they are, but you continue to use buzzwords to make your points, saying generalizing and blanket statements, like it means something, I hate to tell you, but you are also guilty. I will let you figure out how.

My university thesis was about boxing history and boxing nicknames so spare me your bullshit.
Just spread your wisdom like"Weight training to me means training with weights, and training with weights can make you musclebound"
Here you demonstrated your "knowledge".

[dempsey1234]

Here are facts:
1- Old school coaches have done very well for over two hundred yrs, in preparing boxers for whatever they had to face and they were very successful.
2- Old school guys actually had old school conditioners as they were known then
3- The training routines these old school guys used and developed are still in use today.
4- They were using private doctors in training at least 40 to 50 yrs ago.
So, just because modern technology is advanced doesn't give S&C the right to disrespect guys that have learned the old fashioned way and continue to use it. "Blanket statement alert''. The arrogance of SOME S&C, to think that only they have the knowledge to properly condition a fighter. Two of the best trainers in boxing Virgil Hunter, Freddie Roach, yes Freddie too, and John Scully are now suspect, why, because they dared say what is on most ("Blanket statement alert'') insiders minds, ARE S&C guys neccessary? The arrogance of SOME S&C, to think that only they have the knowledge to properly train a fighter is beyond reason. I am assuming you are from England, then read up on how Joe Calzaghe trained you might be surprised.
Join a team if you know so much you should be in heavy demand and STFU, prove yourself by doing not by yapping it up with those big fancy words, there is an old saying which applies here "Latin hides the stupidity of the priest."

[dempsey1234]

OMG and you are bragging this "My university thesis was about boxing history and boxing nicknames" jeez not only are you a knowledgable S&C guy, you are an expert on boxing history and nickname.
Man, you my hero,ha ha ha o' sorry I meant LOL

[brown bomber]

You've got one of the highest profile trainers in the world talking absolute physiological nonsense in that article. Just think of what goes on at club level... I know and its frightening.

[Jdsm]

Originally Posted by brown bomber

You've got one of the highest profile trainers in the world talking absolute physiological nonsense in that article. Just think of what goes on at club level... I know and its frightening.

Some of the things I've heard come from the 'best' club in my city are horrific, not just stupid but incredibly dangerous. Glad I train at a club where the trainers give a shit about the safety of their fighters.

[pecho26]

Originally Posted by dempsey1234

OMG and you are bragging this "My university thesis was about boxing history and boxing nicknames" jeez not only are you a knowledgable S&C guy, you are an expert on boxing history and nickname.
Man, you my hero,ha ha ha o' sorry I meant LOL

I cant lie about something.Nor did i say i was and expert on boxing history and nicknames.It was my thesis.
Im not an expert on s&c or boxing.Neither one of us here is.Im an ordinary amateur boxer with education,and i aint stupid,ignorant nor i mock something i dont understand.Which i cant say about you.
Btw i am not from england and i dont like calzaghe,english is not my first language.

[dempsey1234]

Originally Posted by Jdsm

Some of the things I've heard come from the 'best' club in my city are horrific, not just stupid but incredibly dangerous. Glad I train at a club where the trainers give a shit about the safety of their fighters.

I have to ask just curious, are you or Brown Bomber, amateur or pro boxers, S&C coaches, your answer will tell it all.

I am a licensed manager, and I am trying to learn something about training. Not that I am trying to be a trainer, just for my own knowledge.

One of my fighters recently fought for the world title so I have a little experience in boxing. My guy lost a clear decison to a P4P champion. I primarily deal with Mexican fighters, all have a promotional from one of the biggest promotional companies in the world of boxing. So, I do my job as a manager. Now, since I have 3 undefeated teenage fighters I am trying to educate myself as to what is what in training.

On my way to expand my mind I was ambushed by crazed S&C guys calling me an idiot, a cunt, and ignorant, jeez you would think they were trying to hurt my feelings.

[Primate]

Originally Posted by dempsey1234

I have to ask just curious, are you or Brown Bomber, amateur or pro boxers, S&C coaches, your answer will tell it all.

I am a licensed manager, and I am trying to learn something about training. Not that I am trying to be a trainer, just for my own knowledge.

One of my fighters recently fought for the world title so I have a little experience in boxing. My guy lost a clear decison to a P4P champion.

[Jdsm]

Originally Posted by dempsey1234

I have to ask just curious, are you or Brown Bomber, amateur or pro boxers, S&C coaches, your answer will tell it all.

I am a licensed manager, and I am trying to learn something about training. Not that I am trying to be a trainer, just for my own knowledge.

One of my fighters recently fought for the world title so I have a little experience in boxing. My guy lost a clear decison to a P4P champion. I primarily deal with Mexican fighters, all have a promotional from one of the biggest promotional companies in the world of boxing. So, I do my job as a manager. Now, since I have 3 undefeated teenage fighters I am trying to educate myself as to what is what in training.

On my way to expand my mind I was ambushed by crazed S&C guys calling me an idiot, a cunt, and ignorant, jeez you would think they were trying to hurt my feelings.

Some of the bad information that gets thrown out from some of the best clubs is ridiculous. The 'best' club in my city has told plenty of their boxers to starve themselves to make weight; telling young teenagers to starve themselves in absolutely moronic advice and is dangerous advice. No doubt derived from some of the ridiculous 'old school' crap. IMO trainers have a duty to at least have a basic understanding of physiology when training kids.