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Old 01-23-2013, 02:58 PM   #31
Seamus
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

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Doesn`t matter, its just personal opinion.

I can see & even appreciate how effective Monzon is, he`s incredibly accurate & that doesn`t change from round 1-15 but I feel his size & strength at MW more so than his outright ability is the main reason for his dominance. I could see someone like Robinson boxing the piss out of him because he could take what Monzon could dish out, has the gas tank & will to still be strong in rounds 12-15 & has tremendous speed.

Monzon is quite slow as it is, he might even look stuck in the mud vs a true thoroughbred like Ray Robinson, Monzon looks flawed & beatable to me, he just never fought anyone that has the attributes combined with talent to get it done IMO.
Monzon didn't show his cards, he controlled the pace to where he wanted to operate, but when it got out of his hands, he could match a fast pace fairly effortlessly. He was a lot like a change-up pitcher in baseball. He didn't always show you his fastball.
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:05 PM   #32
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

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Those films of him having his hand raised 84 times in a row are pretty impressive.

He actually looks great on film but you have to watch how he controls the narrative and pace of a 15 round championship fight, not just a highlight reel.

Max Baer looks ridiculous.
then again Max Baer isn't an ATG.. so that might explain that one big buddy
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:06 PM   #33
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

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Monzon didn't show his cards, he controlled the pace to where he wanted to operate, but when it got out of his hands, he could match a fast pace fairly effortlessly. He was a lot like a change-up pitcher in baseball. He didn't always show you his fastball.
I don`t watch baseball
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:07 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Butcher View Post
Doesn`t matter, its just personal opinion.

I can see & even appreciate how effective Monzon is, he`s incredibly accurate & that doesn`t change from round 1-15 but I feel his size & strength at MW more so than his outright ability is the main reason for his dominance. I could see someone like Robinson boxing the piss out of him because he could take what Monzon could dish out, has the gas tank & will to still be strong in rounds 12-15 & has tremendous speed.

Monzon is quite slow as it is, he might even look stuck in the mud vs a true thoroughbred like Ray Robinson, Monzon looks flawed & beatable to me, he just never fought anyone that has the attributes combined with talent to get it done IMO.
So he's not that good because he didn't fight the greatest of all time?
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:07 PM   #35
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

Monzon's brilliant, but I've got to really be in the mood for it.
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:08 PM   #36
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

Max Baer looks no more ridiculous than a Vic Darchinyan, Sung-Kil Moon or Juan Urango do to me. Even heavyweight needs the uber crude and awkward bangers.
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:12 PM   #37
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

And don't forget you had all those smoking hot coked-out, barely dressed Monte Carlo broads to look at on Monzon footage... a major plus.
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:13 PM   #38
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

Yeah I get the monzon not being pleasant to watch thing.. I mean really... can anybody say it's fun to watch him fight for hours (if your not in that particular kinda mood)? It's kinda boring and not what I would call awe inspiring of the record he accumulated. I see the frazier thing as well... Great fighter.. but I just don't see some awesome technician in there. Saddler is another one. Gene would be another.
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:16 PM   #39
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

Straight up G.

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Old 01-23-2013, 03:16 PM   #40
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

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Wills ain't fair because all we have is a used up version of him to look at.
Sure we do, but it's a fair answer to the question.
He really doesn't look impressive on that film.

I mean, I could say someone like Lennox Lewis or Carlos Monzon too, or a Max Baer or George Foreman, but that's a lot to do with aesthetics and it's a bit unfair. In truth, the WINS they have on film must impress me some.

But Stanley Ketchel ...
1. I really think he's an ATG of the highest order.
2. He's kind of 'in his prime' I think, in the films. I mean, he was never old.
3. He's a bit shit on those films.
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:16 PM   #41
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And don't forget you had all those smoking hot coked-out, barely dressed Monte Carlo broads to look at on Monzon footage... a major plus.
Good shout.
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:20 PM   #42
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Straight up G.

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And again.
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:20 PM   #43
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

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So he's not that good because he didn't fight the greatest of all time?
Of course not, I just don`t see in him why so many rank him the best ever MW. I think a guy like Robinson could/would beat him comfortably.
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:27 PM   #44
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

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Straight up G.

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Not really someone to be glorified, imo.
But, hey, we've even had Ayala-fixated loons on here, so it's all good.
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:32 PM   #45
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Default Re: ATGs who don't look impressive on film.

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Not really someone to be glorified, imo.
But, hey, we've even had Ayala-fixated loons on here, so it's all good.
And a draft dodging pimp hobo is some kind of hero?
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