Cotto vs Trout was high altitude training a factor?

[puertorricane]

cotto's lack of aggressiveness and small punch output was what lost the fight for him

[TheGreat]

Originally Posted by Bogotazo

Trout definitely deserves credit for his performance, nobody should take that away from him.

But to comment on the thread topic, I do remember Diaz commenting on the altitude training, and when he was asked in an interview if they'd do it again, he said "I'm not sure if we'll do it again." I've read mixed is better. There may be some truth as to what Ariza said about Mosley's training.

I guess Mosley being a 40 yr old shot fighter had nothing to do with it...

[SweetHome_Bama]

Originally Posted by Imperial1

Boxing trainers have been doing it for years with out phd's

boxing trainers know about boxing strategy, they don't know about what is best for getting the peak out of the human body.

They can talk about the old methods all they like, but at the end of the day we have more knowledge and have progressed from old methods for a reason.

[JoeCamelTow]

Originally Posted by puertorricane

cotto's lack of aggressiveness and small punch output was what lost the fight for him

Trout is what lost him the fight.

[Southpaw1]

No Trout was the problem. A bigger JMW who was fast and showed good foot work against Cotto who's only shot of winning was pinning him against the ropes. Stop making excuses, that night Trout was the better man and honestly if Cotto trained at lower altitude or what ever I'm sure the fight would have been similar.

[Imperial1]

Originally Posted by SweetHome_Bama

boxing trainers know about boxing strategy, they don't know about what is best for getting the peak out of the human body.

They can talk about the old methods all they like, but at the end of the day we have more knowledge and have progressed from old methods for a reason.

Peak out of the human body ,listen if it was a health thing I would not argue but from a boxing perspective , I have yet to see how these progressions have improved the fighters in the ring ..Sure they are healthy as hell but when they can't box for a full fight with skill it hurts the fighters in the long run .Has anyone noticed how Cotto always gasses in his fights ? How was his physical peak an advantage when he almost get the breaks beat off him in the boxing matches down the stretch ?

[Blackness]

Truth is... Cotto was a chubby kid. He took up boxing to shed pounds and so.. he is not necessarily a blessed athlete in terms of his genetics. At the core is that chubby little kid who gasses out. He made the most of it and the reality is.. He has gotten older. Cotto to me was beastly at 140...those body shots back then were thrown with fury.

[MichiganWarrior]

Altitude training doesnt help. Your body immediately adjusts back to your natural levels almost immediately. Its shy athletes blood dope instead.

It is great if you want to lose weight though. When I first move to the mountains i dropped weight like crazy until i acclimated how is that good for a boxer?

[tonyb]

Originally Posted by RJJFan

Alex Ariza’s Corner Of The Ring
Why Shane Mosley will lose this fight after the 5th round

Most people think high altitude training is the way to train. They feel that by getting their endurance to the level they want in an environment that is producing less oxygen will make the body perform better when the body is introduced back to lower climates when the body is introduced back to higher amounts of oxygen for every breath they take.

In high altitudes, the amount of oxygen in the blood is reduced because there’s less oxygen in the air. To compensate for reduction of oxygen in the air, the kidneys secrete more of a hormone called erythropoietin, which causes the body to create more red blood cells.

However the increase in red blood cells comes at a cost – having too many blood cells makes the blood thicker and can make blood flow sluggish. This makes it harder for your heart to pump blood throughout the body, and can actually decrease the amount of oxygen getting to where it is needed.


At very high altitudes (>5000m), weight loss is unavoidable because your body actually consumes your muscles in order to provide energy. There is even a risk that the body’s immune system will become weakened, leading to an increased risk of infections, and there may be adverse changes in the chemical make-up of the muscles. Additionally, the body cannot exercise as intensely at altitude. This results in reduced training intensity, which can reduce performance.

Besides Shane Mosley loosing muscle tissue and his body becoming depleted Shane Mosley has the biggest set back of all. By the time Shane Mosley steps in the ring, his body will already have become accustomed to the lower altitude. Everything his body built in the area’s of endurance up in Big Bear mountain are now gone. The body has already adjusted back to it’s natural environment.
It is not like Shane Mosley is sitting there with all this extra energy that he will be able to display for everyone in the ring.
Shane’s body will automatically get used to the higher levels of oxygen that you breathe in the lower climates. Their will be no benefit to what Shane tried to accomplish. Shane Mosley will have achieved no advantage. All Shane Mosley did was sacrificed muscle, strength, and speed for no reason.

The only reason I put this article out now is because it is too late for Shane to go backwards. He has damaged his body enough that those effects are non-reversible. (in the short time left to the fight on May 7th.)

I remember watching Tito Ortiz years ago when he was at the top of his game, but then he changed his training to Big Bear. He thought it would help him, but Tito started gassing in the 2nd round. That was simply because he actually weakened himself during training and his opponent was able to over power him during the second round.

Same thing will happen to Mosely. Shane has depleted himself. That is why you saw what you saw in the Mayweather fight. That is why you saw what you saw in the Sergio Mora Fight.

On the other hand, my fighter Manny Pacquiao is training as hard as he possible can in the environment he will actually fight in. He is eating and building muscle everyday. He is getting faster, stronger, while Shane is getting weaker and weaker.

This fight will not go the distance. I hardly ever predict fights. Freddie Roach is better at that then I am, but you will see many advantages for us in this fight, but the biggest one you will see will come in the fifth or sixth round and beyond; that is strength, endurance, speed, and power.

Shane will not be able to handle this.

Until next time, same website Official Manny Pacquiao Website PAC-MAN Manny Pacquiao

Alex

finally,somebody Got it right the fact is right here.. High altitude training, can be good for the lungs,BUT the muscles is getting killed by not getting enough oxygene. If u do running every other day, your lung will be in shape to box twelve rounds. But the muscles is going down by high altitude.. But lets be real here. I love miguel cotto, but he had gameplan problems here also. no jab to get inside. BAD combinations. he was slugish(this might be cause of the hight altitude training). but his balance was also way off.. people today like to just punch and dont know that their balance is way off. If u drive a car with flat tire at the one side, the car is gonna rotate to that side. We realy need more trainers today focusing on good balance and simple stuff as when to throw a punch and when not to, instead off just trying to land them . I can understand that if u have mayweather or tyson as a idol, u wanna do things that they do, but the fact is that we are only gonna be ourself, and not somebody else. i know the last part is a little off topic, but i just felt like saying it.

[Ricky42791]

High altitude training never really made sense to me. I think it prevents you from reaching normal thresholds necessary to peak in training. Depriving your body of oxygen doesn't seem like a good idea. I understand high altitude training "in theory" train up in thin air so when you come down you can breath twice as easily but then again communism works "in theory" I think the isolation of being up in the mountains free from distraction is what truly benefits fighters.

[dealt_with]

Altitude training is used to increase red blood cell production in the muscles. That is a peripheral adaptation, your fitness isn't increased just the holding capacity of the muscles for oxygen. It doesn't take long for those changes to disappear at sea level. When you train at high altitude you cannot train at a high intensity like at sea level.
High intensity training is what increases central adaptations i.e. Vo2 max. That's the reason for the train low-sleep high method, you gain the central adaptations from the high intensity training plus the peripheral adaptations from the altitude.
The peripheral gains from altitude are far more pronounced for pure endurance athletes such as long distance cyclists and runners. For a hybrid athlete like a boxer it would make minimal difference. The important fitness gains are central, the Vo2 max and Lactic capacity from high intensity training. If a boxer spends his whole training camp at altitude he will be impaired unless he was already in peak condition before camp, the boxer would then detrain during camp but if he was already at a high level of central fitness it might not matter too much.
Either way altitude training is next to useless for a boxer imo, and as I mentioned more often than not detrimental to performance.

[Imperial1]

Originally Posted by Blackness

Truth is... Cotto was a chubby kid. He took up boxing to shed pounds and so.. he is not necessarily a blessed athlete in terms of his genetics. At the core is that chubby little kid who gasses out. He made the most of it and the reality is.. He has gotten older. Cotto to me was beastly at 140...those body shots back then were thrown with fury.

Seems he's gone away from that body attack,Cotto to me was always a very dangerous body puncher..Lately he's become more of a head hunter.

[SweetHome_Bama]

Originally Posted by Imperial1

Peak out of the human body ,listen if it was a health thing I would not argue but from a boxing perspective , I have yet to see how these progressions have improved the fighters in the ring ..Sure they are healthy as hell but when they can't box for a full fight with skill it hurts the fighters in the long run .Has anyone noticed how Cotto always gasses in his fights ? How was his physical peak an advantage when he almost get the breaks beat off him in the boxing matches down the stretch ?

Cotto didn't have a physical problem he had a Trout problem.
You want to know why Cotto gassed heavily?
Trout was landing heavy Left hands to his body along with stiff jabs to his body all through the fight. You could see the cummulative effects as the fight progressed and the apex was when Trout hit him in the body with his left that hurt Cotto and made him turn around and run to the corner.

That was all Trout, not his conditioning.

[Joachim UK]

Originally Posted by SweetHome_Bama

Cotto didn't have a physical problem he had a Trout problem.
You want to know why Cotto gassed heavily?
Trout was landing heavy Left hands to his body along with stiff jabs to his body all through the fight. You could see the cummulative effects as the fight progressed and the apex was when Trout hit him in the body with his left that hurt Cotto and made him turn around and run to the corner.

That was all Trout, not his conditioning.

I agree here about the body shots from Trout taking the wind out of Cotto. Its not to dissimilar to what Mayweather did to Mosley. Notice, Mosley did not gas against Mora, Pacquiao or Alvarez because they made no concerted effort to go for body shots.

[negrotigre]

High altitude training is overrated as is much of the fancy training boxers do today. If you want good boxing endurance and to be strong in the ring, put in more rounds sparring and hitting the mitts one right after the other and run at least four days a week and do ab work and push ups or lift medium heavy weights. That's really all you need.