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Old 12-26-2012, 07:09 AM   #1
Bogotazo
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Default How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

Posted this in another thread that died, ended up putting some thought into it, so I figured I'd share. Let me know what you think.

-----------

I see little chance for Guerrero to win, but if I had to give him a way to do so, it would be like this:

I see Guerrero having success using a diversity of tactics, mainly centered around ambush fighting. On the one hand, Guerrero is a respectable boxer who fights well from the outside. The issue here is that Floyd has much more experience timing and seeing shots from long range, where he has an advantage. On the other hand, Guerrero has shown the tenacity and skill necessary for dirty inside fighting. And the problem there would be that Floyd is undoubtedly the superior inside fighter, having more experience and exhibiting all-time-great defensive skill in the pocket.

The solution here is to engage in one when it's convenient on Guerrero's own terms, and then switch modes before Floyd can begin to capitalize on his strengths at either range.

On the outside, what Guerrero needs to do is take small steps back and small steps forward. When coming forward, he needs to keep his hands up and work his right jab while controlling the center. He cant just follow Floyd around the perimeter and run into shots, he needs to be patient and cut off the ring efficiently. Following the right jab should be a straight left, either down the pipe or when Floyd bends to his right to avoid the right jab. Then he needs to hop out and feint and repeat the process. Doing so allows Floyd to keep guessing as to what punches may follow without being sure.

Stepping backwards is another way for Guerrero to score on the outside. Floyd usually puts his weight on the front foot when coming forward. Here, Guerrero needs to circle (away from the right) and back-step, making him reach, and knock his jab hand down anytime he tries to measure or feint with it. Anytime Floyd reaches with his punches, such as a jab to the body or a straight right that lifts up his right leg, Guerrero should come back at him and take advantage by following up with straight punches to which Floyd can only defend having put himself slightly out of position.

Choosing when to engage on the inside will be crucial as well. If he has success feinting and getting into Floyd's range, or making him reach and rushing him backwards, then he can either choose to restart the process on the outside, or take the opportunity either of these scenarios to get all up in Floyds guard. Now, Floyd is no Berto. He's going to be able to see the shots Guerrero is throwing and position his body with his forearm before letting off uppercuts to the head and body and rolling shots before countering with a straight up top. But Floyd does those things after settling into a rhythm; his priority at first is always to defend. Guerrero can take advantage of this by ambush fighting. Throw combinations, hold and hit, and then back out a bit. Stay in range, feint, feint, explode again. Exit, and resume the outside strategy.

Lots of fighters make the mistake of staying inside on Floyd, but I think more would benefit from ambush tactics that, while they may not always succeed in landing clean punches on Floyd, disrupt his rhythm and neutralize his offense without giving him time to come back right away.

(There's a really relevant GIF of Ortiz ambushing Mayweather on the ropes I want to put here, not the one leading up to the KO but an earlier exchange, can't seem to find it anywhere.)

Also, a good tactic to use on the inside for a fighter of either stance is to stick the left hand straight onto Mayweather's right glove and push it there. He rarely throws his left in the pocket unless he pushes you off first, and it's usually tucked to protect his body and chin with the shoulder. Guerrero pressing his body onto Floyd's left arm and pushing back Floyd's right glove allows him a space to land the right to the body (a part of Floyd's that's most often exposed) and explode suddenly without Floyd having that right hand completely at his disposal, before exiting again.

I repeat, I think Floyd will too easily neutralize Guerrero's straight punching and outclass Guerrero on the inside, but if he's going to have a chance, a diversity of tactics is the way to go, and treating Floyd like a puncher (as another poster alluded to) is the best way to reduce his accuracy and make your offense count more round after round, especially when your tools are technical than they are physical.

&

I'm also going to have to adjust my idea of parrying Floyd's pawing left jab; it's too dangerous. In looking for the Ortiz GIF I saw one where he sticks it out and as Ortiz goes to parry it, he drops his guard for the straight right. **** that. Letting Floyd initiate the feints and exchanges will get you nowhere. Only Marquez, a great technician, Hatton, a fearless swarmer, and Judah, a super athletic speed demon have been able to take what Floyd throws at them and come back with something better. Cotto too, in a combination of textbook boxer-puncher fundamentals and grit. But at the end of the day it didn't work out for any one of them.

----------

Discuss.
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Old 12-26-2012, 07:24 AM   #2
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

Interesting post

Ever since the Marquez fight Floyd has made a conscious effort to be more aggressive, whether its because his legs are going or he has chosen to stalk forward I dunno.

I see the Guerrero fight being an anti-climatic spoilfest full of grappling & fouls.
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Old 12-26-2012, 07:25 AM   #3
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

Fake getting knocked out in the 1st round as you have no shot anyway and collect your paycheck.
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Old 12-26-2012, 07:28 AM   #4
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

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Fake getting knocked out in the 1st round as you have no shot anyway and collect your paycheck.
And cash out on your new found fame with easy fights, It would be easy to seel a rematch with Berto to the casuals
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Old 12-26-2012, 07:31 AM   #5
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

I agree almost entirely with what you say, Bogotazo.

The general concencus (not necessarily on here, but other places i've seen) has always been that you need to be a big, strong pressure fighter with a great chin and high punch output to beat Floyd, but i have always disagreed with that.

I've always felt that you need a variety of gameplans to beat Floyd and you need the ability to shift tactics and strategy mid-round. You need to be versatile and more than adequete in following at least 3 different stratergys. Floyd is so brilliant at ad******g that he can do it on his own, mid-round and early on in the fight. He rarely gets caught with the same shot twice and he can change his own offence in the very rare occasions it doesn't work (couldn't find the target often against Cotto so he brings the lead uppercut into play, which i'd rarely, if ever seen from him).

Guerrero DOES have this versatility. He can be a slick, relatively elusive southpaw who fights predominantly from the outside, and he showed his infighting ability against a bigger man in Andre Berto. He basically out-dogged Berto in that fight and wanted it more, but could he do this against Floyd? Not imo, no, although he would have to do it at times in the fight. He's also showed (in i think it was the Katsidis fight) that he can fight from strange angles at mid-long distance and throw LOTS of punches per round. Haven't seen that fight for a while but i'm pretty sure he was throwing body shots, jabs, straight lefts, 4, 5, 6 punch combinations, the lot. I do remember being impressed with his offensive arsenal in that fight and i picked him to beat Maidana in their scheduled bout.

What i'm saying is that Guerrero DOES have the versatility that i believe to be required in order to beat Floyd. You don't just beat him with one gameplan because, whatever it is, he WILL make the adjustments required to neutralise your gameplan. Is Guerrero good enough at the variety of gameplans i mention to beat Floyd? No, not a chance.

FWIW, i respect your opinion greatly on here and i wouldn't follow too dissimilar a stratergy to the one you laid out.
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:03 AM   #6
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

i allways go with mayweather, not b.ecause everybody else do, but because he is so frikkin skilled. i did pick oscar to beat him thoug. but boxingfans seems to bee so ****ing blind about an boxer aging. mayweather is getting old for an boxer
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:11 AM   #7
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

Fight long, pop the jab, stay on the move, mix it up, don't brawl.
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:54 AM   #8
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

Posting to bookmark and comeback later. Too muh to try to eead and reply to ob my phone.

Thanks for the effort as always, Bogo.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:11 AM   #9
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogotazo View Post
Posted this in another thread that died, ended up putting some thought into it, so I figured I'd share. Let me know what you think.

-----------

I see little chance for Guerrero to win, but if I had to give him a way to do so, it would be like this:

I see Guerrero having success using a diversity of tactics, mainly centered around ambush fighting. On the one hand,

Guerrero is a respectable boxer who fights well from the outside. The issue here is that Floyd has much more experience timing and seeing shots from long range, where he has an advantage.


On the other hand, Guerrero has shown the tenacity and skill necessary for dirty inside fighting. And the problem there would be that Floyd is undoubtedly the superior inside fighter, having more experience and exhibiting all-time-great defensive skill in the pocket.

The solution here is to engage in one when it's convenient on Guerrero's own terms, and then switch modes before Floyd can begin to capitalize on his strengths at either range.

On the outside, what Guerrero needs to do is take small steps back and small steps forward. When coming forward, he needs to keep his hands up and work his right jab while controlling the center. He cant just follow Floyd around the perimeter and run into shots, he needs to be patient and cut off the ring efficiently. Following the right jab should be a straight left, either down the pipe or when Floyd bends to his right to avoid the right jab. Then he needs to hop out and feint and repeat the process. Doing so allows Floyd to keep guessing as to what punches may follow without being sure.

Stepping backwards is another way for Guerrero to score on the outside. Floyd usually puts his weight on the front foot when coming forward. Here, Guerrero needs to circle (away from the right) and back-step, making him reach, and knock his jab hand down anytime he tries to measure or feint with it. Anytime Floyd reaches with his punches, such as a jab to the body or a straight right that lifts up his right leg, Guerrero should come back at him and take advantage by following up with straight punches to which Floyd can only defend having put himself slightly out of position.

Choosing when to engage on the inside will be crucial as well. If he has success feinting and getting into Floyd's range, or making him reach and rushing him backwards, then he can either choose to restart the process on the outside, or take the opportunity either of these scenarios to get all up in Floyds guard. Now, Floyd is no Berto. He's going to be able to see the shots Guerrero is throwing and position his body with his forearm before letting off uppercuts to the head and body and rolling shots before countering with a straight up top. But Floyd does those things after settling into a rhythm; his priority at first is always to defend. Guerrero can take advantage of this by ambush fighting. Throw combinations, hold and hit, and then back out a bit. Stay in range, feint, feint, explode again. Exit, and resume the outside strategy.

Lots of fighters make the mistake of staying inside on Floyd, but I think more would benefit from ambush tactics that, while they may not always succeed in landing clean punches on Floyd, disrupt his rhythm and neutralize his offense without giving him time to come back right away.

(There's a really relevant GIF of Ortiz ambushing Mayweather on the ropes I want to put here, not the one leading up to the KO but an earlier exchange, can't seem to find it anywhere.)

Also, a good tactic to use on the inside for a fighter of either stance is to stick the left hand straight onto Mayweather's right glove and push it there. He rarely throws his left in the pocket unless he pushes you off first, and it's usually tucked to protect his body and chin with the shoulder. Guerrero pressing his body onto Floyd's left arm and pushing back Floyd's right glove allows him a space to land the right to the body (a part of Floyd's that's most often exposed) and explode suddenly without Floyd having that right hand completely at his disposal, before exiting again.

I repeat, I think Floyd will too easily neutralize Guerrero's straight punching and outclass Guerrero on the inside, but if he's going to have a chance, a diversity of tactics is the way to go, and treating Floyd like a puncher (as another poster alluded to) is the best way to reduce his accuracy and make your offense count more round after round, especially when your tools are technical than they are physical.

&

I'm also going to have to adjust my idea of parrying Floyd's pawing left jab; it's too dangerous. In looking for the Ortiz GIF I saw one where he sticks it out and as Ortiz goes to parry it, he drops his guard for the straight right. **** that. Letting Floyd initiate the feints and exchanges will get you nowhere. Only Marquez, a great technician, Hatton, a fearless swarmer, and Judah, a super athletic speed demon have been able to take what Floyd throws at them and come back with something better. Cotto too, in a combination of textbook boxer-puncher fundamentals and grit. But at the end of the day it didn't work out for any one of them.

----------

Discuss.
1. I think he lacks the speed of foot to 'ambush' fight Mayweather. Mayweather's feet have slowed dramatically and he's much more stationairy than ever, but RG has a long way to get inwards and I just see him walking on to uppercuts. (A punch Mayweather has begun to throw with increasing regularity.)

2. That's the key buddy. The length. I see no conceivable way for Guererro to establish the jab, nor do I see him having the ring generalship in relation to Mayweather to dictate the rythm of the Boxing exchanges.

3. Again spot on. Berto has relied on physical tools all his life, so he was taken aback by the strength and tenacity of Guererro, which was aided by the Mexican American's craft. Berto has very little in the way of ring craft. As Guererro tries to make room for his own punches on Mayweather, he'll have to contend with Mayweather's use of his elbows which not only protects him, but actually manouvers Guererro into position for Mayweather's own work. I think that alot of the time, the fighter doesn't realise that they've been set up. They are subtly moved from the position they worked into, to a different one and still throw the shot that they originally intended to. Thus exposing themselves.

The rest of your post is intreuging and not open to crisitism at-all. If you or I were training Guererro we'd be almost identical in approach. For this fight, I'd suggest Guererro make it as dirty as possible. (When it happens, this fight will be dirty) Work in close behind that right jab, don't try and score with it, just pump it over and over to occupy Mayweather's thought process and get close, from there stamp on Mayweather's lead foot, smash your knee into his, but don't stand and watch, aim to deliver your shot a half second after the impact of the dirty tactics. Deception is the key here.

Mayweather can think in there, Guererro will need to feel. Spend training camp working on what you think will work, drill it over and over till it becomes habbit. RG can't afford that additional second it takes to mentally conceive a plan, if he does then he'll look back to reality and see that the entire chess board has changed.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:24 AM   #10
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

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Originally Posted by DrMo View Post
Interesting post

Ever since the Marquez fight Floyd has made a conscious effort to be more aggressive, whether its because his legs are going or he has chosen to stalk forward I dunno.

I see the Guerrero fight being an anti-climatic spoilfest full of grappling & fouls.
It'll be a super easy and cleaner fight for Floyd if he walks Guerrero down.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:37 AM   #11
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogotazo View Post
Posted this in another thread that died, ended up putting some thought into it, so I figured I'd share. Let me know what you think.

-----------

I see little chance for Guerrero to win, but if I had to give him a way to do so, it would be like this:

I see Guerrero having success using a diversity of tactics, mainly centered around ambush fighting. On the one hand, Guerrero is a respectable boxer who fights well from the outside. The issue here is that Floyd has much more experience timing and seeing shots from long range, where he has an advantage. On the other hand, Guerrero has shown the tenacity and skill necessary for dirty inside fighting. And the problem there would be that Floyd is undoubtedly the superior inside fighter, having more experience and exhibiting all-time-great defensive skill in the pocket.

The solution here is to engage in one when it's convenient on Guerrero's own terms, and then switch modes before Floyd can begin to capitalize on his strengths at either range.

On the outside, what Guerrero needs to do is take small steps back and small steps forward. When coming forward, he needs to keep his hands up and work his right jab while controlling the center. He cant just follow Floyd around the perimeter and run into shots, he needs to be patient and cut off the ring efficiently. Following the right jab should be a straight left, either down the pipe or when Floyd bends to his right to avoid the right jab. Then he needs to hop out and feint and repeat the process. Doing so allows Floyd to keep guessing as to what punches may follow without being sure.

Stepping backwards is another way for Guerrero to score on the outside. Floyd usually puts his weight on the front foot when coming forward. Here, Guerrero needs to circle (away from the right) and back-step, making him reach, and knock his jab hand down anytime he tries to measure or feint with it. Anytime Floyd reaches with his punches, such as a jab to the body or a straight right that lifts up his right leg, Guerrero should come back at him and take advantage by following up with straight punches to which Floyd can only defend having put himself slightly out of position.

Choosing when to engage on the inside will be crucial as well. If he has success feinting and getting into Floyd's range, or making him reach and rushing him backwards, then he can either choose to restart the process on the outside, or take the opportunity either of these scenarios to get all up in Floyds guard. Now, Floyd is no Berto. He's going to be able to see the shots Guerrero is throwing and position his body with his forearm before letting off uppercuts to the head and body and rolling shots before countering with a straight up top. But Floyd does those things after settling into a rhythm; his priority at first is always to defend. Guerrero can take advantage of this by ambush fighting. Throw combinations, hold and hit, and then back out a bit. Stay in range, feint, feint, explode again. Exit, and resume the outside strategy.

Lots of fighters make the mistake of staying inside on Floyd, but I think more would benefit from ambush tactics that, while they may not always succeed in landing clean punches on Floyd, disrupt his rhythm and neutralize his offense without giving him time to come back right away.

(There's a really relevant GIF of Ortiz ambushing Mayweather on the ropes I want to put here, not the one leading up to the KO but an earlier exchange, can't seem to find it anywhere.)

Also, a good tactic to use on the inside for a fighter of either stance is to stick the left hand straight onto Mayweather's right glove and push it there. He rarely throws his left in the pocket unless he pushes you off first, and it's usually tucked to protect his body and chin with the shoulder. Guerrero pressing his body onto Floyd's left arm and pushing back Floyd's right glove allows him a space to land the right to the body (a part of Floyd's that's most often exposed) and explode suddenly without Floyd having that right hand completely at his disposal, before exiting again.

I repeat, I think Floyd will too easily neutralize Guerrero's straight punching and outclass Guerrero on the inside, but if he's going to have a chance, a diversity of tactics is the way to go, and treating Floyd like a puncher (as another poster alluded to) is the best way to reduce his accuracy and make your offense count more round after round, especially when your tools are technical than they are physical.

&

I'm also going to have to adjust my idea of parrying Floyd's pawing left jab; it's too dangerous. In looking for the Ortiz GIF I saw one where he sticks it out and as Ortiz goes to parry it, he drops his guard for the straight right. **** that. Letting Floyd initiate the feints and exchanges will get you nowhere. Only Marquez, a great technician, Hatton, a fearless swarmer, and Judah, a super athletic speed demon have been able to take what Floyd throws at them and come back with something better. Cotto too, in a combination of textbook boxer-puncher fundamentals and grit. But at the end of the day it didn't work out for any one of them.

----------

Discuss.
Mayweather and Marquez aren't the same guy as you kindly like to point out and remind us, but is trying to ambush a counterpuncher the way to go? A counterpuncher just used an ambush fighter as sacrifice for the knockout of the year 2.5 weeks ago.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SJS19 View Post
1. I think he lacks the speed of foot to 'ambush' fight Mayweather. Mayweather's feet have slowed dramatically and he's much more stationairy than ever, but RG has a long way to get inwards and I just see him walking on to uppercuts. (A punch Mayweather has begun to throw with increasing regularity.)

2. That's the key buddy. The length. I see no conceivable way for Guererro to establish the jab, nor do I see him having the ring generalship in relation to Mayweather to dictate the rythm of the Boxing exchanges.

3. Again spot on. Berto has relied on physical tools all his life, so he was taken aback by the strength and tenacity of Guererro, which was aided by the Mexican American's craft. Berto has very little in the way of ring craft. As Guererro tries to make room for his own punches on Mayweather, he'll have to contend with Mayweather's use of his elbows which not only protects him, but actually manouvers Guererro into position for Mayweather's own work. I think that alot of the time, the fighter doesn't realise that they've been set up. They are subtly moved from the position they worked into, to a different one and still throw the shot that they originally intended to. Thus exposing themselves.

The rest of your post is intreuging and not open to crisitism at-all. If you or I were training Guererro we'd be almost identical in approach. For this fight, I'd suggest Guererro make it as dirty as possible. (When it happens, this fight will be dirty) Work in close behind that right jab, don't try and score with it, just pump it over and over to occupy Mayweather's thought process and get close, from there stamp on Mayweather's lead foot, smash your knee into his, but don't stand and watch, aim to deliver your shot a half second after the impact of the dirty tactics. Deception is the key here.

Mayweather can think in there, Guererro will need to feel. Spend training camp working on what you think will work, drill it over and over till it becomes habbit. RG can't afford that additional second it takes to mentally conceive a plan, if he does then he'll look back to reality and see that the entire chess board has changed.
I feel Floyd isn't super dirty when his opponent keeps it respectful. Ortiz tried taking it there with Floyd and was publicly executed.

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If it goes that route, Mayweather has a deep toolbox for dirty fighting. Hopkins surprised us when he thumbed Pascal in the eye with hi jab.
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Old 12-26-2012, 01:12 PM   #12
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

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I agree almost entirely with what you say, Bogotazo.

The general concencus (not necessarily on here, but other places i've seen) has always been that you need to be a big, strong pressure fighter with a great chin and high punch output to beat Floyd, but i have always disagreed with that.

I've always felt that you need a variety of gameplans to beat Floyd and you need the ability to shift tactics and strategy mid-round. You need to be versatile and more than adequete in following at least 3 different stratergys. Floyd is so brilliant at ad******g that he can do it on his own, mid-round and early on in the fight. He rarely gets caught with the same shot twice and he can change his own offence in the very rare occasions it doesn't work (couldn't find the target often against Cotto so he brings the lead uppercut into play, which i'd rarely, if ever seen from him).

Guerrero DOES have this versatility. He can be a slick, relatively elusive southpaw who fights predominantly from the outside, and he showed his infighting ability against a bigger man in Andre Berto. He basically out-dogged Berto in that fight and wanted it more, but could he do this against Floyd? Not imo, no, although he would have to do it at times in the fight. He's also showed (in i think it was the Katsidis fight) that he can fight from strange angles at mid-long distance and throw LOTS of punches per round. Haven't seen that fight for a while but i'm pretty sure he was throwing body shots, jabs, straight lefts, 4, 5, 6 punch combinations, the lot. I do remember being impressed with his offensive arsenal in that fight and i picked him to beat Maidana in their scheduled bout.

What i'm saying is that Guerrero DOES have the versatility that i believe to be required in order to beat Floyd. You don't just beat him with one gameplan because, whatever it is, he WILL make the adjustments required to neutralise your gameplan. Is Guerrero good enough at the variety of gameplans i mention to beat Floyd? No, not a chance.

FWIW, i respect your opinion greatly on here and i wouldn't follow too dissimilar a stratergy to the one you laid out.
Agreed with everything said, good post, and thanks for the compliments! That part in bold is just how I feel. It's the best we can do in the fictional universe where we're on Team Ghost, but I wouldn't be betting on it by any stretch. Floyd is just so good at nearly everything.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SJS19 View Post
1. I think he lacks the speed of foot to 'ambush' fight Mayweather. Mayweather's feet have slowed dramatically and he's much more stationairy than ever, but RG has a long way to get inwards and I just see him walking on to uppercuts. (A punch Mayweather has begun to throw with increasing regularity.)

2. That's the key buddy. The length. I see no conceivable way for Guererro to establish the jab, nor do I see him having the ring generalship in relation to Mayweather to dictate the rythm of the Boxing exchanges.

3. Again spot on. Berto has relied on physical tools all his life, so he was taken aback by the strength and tenacity of Guererro, which was aided by the Mexican American's craft. Berto has very little in the way of ring craft. As Guererro tries to make room for his own punches on Mayweather, he'll have to contend with Mayweather's use of his elbows which not only protects him, but actually manouvers Guererro into position for Mayweather's own work. I think that alot of the time, the fighter doesn't realise that they've been set up. They are subtly moved from the position they worked into, to a different one and still throw the shot that they originally intended to. Thus exposing themselves.

The rest of your post is intreuging and not open to crisitism at-all. If you or I were training Guererro we'd be almost identical in approach. For this fight, I'd suggest Guererro make it as dirty as possible. (When it happens, this fight will be dirty) Work in close behind that right jab, don't try and score with it, just pump it over and over to occupy Mayweather's thought process and get close, from there stamp on Mayweather's lead foot, smash your knee into his, but don't stand and watch, aim to deliver your shot a half second after the impact of the dirty tactics. Deception is the key here.

Mayweather can think in there, Guererro will need to feel. Spend training camp working on what you think will work, drill it over and over till it becomes habbit. RG can't afford that additional second it takes to mentally conceive a plan, if he does then he'll look back to reality and see that the entire chess board has changed.
1. Yeah, this is a problem. I think he should inch forward, then take a step, not try to come straight in from far with all punches blazing. As you said, foot-speed. But this is also why I want Guerrero to make him lead at times; make him pick up his rear foot as he throws, then push him back after he's gotten slightly off balance.

2. Like you said later, pumping out the jab without landing it is more what I was going for, didn't make it quite clear. DLH didn't land his jab that often, Judah didn't land his jab that often, but when they both threw it, Floyd was on the back-foot and they could find their way forward, either by circling right (Zab) or ducking under behind a high guard (Oscar) to avoid that right hand early.

3. Spot on, Guerrero can't be seduced into staying there, thinking he's suddenly found the answer simply because he's chest to chest. Big mistake. It's a reason I emphasized ambush fighting; the focus wouldn't be so much on the attack, but on the exit. Still need that Ortiz GIF, it shows what I'm talking about really well...oh shit I found it!!

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See, right there, Ortiz is not landing a whole lot and is imposing his size to an extent, but he backs out twice without taking a single counter. Both of those times, Mayweather is caught in an exchange initiated not on his terms and has no answer. Do that a few times per round, you can go into the 2nd half with a lead. As we established, Guerrero can't just walk in, but he can get there. Your dirty fighting tactics are great advice, especially considering Guerrero can lunge into a straight left as he's knocking knees and scuffling with elbows. But again, he can't stay there, or he'll be out of his depth.

We'd make a great team, you and I.

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Originally Posted by Slickstar View Post
Mayweather and Marquez aren't the same guy as you kindly like to point out and remind us, but is trying to ambush a counterpuncher the way to go? A counterpuncher just used an ambush fighter as sacrifice for the knockout of the year 2.5 weeks ago.

I feel Floyd isn't super dirty when his opponent keeps it respectful. Ortiz tried taking it there with Floyd and was publicly executed.

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If it goes that route, Mayweather has a deep toolbox for dirty fighting. Hopkins surprised us when he thumbed Pascal in the eye with hi jab.
Well, it can't be the only tactic. Because Floyd would eventually figure out the in-and-out, especially since Guerrero is no Pacquiao on his feet. Which is why I think he should circle and back-step from Floyd, so he can make him reach, and then go towards the inside; or feint behind a jab, then explode at close range before getting back to the center. The trick IMO is to reduce Floyd's accuracy as much as possible. Hence, don't stay in the pocket too long either, because as you say, Floyd would out-craft him on the inside.
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Old 12-26-2012, 01:46 PM   #13
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

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Originally Posted by Bogotazo View Post
3. Spot on, Guerrero can't be seduced into staying there, thinking he's suddenly found the answer simply because he's chest to chest. Big mistake. It's a reason I emphasized ambush fighting; the focus wouldn't be so much on the attack, but on the exit. Still need that Ortiz GIF, it shows what I'm talking about really well...oh shit I found it!!

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I see what you're getting at. If Mayweather feels rushed, he defends. He likes working at his own pace like a boss. DLH was able to rush him a couple of times with the jab, so Floyd adapted by jabbing and moving laterally.
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Old 12-26-2012, 02:19 PM   #14
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Default Re: How I would advise Robert Guerrero to fight Floyd Mayweather Jr.

Good post Bogo. I'd get Guerrero ready mentally first of all. No fight mattered before, no fight matters after Floyd! This is it! Make him watch nothing, but Castillo-Mayweather I, Duran-Leonard I, Basilio-Robinson I, and Frazier-Ali I. He needs the mindset to know how an elite brawler should and can handle an elite boxer. By first and foremost NOT falling for what the boxer does best, boxing. Even Berto was getting the better of Robert at long range tho Robert would land a straight left on occasion. Give Floyd distance and he'll pick you apart. Robert has to improve on faster footwork to cut the ring off on Floyd. Sure Floyd uses elbow alot, but I think Robert might be the stronger of the 2, Floyd will have a hard time trying to move Robert around he'll be too busy defending. Robert can offset Floyd using alot of mini-feints just to make Floyd open up, but mostly importantly, Guerrero needs to attack and wear down the body as the last rounds will be crucial. He needs to fight mad for 12 rounds and punch nonstop for 12. That he's getting hit theres no doubt about it, but needs to make sure he finishes the exchanges like he did vs Berto.
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Old 12-26-2012, 02:26 PM   #15
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That's not a whole lot to hang your hat on if you are a Guerrero supporter (like I will be that night). I read this post and it confirms just how slim his chances really are.

Nice breakdown as always.
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