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Old 12-01-2012, 02:44 PM   #1
The_Rev
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Default When were the best at their best?

I dont know whether this is a rehash of a topic which gets asked a lot on here, but I often think about which nights you would say a great fighter was at their absolute peak. It's a difficult thing to define I know, do you go for a night where they were utterly imperious, a night where they defied the odds or beat real high quality opposition?

Some examples of what I am thinking of:

Mike Tyson; the common consensus seems to be that the night he beat Michael Spinks was the night when he was at the absolute peak of his powers.

George Foreman; when he destroyed Joe Frazier. Joe was world champ, unbeaten and still riding high on his victory over Ali.

Lennox Lewis; a bit more debatable, but I think the night he took Razor Ruddock apart was something else. He would have beat anybody in the world on that night.

Muhammad Ali; even more debatable because he had several huge wins. The fight vs Cleveland Williams was just a masterclass in boxing though, sure, he wasnt fighting his toughest opponent but it was like watching poetry in motion.



Anybody disagree? Anybody want to add any more names? What do you think Mayweather's greatest performance was? Or Ray Leonards?
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Old 12-01-2012, 03:17 PM   #2
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

Ray Leonard was one of the greatest ever during 79-82.Ironically,many forget his performance against Kalule,which might be my second favourite of his.
He was a genuine benchmark during those three years,and all the recent hate he's received here the last few weeks won't change that.
And Michael Spinks shouldn't be remembered for Tyson because his reign at 175 is one of the best ever.
And don't get me started on The Body Snatcher!!!
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Old 12-01-2012, 03:18 PM   #3
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

And Floyd's master class v Corralles will always be his pinnacle for me.
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Old 12-01-2012, 03:46 PM   #4
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

Quote:
Originally Posted by OnePunchKO View Post
SRL receives hate? I don't see that at all.
He does. Some of the hate is for him admittingly waiting for Hagler to slow down to fight him (even though Leonard himself was a smaller man and had one official fight in 5 years). He gets criticism for having an immediate rematch with Duran because he said he knew Duran would get fat and then it'd be tough for him to make weight. And he gets some criticism for his cherry-picking very late in his career.

And of course there's the people who watch too much Legendary Nights and buy into the myth that he ducked Pryor.
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Old 12-01-2012, 03:49 PM   #5
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

Alexis Arguello: Alfredo Escalera 2. Wow.

Salvador Sanchez: Wilfredo Gomez

Julio Cesar Chavez: Edwin Rosario. Chavez showed wonderful ring-cutting ability, solid defense, a great chin when he did get hit, nice combos, etc...Combos are about creating and exploiting openings and Chavez was terrific at that, placing his punches well.

Michael Spinks: Dwight Muhammad Qawi

Pernell Whitaker: not really sure about this one. Jose Luis Ramirez 2? Julio Cesar
Chavez? Rafael Pineda?

Roberto Duran: Sugar Ray Leonard 1 was his best performance. His best weight though, was 135, and his best performance there was the third Esteban Dejesus fight. Masterful performance.

Marvin Hagler: Tony Sibson. The complete package. Punishing ramrod jab, good economical move
ment, solid defense, good combos, heavy hands, and good finishing ability when Sibson got hurt.

Roy Jones: Bryant Brannon. I consider this his "Cleveland Williams" performance. Not the best opponent, but Jones probably at his best and just doing unreal stuff. Gil Clancy was commentating and seemed to be in awe.
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:05 PM   #6
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

Quote:
Originally Posted by OnePunchKO View Post
SRL receives hate? I don't see that at all.

You need to head over to the Classic mate.Ray is the current punchbag of hate at the moment.
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Originally Posted by Thread Stealer View Post
Alexis Arguello: Alfredo Escalera 2. Wow.

Salvador Sanchez: Wilfredo Gomez

Julio Cesar Chavez: Edwin Rosario. Chavez showed wonderful ring-cutting ability, solid defense, a great chin when he did get hit, nice combos, etc...Combos are about creating and exploiting openings and Chavez was terrific at that, placing his punches well.

Michael Spinks: Dwight Muhammad Qawi

Pernell Whitaker: not really sure about this one. Jose Luis Ramirez 2? Julio Cesar
Chavez? Rafael Pineda?

Roberto Duran: Sugar Ray Leonard 1 was his best performance. His best weight though, was 135, and his best performance there was the third Esteban Dejesus fight. Masterful performance.

Marvin Hagler: Tony Sibson. The complete package. Punishing ramrod jab, good economical move
ment, solid defense, good combos, heavy hands, and good finishing ability when Sibson got hurt.

Roy Jones: Bryant Brannon. I consider this his "Cleveland Williams" performance. Not the best opponent, but Jones probably at his best and just doing unreal stuff. Gil Clancy was commentating and seemed to be in awe.
Excellent post TS,and not for the first time this week.
I wish I had more time because this could be a great thread but I need to go out for a while.

Good thread Rev.
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:06 PM   #7
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

I like Haugen for Whitaker.

Maybe Palomino for Duran, but you can't go wrong with Montreal or DeJesus III (or II, even). He has 3 showing that would each make a top 10 list of best boxing performances I've ever seen.
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:11 PM   #8
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

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I like Haugen for Whitaker.

Maybe Palomino for Duran, but you can't go wrong with Montreal or DeJesus III (or II, even). He has 3 showing that would each make a top 10 list of best boxing performances I've ever seen.
Forgot about Haugen...Whitaker shut him out with his usual brilliance.
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:21 PM   #9
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

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Originally Posted by PityTheFool View Post
Excellent post TS,and not for the first time this week.
I wish I had more time because this could be a great thread but I need to go out for a while.

Good thread Rev.
Thanks, here's some more.

Thomas Hearns: most will go with Roberto Duran because of his awesome display of power and speed over an ATG. I think you can argue also for Wilfred Benitez since it showed his ability to clearly outbox a brilliant boxer.

Felix Trinidad: this may be an unpopular opinion, but I'm gonna say Oba Carr. Vargas was Trinidad's best win (DLH was too controversial and Tito looked lousy), and Nando was a better fighter than Carr, but I like a lot of things here from Trinidad. IMO, Trinidad did some things in his early years at 147 better than he did later on. He fell in love with his power a bit. Carr was a solid contender type, and Tito suffered his traditional 2nd round knockdown. Tito gradually broke him down. He picked his spots well, moved laterally at times, came forward at other times. One of Trinidad's best assets was picking punches well and he did this well here. He didn't load up on many shots but gradually put a beating on Carr. By the 8th round, Carr was all busted up, and Tito stopped him.

Shane Mosley: Oscar De La Hoya 1. No question about it IMO. Mosley had more dominating wins, but against no one of DLH's quality. De La Hoya looked to be in fine form that night, he looked very sharp. Mosley was just sharper.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IorKVOwbDYI[/ame]
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:27 PM   #10
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PityTheFool View Post
And Floyd's master class v Corralles will always be his pinnacle for me.
Werd
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:32 PM   #11
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

Quote:
Originally posted by Thread Stealer
Forgot about Haugen...Whitaker shut him out with his usual brilliance.
Aye, Pea's got quite a few of those 'freaky good' type performances.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FPiQEgsYSM[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROJEclbrapU[/ame]


Nelson, Chavez, Pineda, McGirt II, Brazier, Ramirez I...lots.



I'll take Terrell for Ali, Cotto for Pacquiao (MAB I is far and away his best win, but the Cotto performance is just great, great stuff), maybe Gonzalez for De La Hoya?

Barkley is the showiest for Toney, but I'll take McCallum (the first one, I think. Can't remember )

Holyfield: Bowe II is his best display in terms of sticking to a gameplan and outboxing a really good, bigger guy.
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:36 PM   #12
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3cbfYDVnVw[/ame]
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:39 PM   #13
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Default Re: When were the best at their best?

Hagler vs. Sibson- as said previously:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vExTEVyprqA&feature=plcp[/ame]


Bernard Hopkins: Felix Trinidad. You could argue for Glen Johnson as Hopkins at his best as well. Johnson was still inexperienced against world class opposition at the time, so the significance of the win isn't up there with some of B-Hop's other wins, but he looked brilliant.

Absolutely love the part at the 2:08 mark when he goes around the guard with a right hook, then follows it up with an uppercut thru the guard.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9Hi6EznulM&feature=plcp[/ame]
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