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Old 12-06-2012, 06:09 AM   #1
floyd_g.o.a.t
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Default My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez' time

1) Styles dont Change! They have had very similar fights for 3 times and if anything 4th will be more towards Marquez because of how dominant he was then in comparison to the first 2 fights. I dont think Pacquiao or Marquez will be able to change up their styles from the 3rd fight, it just wont happen at this stage of their careers.

2) The main reason for why Pacquiao was the favourite during the last fight was because of weight, but now we seen JMM can fight well at 147, so that shouldn't be the case anymore.

3) Alot of emphasis placed has been placed on the changes in JMM; physique, speed etc, which will play in his advantage but it's his style that would always cause problems for Pacquiao.

However what I find is going to be the difference in this fight is the decline in something that Manny was praised highly for. And this is something that not many people have mentioned and that is the volume of punches that he throws.

As seen with Hopkins, Mayweather etc. as they are getting older they seem to conserve their energy as they know they cannot throw as many punches throughout 12 rounds as they previously could. The same happened with Pacquiao and that was seen in the Bradley fight, as Pacquiao allow Bradley to come inside and attack him in the early stages off the round whereas at the end of the round, Manny came on and starting throwing more punches.

Personally that is what makes Manny unique, his volume of punches and the consistency they are coming at, which makes it hard for the opponent, and if that's gone...one of Manny's key strengths has gone. A fighter like Hopkins can move around the ring because his style doesn't rely too much on the volume of punches whereas it does for Pacquiao. For that reason I dont feel Manny can win too many rounds by coming on strong at the late stages of each round because the judges will expect more.

Also BOXING POLITICS!!!

4) ARUM is a very smart guy. If he wanted Pacquiao to take a loss after ages, who would he rather lose to? JMM during the 3rd fight? Or an upcoming hungry (TOP RANK) fighter in Timothy Bradley.

Of course no one expected JMM to be as dominant as he was during the last fight, but it happened and so did the robbery. Now Arum acted smart and prior to Bradley fight he had already set up the JMM 4 fight. This was for 2 reasons;

A) Pacquiao can pass on the torch to another Top rank fighter (Bradley)

B) JMM vs PAcquiao 4 would sell huge so alot of money would be generated and that would be the time for Marquez to finally finally finally get his just due and finally win a fight against Pacquiao.

Tell me, if Pacquiao beats Marquez? Whats the point of the 4th fight being made? Now that Manny has taken a loss and is declining, it's the perfect time in terms of boxing politics that Marquez should win. The whole reason why this fight was made was to give Marquez his victory he so deserves against Manny.

Well that's how i see it, it will be very similar to the 3rd fight. I dont think Manny can do much different and neither can Marquez. Pacquiao will have his moments and is expected to take the early rounds, but I feel JMM and Nacho are preparing for this and should come up with a game plan which should nullify Pacquiao's.

JMM to win by decision (Possibly Split) against Pacquiao.

All the best to both fighters, I'm excited to see this and may the best man win.

If Manny dominates Marquez and wins, he will go up massively in my books and I will obey the 2 months ban. But if he does win this 4th fight, it will be such a strange collection of fights that will come to an end but not really a fulfilling one unless Marquez wins.
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:21 AM   #2
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

Well they've fought 3 times already and each time it seems Marquez has done better. Knocked down 3 times in the first, once in the second and then won the 3rd. This one should be even more clear in my opinion.

Marquez is a scientist in there so the longer he spends in with someone the more he can figure them out and the better he will do.
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:28 AM   #3
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

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Originally Posted by Chappy112 View Post
Well they've fought 3 times already and each time it seems Marquez has done better. Knocked down 3 times in the first, once in the second and then won the 3rd. This one should be even more clear in my opinion.

Marquez is a scientist in there so the longer he spends in with someone the more he can figure them out and the better he will do.
That's exactly how I see it. The two fighters seem to be going in opposition directions as the fights go on. JMM's strengths -- skill and intelligence -- seem to improve, whilst Pac's strengths -- speed, footwork and intensity -- naturally regress. Unless he works out a pin-point formula and puts JMM away early, Pac will never win a clear fight. He just basically has to bury him deep enough into the ground, so that he doesn't have enough time to climb back out and pick him apart. That's what worked for him in the first two fights and how he salvaged a draw and a win.
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:50 AM   #4
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

I could see Arum giving the fight to Juan, or telling the judges to play fair for once.

Afterwards, if JMM is up for it, a JMM - Bradley fight would probably sell huge to the vast uninformed crowd. (and that's where the money is.)

Pac wants to retire anyway, and go be a good little political puppet for some rich Filipino businessmen. He definitely should.
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:56 AM   #5
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

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Originally Posted by Cableaddict View Post
I could see Arum giving the fight to Juan, or telling the judges to play fair for once.

Afterwards, if JMM is up for it, a JMM - Bradley fight would probably sell huge to the vast uninformed crowd. (and that's where the money is.)

Pac wants to retire anyway, and go be a good little political puppet for some rich Filipino businessmen. He definitely should.
I didn't think of that.

JMM vs Bradley & Pacquiao vs Rios

The winners/losers could also face one another. Pacquiao and Marquez could well only have those 2 fights left in him.
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:56 AM   #6
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

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Originally Posted by Uncle Rico View Post
That's exactly how I see it. The two fighters seem to be going in opposition directions as the fights go on. JMM's strengths -- skill and intelligence -- seem to improve, whilst Pac's strengths -- speed, footwork and intensity -- naturally regress. Unless he works out a pin-point formula and puts JMM away early, Pac will never win a clear fight. He just basically has to bury him deep enough into the ground, so that he doesn't have enough time to climb back out and pick him apart. That's what worked for him in the first two fights and how he salvaged a draw and a win.
Yeah that's how i see it too.
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Old 12-06-2012, 07:10 AM   #7
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

All comes down to who has the best steroids. Marquez looks like a beast now he has the new fitness trainer
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Old 12-06-2012, 07:47 AM   #8
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

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Originally Posted by floyd_g.o.a.t View Post
Yeah that's how i see it too.
Pac will take this one easily. Pac is always at his absolute best after losing a fight. I see this fight an 8-4 contest with at least one knockdown.
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:12 AM   #9
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

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Originally Posted by HeavyPuncha View Post
Pac will take this one easily. Pac is always at his absolute best after losing a fight. I see this fight an 8-4 contest with at least one knockdown.
Really? What makes you think Manny will do better now than he did a year ago?
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:03 AM   #10
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

I'm actually going for a Pacquiao win via competitive (the right) decision, or for a Pacquiao stoppage.

I actually picked Pacquiao to win via stoppage in the third bout, but a lot of people did also. I also have my reasoning's behind making a somewhat similar prediction for this bout. And it is as follows...

Pacquiao and Roach underestimated Marquez last time out, that's not even an excuse for them (ignore what was said before the third bout). They thought they were going to get him out of there early, they were bigger, faster, stronger, now combined with Pacquiao's improved IQ and arsenal, and their resume...Pacquiao was going to be too much (probably looking to make a statement to Mayweather at the time).

The problem they had was, when you underestimate someone, you more often than not can not switch up a gear when need be. They stepped in the ring and Pacquiao was too relaxed, he thought his power, strength, size, etc would come good at some point (it was Pacquiao's athleticism that made the first two bouts so competitive...they assumed they had the advantage or were level in most areas coming in to the third bout). What he didn't expect was Marquez to be so faultless in his approach and gameplan.

This time around, you can be sure they are not underestimating Marquez's ability to compete at the higher weight. Pacquiao is also coming off a loss and looking to put things right. But it's not just any loss, it's actually his first official loss since Morales, so I'd say he will be as motivated as ever for this bout. Whereas Marquez, no matter how good he is looking in training, I don't believe he will ever be more up for a Pacquiao bout than he was for the third bout (he was chasing that bout for a very long time).

If I am completely wrong again, so be it
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:18 AM   #11
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

IMO, this will be the most decisive fight. Manny clear UD.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:24 AM   #12
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

Manny has declined, but not as much as most think. Bradley and Marquez I think are severely underrated and I applaud and respect Manny for taking on them. I think they are at the time Manny fought them just better, superior fighters than Cotto or Margarito tho they are smaller so its not just bad stylistic matchups, but the quality of Jmm and Bradley being overlooked. Yes Pacman's busy lifestyle will take its toll, but its not like he's partying Duran-style waking up with hangovers daily so he's not harming his body in any way or seemingly doing drugs. The 4th fight might be Pacman's most important and he knows this. Don't be surprised if you see a revitalized, more focused Pacman countering the counter puncher. He is at his best when he counters and is an underrated counter puncher has the speed for it, but like Chavez before him probably feels he has to fight instead of box for his fans.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:27 AM   #13
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

I see marquez going down again.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:32 AM   #14
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

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Originally Posted by elchivito View Post
Manny has declined, but not as much as most think. Bradley and Marquez I think are severely underrated and I applaud and respect Manny for taking on them. I think they are at the time Manny fought them just better, superior fighters than Cotto or Margarito tho they are smaller so its not just bad stylistic matchups, but the quality of Jmm and Bradley being overlooked. Yes Pacman's busy lifestyle will take its toll, but its not like he's partying Duran-style waking up with hangovers daily so he's not harming his body in any way or seemingly doing drugs. The 4th fight might be Pacman's most important and he knows this. Don't be surprised if you see a revitalized, more focused Pacman countering the counter puncher. He is at his best when he counters and is an underrated counter puncher has the speed for it, but like Chavez before him probably feels he has to fight instead of box for his fans.
Very good point.

Superior physical attributes (speed, agility, output etc) combined with superior skills and technique can produce victories over opponents with superior physical attributes (height, weight, reach, etc) but inferior skills and technique.

But when the physical, technical and skill level are all on a more even playing field, the bouts will be closer.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:11 AM   #15
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Default Re: My view on the 4th fight between Marquez & Pacquiao. Why I feel this is Marquez'

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Originally Posted by AnthonyW View Post
I'm actually going for a Pacquiao win via competitive (the right) decision, or for a Pacquiao stoppage.

I actually picked Pacquiao to win via stoppage in the third bout, but a lot of people did also. I also have my reasoning's behind making a somewhat similar prediction for this bout. And it is as follows...

Pacquiao and Roach underestimated Marquez last time out, that's not even an excuse for them (ignore what was said before the third bout). They thought they were going to get him out of there early, they were bigger, faster, stronger, now combined with Pacquiao's improved IQ and arsenal, and their resume...Pacquiao was going to be too much (probably looking to make a statement to Mayweather at the time).

The problem they had was, when you underestimate someone, you more often than not can not switch up a gear when need be. They stepped in the ring and Pacquiao was too relaxed, he thought his power, strength, size, etc would come good at some point (it was Pacquiao's athleticism that made the first two bouts so competitive...they assumed they had the advantage or were level in most areas coming in to the third bout). What he didn't expect was Marquez to be so faultless in his approach and gameplan.

This time around, you can be sure they are not underestimating Marquez's ability to compete at the higher weight. Pacquiao is also coming off a loss and looking to put things right. But it's not just any loss, it's actually his first official loss since Morales, so I'd say he will be as motivated as ever for this bout. Whereas Marquez, no matter how good he is looking in training, I don't believe he will ever be more up for a Pacquiao bout than he was for the third bout (he was chasing that bout for a very long time).

If I am completely wrong again, so be it
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Fair points, I feel both will be very motivated, which is why I'm really looking forward to this fight!
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