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Old 01-07-2013, 10:51 AM   #61
Matt Ldn
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Default Re: I Want to Become a Slickster

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What on earth are you talking about? Research shows that stretching doesn't prevent injury. Muscle tears generally occur within a 20% range of resting length. Athletes use dynamic stretching during their warm up i.e. swinging their arms and legs through the range of motion. That's for performance and does nothing to prevent injury. Holding stretches (static stretching) decreases power, coordination and most likely increases injury risk as the cytoskeleton is stretched instead of the actin and myosin. That means by holding stretches you're more flexible at rest, makes no difference during activity though (crossbridge cycling).
Are you saying that static stretching after a workout doesn't help reduce lactic acid or anything like that which I got told at school?? Are there no physical benefits to stretching after a work out (other than the benefits you would get from static stretching when independent of a workout).

On a seperate note what are your qualifications/experience in the sports science field. Not to be confrontational just curious you come across as very knowledgeable.
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Old 01-07-2013, 11:47 AM   #62
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Are you saying that static stretching after a workout doesn't help reduce lactic acid or anything like that which I got told at school?? Are there no physical benefits to stretching after a work out (other than the benefits you would get from static stretching when independent of a workout).

On a seperate note what are your qualifications/experience in the sports science field. Not to be confrontational just curious you come across as very knowledgeable.
After a workout static stretching won't do anything for lactic acid, keeping your limbs held in one position (especially isometrically) is going to impair the process of flushing away metabolic byproducts if anything. Light movement, a cool down is the best thing in that regard, along with things like contrast therapy and compression garments. The only benefit from static stretching after a workout that you might not get from an independent session is that since you're already warmed up you'll be more compliant and you may be able to increase your flexibility further than you could otherwise, the plastic changes may be longer lasting. I have an MSc in a related field and professional experience with sporting teams/elite athletes.
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Old 01-07-2013, 11:52 AM   #63
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But you are not understanding the question originally posed, and please don't refer to me as moronic. The question was "I want to be a slickster." Would you, in any way shape or form, judge the answer to that question to be...do yoga, duck under a slip line, or work your glutes?
So many, far too many, teach boxing as an exercise you can get good at by doing something else and that simply is not true. I don't give a screaming **** how far you can run or how high you can jump...has nothing at all to do with your boxing ability. If you ALREADY know how to fight, it may well enhance that ability. In and of itself it will not make you a good fighter. Learn how to fight. That creates the muscle memory that allows you to slip, counter, turn a guy, all the things that make you slick. Nothing else has **** all to do with it because it is based on boxing specific knowledge and you acquire boxing specific knowledge only by boxing.
I don't know you from a bar of soap, I said that saying boxing skills are 1000% independent from other activities was moronic.
We're on the same page, I'm not saying to do those things instead of boxing, I'm saying add those things on top of your training and you'll improve your ability to be slick. I don't know what gave you the impression that I was saying to do yoga instead of boxing.
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Old 01-07-2013, 03:03 PM   #64
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When have I ever claimed that some other exercise will compensate? The things I've talked about are supplementary, they add to and support your skill training. I would never claim that things like yoga, weights etc. are a substitute, I'd love to know how you're getting that. It's not either or, you need a bit of everything. Anything that helps you become more aware of your body and improves proprioception is going to help your boxing, you don't have one body for boxing and one body for everything else. Strength training accelerates motor learning as I mentioned before. You need to open your mind up a bit, you're not going to be the best boxer you can be if all you do is boxing.
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Old 01-08-2013, 04:11 AM   #65
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Watch JERSEY JOE WALCOTT !
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Old 01-09-2013, 07:51 AM   #66
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I remember reading a boxing book and there is a quote from a qualified doctor in it and a sports scientist who said scrap knows far more than some of his colleagues....

just throwing that out there in a suitably vague, scrap like manner
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Old 01-09-2013, 08:27 AM   #67
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Default Re: I Want to Become a Slickster

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After a workout static stretching won't do anything for lactic acid, keeping your limbs held in one position (especially isometrically) is going to impair the process of flushing away metabolic byproducts if anything. Light movement, a cool down is the best thing in that regard, along with things like contrast therapy and compression garments. The only benefit from static stretching after a workout that you might not get from an independent session is that since you're already warmed up you'll be more compliant and you may be able to increase your flexibility further than you could otherwise, the plastic changes may be longer lasting. I have an MSc in a related field and professional experience with sporting teams/elite athletes.
didn't realise that, one of them things I heard and just assumed it was true. Plastic changes??

Do you work with any boxers?

p.s. do you reckon it would be possible to perform any kind of useful contrast therapy using a shower sometime after training??
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Old 01-09-2013, 09:14 AM   #68
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The VR continues to change lives. Latest good new story below !

(Please note: The system used in this video is a prototype and should not be taken for a final product)

A 42 year old man who has spent the last ten years unable to work due to a serious injury incurred at work when a 7.5 ton excavator bucket was dropped on his head.

Major trauma to his body, no breaks, but all the fluid lost from virtually every joint in his body.

12 months later he returned to work part time suffering agony with every step and had a further accident when a forklift dropped a tree on him, flattening him and doing further damage to his muscles.

10 years of seeking medical support and interventions. None have helped his pain, or improved his ability to walk. Physios, Hydrotherapy, Acupuncture were non effective, only pain medication and sleeping tablets helped him.

In those ten years he has been unable to walk without the support of a stick, has not been able to work, play with his children or live what he terms, a mans life. His goal was simple, go back to work to support his family and play football with his 10 year old son for the 1st time.

Two weeks ago he arrived and began a sometimes punishing programme on the verti-run and a stretch programme.

The results speak for themselves, this man is now walking with a normal stride pattern, has regained much of his core stability and muscle strength and no longer needs a walking stick.

There is still alot of work for him to do, it will take many more weeks of hard work for him to fully recover from years of agony, but he is now able to return to his family in Scotland with a daily stretch and exercise programme that will see him return to work and play that all important game of footie !

The Verti-Run changes lives, that is a very happy fact.
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Old 01-09-2013, 09:18 AM   #69
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[Only registered and activated users can see links. ] Hows that work Deal
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Old 01-09-2013, 09:28 AM   #70
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didn't realise that, one of them things I heard and just assumed it was true. Plastic changes??

Do you work with any boxers?

p.s. do you reckon it would be possible to perform any kind of useful contrast therapy using a shower sometime after training??
Plastic as in the structure of the muscles, changing the resting length. No, boxing is a very niche sport where I'm from, no money or real interest in it. Yeah you can do contrast therapy in the shower and it will be effective to an extent, probably not quite as effective as going in 12 degree water though.
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Old 01-09-2013, 09:39 AM   #71
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[Only registered and activated users can see links. ] Hows that work Deal
Looks like an advertisement for a low impact rehab machine. Good luck with your hustle, I hope whoever is flogging these things advises the users to include more impact work once they're better to avoid osteoporosis. I don't understand how this relates to what we were talking about, stretching was the topic. It doesn't relate to athletes either, there's studies showing that doing the same exercise standing up and lying down only helps with the position you trained in, I'd expect that to be the same with this vertirun. I'd expect it to cause injuries in athletes more than anything, you're avoiding working the hamstrings eccentrically and a lack of eccentric hamstring strength is known to be the biggest risk factor for hamstring injuries.
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Old 01-09-2013, 10:00 AM   #72
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Thankfully its the reverse of what you think, I was referring How the guy with the Stretch program recovered in 10 days like many others.
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Old 01-09-2013, 10:04 AM   #73
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Thankfully its the reverse of what you think, I was referring How the guy with the Stretch program recovered in 10 days like many others.
What guy with a stretch program? It was a guy on a vertical treadmill. Wouldn't it be a lovely world if you could be rehabbed by stretching, it doesn't and never will happen though.
If you're making claims about the vertirun you need to do everything on that to prove something, including another variable just makes what you're doing unscientific. Stretching has been shown almost conclusively to show little rehab benefits, if you're including stretching into your thesis you're just undermining any positive results you might get from the vertirun.
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Old 01-09-2013, 10:30 AM   #74
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Just had 5 years of Tests on the thing, with stunning results, the biggest sports company in the world are in talks. Stretching in the wrong Hands like anything can be Harmful. in the right Hands it can be very beneficial, in any Testing its about the protocol, its a grey area. But theres just as much evidence for, as there is against, theres 2 camps of thought. I understand that, and realise which you are in, no Harm done . At this time, im busy repairing 2 Sports Dr, 3 Sports Therapists and a Ballerina, they thing Stretching is wonderful, as do the hundreds of Elite Athletes Ive worked with.
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Old 01-10-2013, 03:53 AM   #75
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Plastic as in the structure of the muscles, changing the resting length. No, boxing is a very niche sport where I'm from, no money or real interest in it. Yeah you can do contrast therapy in the shower and it will be effective to an extent, probably not quite as effective as going in 12 degree water though.
Can you explain that in more dumbed down terms please mate. I'm pretty clueless on alot of this stuff but I'm trying to learn.

How would you go about contrast therapy with a shower? Two mins hot then sudden cold for a minute repeated 5 times or so?
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