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Old 11-30-2012, 03:03 PM   #151
kirk
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Originally Posted by Hermit View Post
OK. You seem to know all the details of these negotiations. Wanna spill the offer sheet quotes?

Thats what you dont seem to be getting Hermit (with due respect), there were no negotiations.

Arum literally killed these fights before any negotiations could take place.

He declined these fights on the principle of giving up Rios for Mares, after he started it by saying in order to make a Mares/Donaire fight GBP would have to give him Mares.

When they said ok, but lets trade him for Rios for one fight, he then killed the offer and sent an insult with it.

Again, nowhere does Arum say they were offering him bad numbers.

Given his statements, he declined on the principle, before any number negotiations took place.
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Old 11-30-2012, 03:05 PM   #152
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Originally Posted by ishy View Post
Makes sense. Rios is worth more to Bob than Mares is to GBP. Bob wants to make Rios/Pac next year.

AND if GBP want to give Matthysse a big fight they've got Garcia, Khan, Maidana and Guerrero in their stable. But they don't want to risk one of their OWN cashcows against Lucas they want Bob's.

**** GBP and their bullshit.

Point is, he could have tried to work with GBP to make Mares vs Donaire, instead hes the one that started this whole 'give me him to make the fight' bullshit.

The whole Rios/Matthysse was only brought up to try and compromise with a completely unreasonable Arum demand in the first place.

Yet fans say **** GBP
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Old 11-30-2012, 04:00 PM   #153
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Originally Posted by kirk View Post
You realise they were countering an already unfair offer, right? With Arum basically saying give me Mares if you want to make Mares/Donire

So given the context they were asking for Rios, I dont see the problem. That it was a deal killer is on Top Rank, not GBP.

Oscar said fine, and called Arum out on his shit. Had Arum compromised and met GBP halfway after hes the one that started with the unrealistic demands, we would have had two awesome fights to look forward to.

Fact remains, the reason why these two great fights arent happening is at Arums feet.

Nothing posted in this thread changes that. Arum killed these fights from happening before they ever got to the negotiating table, period.
exactly man. That's the key here.

any neutral person can look and see who is preventing these fights from happening
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Old 11-30-2012, 04:30 PM   #154
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Originally Posted by kirk View Post
Thats what you dont seem to be getting Hermit (with due respect), there were no negotiations.

Arum literally killed these fights before any negotiations could take place.

He declined these fights on the principle of giving up Rios for Mares, after he started it by saying in order to make a Mares/Donaire fight GBP would have to give him Mares.

When they said ok, but lets trade him for Rios for one fight, he then killed the offer and sent an insult with it.

Again, nowhere does Arum say they were offering him bad numbers.

Given his statements, he declined on the principle, before any number negotiations took place.
Not sure what's hard to understand about this.. Trying to say it's about numbers is grasping at straws that don't even exist, as nothing at all was said by anybody about any numbers.
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Old 11-30-2012, 05:01 PM   #155
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Originally Posted by EuroBot View Post
The Pactards will be here any minute. They love to defend Top Rank, even when Manny isn't involved.
From boxing fans to philippine boxing fans to Pac fans to Pactards to Bobtards. Proof of evolution.
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Old 11-30-2012, 10:04 PM   #156
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Point is, he could have tried to work with GBP to make Mares vs Donaire, instead hes the one that started this whole 'give me him to make the fight' bullshit.
Again, tit for tat for when Mayweather went behind his back and tried to negotiate with Pac on EXACTLY those terms. Floyd is with GBP. Don't try and make out Floyd is an independent. This would have been a GBP fight because you need a licensed promoter.
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Originally Posted by kirk View Post
The whole Rios/Matthysse was only brought up to try and compromise with a completely unreasonable Arum demand in the first place.
See above. Floyd started this one on GBP's behalf. Arum simply turned it around on them and you blame Arum. OK. Sure, why not.
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Originally Posted by kirk View Post
Yet fans say **** GBP
GBP is the one that tied the two fights together knowing that they wouldn't get Rios because he was on hold. This is as plain as day.

Lets put this all together now.
Floyd, on behalf of GBP, makes offer to Pac. One time payment, no Arum, no co-promotion.
Arum turns around and does EXACTLY the same thing to GBP. Same terms.
GBP makes a demand on Rios they know ahead of time won't happen.

If you don't see it now, you never will because you don't want to. Look at the whole picture.
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:14 PM   #157
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

Of course it's Floyd's fault!

Isn't going around Top Rank's back for the Pacquiao fight in the first place merely the tat for Arum's insistence that he just didn't know who represented Floyd and his refusal to answer Schaefer's calls on the fight? If Floyd and Golden Boy are one and the same it makes Arum's public statements earlier this year about the May 5th date look even more ridiculous than they already do.

Of course all of the above accepts your absurd shifting of the goalposts and your attempt to bring in something completely irrelevant to somehow justify Arum's disingenuous offer. Likewise, Mayweather's offer to Pacquiao could not actually be accepted without Top Rank signing off on it, something that makes your phrase "go around Top Rank's back" an inappropriate description.
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:34 PM   #158
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Originally Posted by Hermit View Post
Again, tit for tat for when Mayweather went behind his back and tried to negotiate with Pac on EXACTLY those terms. Floyd is with GBP. Don't try and make out Floyd is an independent. This would have been a GBP fight because you need a licensed promoter.
See above. Floyd started this one on GBP's behalf. Arum simply turned it around on them and you blame Arum. OK. Sure, why not.
GBP is the one that tied the two fights together knowing that they wouldn't get Rios because he was on hold. This is as plain as day.

Lets put this all together now.
Floyd, on behalf of GBP, makes offer to Pac. One time payment, no Arum, no co-promotion.
Arum turns around and does EXACTLY the same thing to GBP. Same terms.
GBP makes a demand on Rios they know ahead of time won't happen.

If you don't see it now, you never will because you don't want to. Look at the whole picture.
Mayweather doesnt speak on behalf of GBP Hermit

You are being willfully ignorant.

You are literally accepting Arums killing of these fights and it boggles my mind as to why, I dont pay attention enough in the general forum to know if you usually take Top Ranks side or are a GBP hater or whatever stupid shit goes on here, but I can tell you, you are being bias in this case.

First it was '''''you must know all about these negotiations, please fax me the quote sheets''' crap, trying to use that as an angle (that GBP offered bad numbers) as to why it wasnt a go.

Then when pointed out how dumb of a question that is, because it was declined on principle, you make it out to be something else going back to mayweather acting like a retard. As if Mayweather speaks for Golden Boy Promotions

This shit is obvious. Most get it, you dont... for whatever reason. I dont care at this point

Your line of reasoning
----
Mayweather acts like his usually retarded self, tries to get a Pac fight away from Arum

Top Rank and Arum now can kill any awesome fight proposed without wanting to negotiate with GBP by trying to do as a company to GBP what Floyd Mayweather tried to do with Pac


And you want to know the truth? The truth is we could probably go to an issue before that as to where Top Rank tried to screw over GBP, and then to where GBP tried to screw over Top Rank.

You seem to want to continue this trail of 'oh.... oh but its his fault first!' line.

When all we need is right in front of us.

GBP tried to make a good fight, where their fighter would have even been the underdog.

Arum killed it.


Keep talking about this or that, but thats the issue here.

You seem to have a horse in this race for some reason, I dont, and no longer care to discuss it

Last edited by kirk; 11-30-2012 at 11:46 PM.
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:43 PM   #159
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Mayweather doesnt speak on behalf of GBP Hermit
Who would have promoted that fight if not Arum? Seriously. Mayweather promotion is just a name. Period.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kirk View Post
You are being willfully ignorant.
It isn't me. Did Arum simply turn around Floyd's terms or not? Yes or no. This one is just so simple.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kirk View Post
This shit is obvious. Most get it, you dont... for whatever reason. I dont care at this point
Bingo. Look in the mirror. You have taken a side and refuse to admit what is going on here. Arum turned around and offered GBP exactly what their fighter offered him. And yes, Floyd fights for GBP so that is the same thing as far as Arum is concerned.

Again, yes or no. Aren't these the same terms that were offered for a GBP fight for Floyd/Pac. You simply have no where to go with this one because I am flat out right and you are flat out wrong. But go ahead and blame Arum because it is the popular mob based thinking thing to do and you will get plenty of support for your position.
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:45 PM   #160
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Originally Posted by Hermit View Post
Who would have promoted that fight if not Arum? Seriously. Mayweather promotion is just a name. Period.
It isn't me. Did Arum simply turn around Floyd's terms or not? Yes or no. This one is just so simple.


Bingo. Look in the mirror. You have taken a side and refuse to admit what is going on here. Arum turned around and offered GBP exactly what their fighter offered him. And yes, Floyd fights for GBP so that is the same thing as far as Arum is concerned.

Again, yes or no. Aren't these the same terms that were offered for a GBP fight for Floyd/Pac. You simply have no where to go with this one because I am flat out right and you are flat out wrong. But go ahead and blame Arum because it is the popular mob based thinking thing to do and you will get plenty of support for your position.
this thread is about Mares and Rios
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:49 PM   #161
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Originally Posted by bballchump11 View Post
this thread is about Mares and Rios
Your point? The point of the whole thread is blaming Arum for making a similar offer that was given for May/Pac. All he did was turn around and offer the same terms. Why was it acceptable for May/Pac but not now?

You guys really don't see what Arum is doing here. Bseen had several articles that showed that Arum is deep under Schaefer's skin. Now he turns around EXACTLY the shit they tried to shoved down his throat back on them. You guys are so, so easy.
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Old 11-30-2012, 11:52 PM   #162
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Bingo. Look in the mirror. You have taken a side and refuse to admit what is going on here. Arum turned around and offered GBP exactly what their fighter offered him. And yes, Floyd fights for GBP so that is the same thing as far as Arum is concerned.

Again, yes or no. Aren't these the same terms that were offered for a GBP fight for Floyd/Pac. You simply have no where to go with this one because I am flat out right and you are flat out wrong. But go ahead and blame Arum because it is the popular mob based thinking thing to do and you will get plenty of support for your position.
Golden Boy (if we accept your idea that Floyd's bullshit offer was on behalf of them) merely turned around and did to Top Rank with Pacquiao the exact same thing Arum tried doing with Floyd months earlier. Thus all the talk about investment groups and Mayweather going solo and not wanting Golden Boy involved in the fight in November of 2011 and all of the talk about not knowing who to contact earlier this year. Try to come up with a new excuse for Arum's behavior; maybe the third time will be the charm.
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Old 12-01-2012, 12:00 AM   #163
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Originally Posted by purephase View Post
Golden Boy (if we accept your idea that Floyd's bullshit offer was on behalf of them) merely turned around and did to Top Rank with Pacquiao the exact same thing Arum tried doing with Floyd months earlier. Thus all the talk about investment groups and Mayweather going solo and not wanting Golden Boy involved in the fight in November of 2011 and all of the talk about not knowing who to contact earlier this year. Try to come up with a new excuse for Arum's behavior; maybe the third time will be the charm.
OK. Again. Who would have promoted Pac/May under May's proposal. No one wants to answer this one because we know the truth. It would have been a GBP. They have a license and promote his fights. But go ahead. Please answer so we are on the same page.

Floyd flat out denied the negotiations happened for the second round after Arum had been in negotiations. This is why Arum said he didn't know who to negotiate with. Floyd said there were NO negotiations. HBO basically had to step in and back Arum that there were negotiations. So, you lose here. Arum was right to say he didn't know who to negotiate with because of this. Floyd denied the people negotiating for him had the right to do so. Not nearly the same as calling Pac direct and telling him Top Rank could not be involved in the promotion if they fought.
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Old 12-01-2012, 12:00 AM   #164
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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Your point? The point of the whole thread is blaming Arum for making a similar offer that was given for May/Pac.
no this is what this thread is about

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Originally Posted by bballchump11 View Post
I understand Hermit's stance since he's paid by Top Rank, but idk why you're defending Arum. Here's is the situation

Oscar: "I'd really like to make Mares vs Donaire"

Arum: "Yeah I'll make the fight. You can't be involved at all in the fight and I'll pay Mares directly while you [Oscar] get nothing from it"

Oscar: "Ok, I'll do that if you let me do the same to make Rios vs Matthysse"

Arum: "**** you Oscar. You don't know anything about boxing"

Idk, how anybody can look at this and not see what's wrong
Mayweather has **** all to do with it
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Old 12-01-2012, 12:04 AM   #165
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Default Re: Arum turns down Schaefer's Offer for Donaire-Mares and Matthysse-Rios

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no this is what this thread is about



Mayweather has **** all to do with it
Wrong again. Arum's response to the 'offer' was based on giving GBP a taste of their own medicine. Deny it if you must to keep you illusion going though.

Trying to leave out the Mayweather, Oscar, Arum history is as retarded as it gets. I know you have to do so to assign blame where it suits your preconceived notion but it doesn't work to anyone looking at this objectively.
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