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Old 12-06-2012, 11:49 AM   #196
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Originally Posted by HOUDINI View Post
Muscle and size are not boxing. Once again boxing history is full of big fighters totally destroyed by smaller, better fighters. Walcott did not bounce off the ropes into Rockys right hand. You cannot wish away three beyond brutal ko losses. Great fighters do not lose three times in this manner. Wlad does not have the courage of a great fighter nor does he have the chin.
Only once wad he brutally knocked out. The other times he gassed.

History is full of upsets where a smaller man beats the bigger man but it's even more full of bigger men beating smaller men.

Would jimmy Wilde beat margarito? The answer is no he wouldn't.

Weight classes are there for a reason and that's why this fight would never be sanctioned for a start.
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Old 12-06-2012, 12:03 PM   #197
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Some proper backtracking there. That's good. This infatuation with power, though; power always gets over-emphasized just as fighters with power get over-hyped. Yeah, they're bigger and stronger. Rocco couldn't run Wlad's schedule due to style, but let's not act like he wouldn't be favored over the lot. I mean, those fighters are totally underwhelming. Thompson is awkward and can box, and Brewster is respectable. The rest are just dreadful. Let's not try to prop up Brock and Thompson's punching power, either.

Could half of these HWs with blistering power set up a fight ending power shot to save their lives? No. Yeah Wlad beats Rocky, but that discussion is not what is getting traction exactly.
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Old 12-06-2012, 12:10 PM   #198
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

For the record I too would favour rocky over wlads opponents.

Mostly due to their physicality as they haven't trained for a hard 12 rounds so rocky has a good chance of wearing them down.

Byrd, Haye, Chagaev and Iggy have the best chance but none would I favour over the Rock.

I just can't see Rocky ever winning against Wlad. He's just too small.
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Old 12-06-2012, 12:42 PM   #199
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Seamus,

If he would struggle in later heavyweight eras with the big skilled/powerful men, What in your opinion then makes Marciano the great sub 190lb head to head fighter who ever lived then? Do they simply not have the physical advantages needed to stop the rings ultimate animal?
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Old 12-06-2012, 12:49 PM   #200
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Seamus,

If he would struggle in later heavyweight eras with the big skilled/powerful men, What in your opinion then makes Marciano the great sub 190lb head to head fighter who ever lived then? Do they simply not have the physical advantages needed to stop the rings ultimate animal?
I think in a one-off fight Marciano has a chance against most any heavy (though probably not Wlad or Lewis). However, if he fought his career in the past couple decades, with each opponent being of the likes (size and power) that a Lennox Lewis faced, I think he would simply break down physically and probably get sparked once or twice. He suffered enough wear and tear in his short career against the modern equivalent of light heavies and cruisers.
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Old 12-06-2012, 02:02 PM   #201
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Today's heavyweights are bigger and stronger. Bigger and stronger means, on average, harder hitters, stronger operators in the clinch. Is this debatable? Should we abolish weight divisions because the above is not true?

Thompson had very good clout. Brewster could do little else but hit like a tank. Brock had decent power. McCline could punch. Even at 35, Rahman could still punch.

A murderer's row? No. But on average harder hitters than Marciano faced.
Bigger & stronger doesn't necessarily mean harder puncher though. Earlier tonight I watched Pulev vs Ustinov...jab aside, Pulev punches all wrong. His left hook is a wide, slapping punch and he doesn't put his shoulder into his right hand.
Now he may be bigger and stronger than Walcott (well, he is, no debate there) but Walcott could deliver a left hook with torque and leverage behind it. It was a short, sharp punch, as a hook should be.
Frankly, I'd rather be hit by Pulev than Walcott.

Wlad has faced some hitters fair enough, but to insinuate simply because Thompson or McCline are big and therefor big punchers (or rather, dangerous punchers) is wrong, imo.
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Old 12-06-2012, 02:07 PM   #202
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

7' inches taller
14 inch reach advantage
50+ lbs heavier

Skill sets aside... Rocky gets annihilated.. Weight classes exist for a reason.

/THREAD
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Old 12-06-2012, 03:58 PM   #203
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Bigger & stronger doesn't necessarily mean harder puncher though. Earlier tonight I watched Pulev vs Ustinov...jab aside, Pulev punches all wrong. His left hook is a wide, slapping punch and he doesn't put his shoulder into his right hand.
Now he may be bigger and stronger than Walcott (well, he is, no debate there) but Walcott could deliver a left hook with torque and leverage behind it. It was a short, sharp punch, as a hook should be.
Frankly, I'd rather be hit by Pulev than Walcott.

Wlad has faced some hitters fair enough, but to insinuate simply because Thompson or McCline are big and therefor big punchers (or rather, dangerous punchers) is wrong, imo.

There is a point of diminishing returns, yes, but Wlad is at the upper end of the great returns. So were Foreman, Lewis, Ruddock, Ibeabuchi...
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Old 12-06-2012, 04:18 PM   #204
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

You can look at it any way you want but great fighters just don't Lose fights the way Wlad lost not once but three times. Sloppy, falling in sections with the scared look as if he wanted to give up. When Rocky hits him square and he would the fights over.
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Old 12-06-2012, 04:25 PM   #205
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Also there are weight divisions to aide the lower weight divisions. All through boxing history the hwt division is considered unlimited. 5 pounds can mean a lot to a featherweight but is meaningless at the higher weights. Size in of itself is not an advantage unless the opponent is inferior. If the choice is size or speed Id pick the quicker fighter any day. Why is everyone impressed with large immobile slow fighters who can't really fight? Does anyone know anymore what great fighting is all about?
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Old 12-06-2012, 04:28 PM   #206
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Houdini is 100% right.

He smart. you dumb orriray
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Old 12-06-2012, 04:50 PM   #207
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Originally Posted by HOUDINI View Post
Also there are weight divisions to aide the lower weight divisions. All through boxing history the hwt division is considered unlimited. 5 pounds can mean a lot to a featherweight but is meaningless at the higher weights. Size in of itself is not an advantage unless the opponent is inferior. If the choice is size or speed Id pick the quicker fighter any day. Why is everyone impressed with large immobile slow fighters who can't really fight? Does anyone know anymore what great fighting is all about?
the difference is closer to 50 pounds than 5.

Rocky will not have the reach to reach him let alone knock him out. Unless wlad gasses late on he will dominate the man he outweighs so much the fight wouldn't get realistically made.
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:45 PM   #208
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

I have a hard time seeing Klitschko win. Bad matchup for him stylistically and he was weary of Ibragimov; I imagine Marciano would be much more worrisome for here.
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Old 12-06-2012, 07:47 PM   #209
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Let's see.....Dempsey, Louis, Marciano, Liston, Foreman, Ali, .......did any of these fighters lose a fight to a larger fighter? The first three knocked out every large hwt they ever faced. Louis was heavily outweighed in two bouts with Buddy Baer, a deadly hitter and twice with Abe Simon. He scored knockouts in all four bouts. he had no issues reaching the much larger fighters chin. I see no reason why Rocky would not reach Wlads less than iron chin encased in his not so courageous body. Wlad is certainly there to be hit and Marciano s going to look quick in comparison. Everyone knows the toughness that Marciano possessed and we also know what happens when Wlad gets cracked. Eventually Marciano hits him on the chin....more than likely Rocky could take rounds of punishment if need be but along the way he is going to land..... Don't see Wad with his poor history taking punishment not going down in sections. If you think for a second that Purity, Brewster etc could ko Wlad but Rocky Marciano could not your fooling yourself.
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:22 PM   #210
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Wlad never beat anybody like the rock. Ever.
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