Do you consider Juan Manuel Marquez to be an ATG

[red cobra]

Originally Posted by Boxed Ears

If you've got a sweet bippy lying around, you can take the mufucka out and bet it.



I really don't see what John Jacob Wingleheimerschmidt has anything to do with anything, RC.

What i'm alluding to is the parallel between the two of them..repeated attempts vs the same opponent (JJW vs Charles/JMM vs Pac) before scoring 1 punch ko's over their nemesis...and i liken JMM to Walcott inasfar as his overall abilities are concerned. He's an excellent fighter, but not the alltime great he's being pumped up to be by you guys. Not even the greatest Mexican champ of all time.

[Flea Man]

Originally Posted by orriray59

For the record, I have the series 3-1 for Marquez. I scored the second and third fights for him.

Same as.

To be honest I cannot see any way in which Pacquiao has won 2 or 3.

[Unforgiven]

Originally Posted by red cobra

Ali was far closer to prime than was Manny in that 4th fight with JMM. That disputed loss in Pac's previous fight should be an indicator that he's slipped.

Don't you think JMM has slipped a bit too, at age 39 ?
If not, he must be truly great to have remained so good for so long.

[MoJoGoodie]

Absolutely an ATG...anything less would be a robbery...like that one match he had...

[prime]

Originally Posted by red cobra

[/b]
What i'm alluding to is the parallel between the two of them..repeated attempts vs the same opponent (JJW vs Charles/JMM vs Pac) before scoring 1 punch ko's over their nemesis...and i liken JMM to Walcott inasfar as his overall abilities are concerned. He's an excellent fighter, but not the alltime great he's being pumped up to be by you guys. Not even the greatest Mexican champ of all time.

The parallel is not without merit, but is misleading: Walcott had retired 6 times before finally winning the crown at age 37. He is no Juan Manuel Márquez.

[MagnaNasakki]

Originally Posted by orriray59

For the record, I have the series 3-1 for Marquez. I scored the second and third fights for him.

I have it 4-0 for Marquez, but I can absolutely see scoring the first fight to Manny.

2nd fight was close, but the only way to have it for Pac is to have it 6-6. NO WAY did Pacquiao win 7 rounds. I had Marquez winning seven rounds, close fight, Manny got it, these things happen.

Third fight, Pacquiao got a gift. Period. He was schooled, 8-4.

And, of course, 4th fight he got KTFO.

I think Marquez has proven to be more then Pacquiao's match in terms of actual ability in the ring. They are on the same tier of fighter in terms of skill and ability. Pacquiao accomplished more with his career, and it will probably go down in history that way, because I see Marquez as being near the end.

[Bogotazo]

Originally Posted by MagnaNasakki

I have it 4-0 for Marquez, but I can absolutely see scoring the first fight to Manny.

2nd fight was close, but the only way to have it for Pac is to have it 6-6. NO WAY did Pacquiao win 7 rounds. I had Marquez winning seven rounds, close fight, Manny got it, these things happen.

Third fight, Pacquiao got a gift. Period. He was schooled, 8-4.

And, of course, 4th fight he got KTFO.

I think Marquez has proven to be more then Pacquiao's match in terms of actual ability in the ring. They are on the same tier of fighter in terms of skill and ability. Pacquiao accomplished more with his career, and it will probably go down in history that way, because I see Marquez as being near the end.

I agree.

[Tin_Ribs]

So I'm not the only one on here who has Marquez winning the series 4-zip......

[red cobra]

Originally Posted by Unforgiven

Don't you think JMM has slipped a bit too, at age 39 ?
If not, he must be truly great to have remained so good for so long.

Yes, I think JMM has declined too, though a big shot like he landed on Pac obscures the evidence somewhat. I predict a not too lengthy reign for him.

[Goyourownway]

I mean,if guys like Bob Foster can be regarded as all time greats,I see no reason why a guy like 1 Manuel should be excluded.You can't hold it against the guy for having his fights recorded in colour.