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Old 12-07-2012, 04:49 PM   #241
Seamus
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Originally Posted by dinovelvet View Post
orriray you are relatively new to boxing, what you say means absolutely jackshit to me and it always will.
Ive been in and out of boxing gyms for over 17 years.

Wlad has a very basic jab , there is nothing special about it at all. The fact that people here think its the best thing ever , proves to me they know nothing. Like you they only see boxing in black and white.

You've been in a boxing gym? Really? What's it like?

Actually, Manny Steward was in a boxing gym a couple times. He claimed Wlad was the hardest hitter he had ever dealt with, both jab and straight right. He said he had the most dominating jab in the division's history. But then you have been in a boxing gym.

Actually, a couple posters on this board have actually been paid to spar with Wlad. Both say his power was on another lever, even compared to guys like Bowe and Foreman. I am assuming they were in boxing gyms to come to this conclusion. Maybe you saw them there.
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Old 12-07-2012, 05:02 PM   #242
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

"Hello everyone. I'm a friend of AJ's from another forum. I used to box professionally from time to time, but nowadays I still spar. I've sparred with many legends. AJ asked to me describe what it is like to be in the ring with them and gauge their punching power. I will not reveal my name for personal reasons, but under anoymousity I feel a bit safer. If you want to know my identity send me an email, but I doubt you've heard of me anyway. I only had three professional fights.

I fought Lennox Lewis and Riddick Bowe as an amateur.

Riddicks power wasnt memorable to me. It probably got better as he got older, cause he never even remotely buzzed me in either of our contests.

Lennox hit like a ****ing tank. He cowed me; I won the first round, and he literally broke my spirit and took my soul with a right uppercut and straight right hand in the 2nd. I tried to stay away, and forgot to punch. He never got me quite as good again, but I will never forget those two punches. When we sparred years later, he hit very hard. Distinctly unpleasant to be hit by the man.

David Tua was unpleasant. I can't see myself getting stopped by him early, as he never really staggers me, but every shot hurt, and he'd bang. Every other guy I ever sparred would box when I got aggressive, but David would stand his ground and give. I'd get these horrible headaches after sparring with him, and Dave told me once that whenever he knew I was on the dance card, he'd drink extra water for his brain. Nice guy. Hit like a wrecking ball. David Tua hit hard enough to knock my headgear clean around my face. Dude had a pretty limited style, but that left was quick as a cobra when he was sharp, and boy did it have bite. Having sparred them both, Wladimir would school Tua and probably turn out his lights. He just lacks almost any sort of refinement to his violence. Granted, I don't really either unless I'm really, really on that day, but the best heavyweights I've sparred handled me a lot easier than David did.
Feels kinda bad critiquing the dude, though. He's a fun guy, super hospitable and friendly, hit like a truck and put me through plenty of painful paces. I only hope our careers and lives don't end up with me required to face him with 12's and no mask. I can't afford the surgery.

Evander Holyfield was a machine gun. He put me on my butt first round we ever sparred with a 7 or 8 punch volley. He just punched well; He'd move around and when he let them go, they hit, hard and fast and in large numbers. He was the weakest of the group since Bowe, but probably the most dangerous. He never found me difficult to find, and turned me into a bobble head more than once.

George Foreman was tricky. His jab was absolutely numbing-Ive never felt a jab like that, where your whole face would feel like it got novacained after he hit you with it. He'd also throw light punches primarily, almost pitty pat, till he had the opening, and then he'd wallop you. His punches had the most force; They didn't hurt any worse than Tua or Lewis, but I remember how badly they'd screw with my balance. His shots moved me. He also broke my nose with a straight right.

Wladimir Klitschko hit me by far the hardest, though. I couldn't get past the jab, and his right hands hit like thunder. They reminded me of Lewis', but they were quicker and sharper. Wladimir staggered me regularly in sparring. There are literally whole rounds I don't remember. He also knocked me out with a left hook. Not down, out. Only time in my life I've seen canvas and not been able to stand up by 10 seconds."

"I think I have a good chin. I've only been knocked out once and that was by Wlad. I've been staggered and hurt plenty of times. I've been dropped a few times too but only KO'd once."

"David Tua's punching power is not overrated. I can attest to that. He and George Foreman have a similar feel but Big George is a much better fighter."
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Old 12-07-2012, 05:55 PM   #243
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

He was knocked out by Ross Purity. He would also be knocked out by Rocky Marciano.
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Old 12-07-2012, 06:53 PM   #244
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Originally Posted by dyna View Post
"Hello everyone. I'm a friend of AJ's from another forum. I used to box professionally from time to time, but nowadays I still spar. I've sparred with many legends. AJ asked to me describe what it is like to be in the ring with them and gauge their punching power. I will not reveal my name for personal reasons, but under anoymousity I feel a bit safer. If you want to know my identity send me an email, but I doubt you've heard of me anyway. I only had three professional fights.

I fought Lennox Lewis and Riddick Bowe as an amateur.

Riddicks power wasnt memorable to me. It probably got better as he got older, cause he never even remotely buzzed me in either of our contests.

Lennox hit like a ****ing tank. He cowed me; I won the first round, and he literally broke my spirit and took my soul with a right uppercut and straight right hand in the 2nd. I tried to stay away, and forgot to punch. He never got me quite as good again, but I will never forget those two punches. When we sparred years later, he hit very hard. Distinctly unpleasant to be hit by the man.

David Tua was unpleasant. I can't see myself getting stopped by him early, as he never really staggers me, but every shot hurt, and he'd bang. Every other guy I ever sparred would box when I got aggressive, but David would stand his ground and give. I'd get these horrible headaches after sparring with him, and Dave told me once that whenever he knew I was on the dance card, he'd drink extra water for his brain. Nice guy. Hit like a wrecking ball. David Tua hit hard enough to knock my headgear clean around my face. Dude had a pretty limited style, but that left was quick as a cobra when he was sharp, and boy did it have bite. Having sparred them both, Wladimir would school Tua and probably turn out his lights. He just lacks almost any sort of refinement to his violence. Granted, I don't really either unless I'm really, really on that day, but the best heavyweights I've sparred handled me a lot easier than David did.
Feels kinda bad critiquing the dude, though. He's a fun guy, super hospitable and friendly, hit like a truck and put me through plenty of painful paces. I only hope our careers and lives don't end up with me required to face him with 12's and no mask. I can't afford the surgery.

Evander Holyfield was a machine gun. He put me on my butt first round we ever sparred with a 7 or 8 punch volley. He just punched well; He'd move around and when he let them go, they hit, hard and fast and in large numbers. He was the weakest of the group since Bowe, but probably the most dangerous. He never found me difficult to find, and turned me into a bobble head more than once.

George Foreman was tricky. His jab was absolutely numbing-Ive never felt a jab like that, where your whole face would feel like it got novacained after he hit you with it. He'd also throw light punches primarily, almost pitty pat, till he had the opening, and then he'd wallop you. His punches had the most force; They didn't hurt any worse than Tua or Lewis, but I remember how badly they'd screw with my balance. His shots moved me. He also broke my nose with a straight right.

Wladimir Klitschko hit me by far the hardest, though. I couldn't get past the jab, and his right hands hit like thunder. They reminded me of Lewis', but they were quicker and sharper. Wladimir staggered me regularly in sparring. There are literally whole rounds I don't remember. He also knocked me out with a left hook. Not down, out. Only time in my life I've seen canvas and not been able to stand up by 10 seconds."

"I think I have a good chin. I've only been knocked out once and that was by Wlad. I've been staggered and hurt plenty of times. I've been dropped a few times too but only KO'd once."

"David Tua's punching power is not overrated. I can attest to that. He and George Foreman have a similar feel but Big George is a much better fighter."
Extremely interesting. It would be great to know who the source is. I'm surprised that whomever this is, didn't rate Bowe's power at all.
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Old 12-07-2012, 07:06 PM   #245
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

He says Old Foreman hit as hard as any..Gee imagine what the younger Foreman power must have felt like.

On Marciano/Klitschko,I don't see how anyone can argue how Rocky loses when he was undefeated. It also took a old school trainer philosopher to make Wladimir into a champion, And people still want to argue how great todays HWs are?? lol
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Old 12-07-2012, 07:29 PM   #246
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Solid reasoning there.

Why you hating?
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Old 12-07-2012, 07:31 PM   #247
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Correct, and the logic of that,undefeated record, means my analogy is indeed right.

If he had weakness it did not matter but he came over them to win when Wladimir has looked vulernable more then once which has resulted in defeat.
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Old 12-07-2012, 07:34 PM   #248
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Originally Posted by SP_Mauler View Post
Correct, and the logic of that,undefeated record, means my analogy is indeed right.

If he had weakness it did not matter but he came over them to win when Wladimir has looked vulernable more then once which has resulted in defeat.





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Old 12-07-2012, 07:35 PM   #249
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

The differences between Klitschko and Marciano have already been made in this thread. Everyone can see them.

Fact is that Marciano can't compete with Klitschko.
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Old 12-07-2012, 07:40 PM   #250
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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The differences between Klitschko and Marciano have already been made in this thread. Everyone can see them.

Fact is that Marciano can't compete with Klitschko.
Fact? Really. Have they fought??
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Old 12-07-2012, 08:54 PM   #251
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Rocky was far greater than all of the men that beat Vlad in fact some of the men Rocky beat were greater than the men that beat Vlad, however I do recognize an improvement in Vlad and he is getter better with each fight.

Vlad has some great advantages and size is one of them but I am afraid that even with the size difference Rocky would always be greater than Brewster, and Purity and hit harder, Sanders was an avoided and dangerous guy, Big Southpaw with fast hands and he may have also been able to upset Lennox Lewis with some actual conditioning and the element of surprise but all 3 are far away from what Marciano would bring,relentless Aggression, one punch power and heart.

While I do recognize that Vlad is one of the 3 best Big men to fight and the experience he has gained in his last 15 fights there would be other important factors in this fight, the distance 15 round? and are we plucking Marciano out of a decade from over 60 years ago where training to make weight was important for even a heavyweight that had to fight championship rounds and if so can we also be fair enough to reverse-evolve Vlad to an era 60 years ago where some of the modern weight training and weight gaining and muscle building did not exist ...either way this is not an easy fight for either man prime vs prime..Vlad has an excellent rhythm over 12 rounds and a GREAT defense but Marciano was one of the greatest Rhythm breakers with his unorthodox punching which was one of his underrated talents especially against the defensive wizards and he could always land a right hand like he did vs Rex Layne or Walcott or a hook like he dropped Charles and Matthews and Moore, and Marciano was a danger for 15 rounds, yes these were smaller men but a chin is a chin and this fight would be a super fight in Rocky's era or present...
"Greatness" is absolutely irrelevant. It's all about skills and physical characteristics.

Why do you think that Marciano hit harder than Brewster, Purrity, and Sanders? If nothing else, all of them were huge compared to Marciano, and most of their wins came by stoppage. These guys stopped much bigger men than Marciano did. Marciano beat up a bunch of cruiserweight runts while wearing 6 ounce gloves. Marciano never knocked out a decent large heavyweight. In fact, Marciano's power isn't even proven at real heavyweight.

How is Marciano going to disrupt Vlad's rhythm? By plodding into jabs? Those jabs will **** him up. Marciano doesn't have the explosive quickness get past the jab and make something happen. Also, the jab is bad enough, but Vlad's power shots would absolutely wreck Marciano.
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:00 AM   #252
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

So wrong. Marciano was deceptively hard to hit. Walcott and Charles had great jabs but you don't see either dominating in any way with it. The idea that Wlad pumps jabs at Rocky to a point where he can't get in close is highly imaginative. Marciano gets real small and low in there and Wlad will be hard pressed to land consistently. Concurrent Marciano will get in close and pound away before Wlad clinches. Wlad is wide open for right hands and rocky had one of the best all time. As mentioned Wlads chin is china and he has no courage. I just watched all three of his brutal ko defeats by nobodies. He is not beating Marciano or any truly great past champion. Timber and watch for that I want my mommy look.
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:30 AM   #253
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Wake me up when the next bobble headed 5 foot 11 Ital with T-rex arms weighing in at 180 takes even a regional heavyweight title.

Or I suppose all that elite talent is in the NFL or NBA.
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:49 AM   #254
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Nah, bowling.
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:59 AM   #255
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Rocky would never find himself in a position where he could damage wlad.

Its like khaosai v hearns the critique of being chinny doesn't really apply because of the size difference.
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