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Old 01-22-2013, 06:22 PM   #46
KuRuPT
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

There clearly was a little exaggeration on Johnson part there, and a few other places I suppose. Really though, he was spot on during a great number of his quotes there. Why is that statement though so outlandish (sans the not being able to ever land a blow).. do you really think Dempsey blows Corbett out of the water or something?
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Old 01-22-2013, 08:04 PM   #47
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

Quote:
Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
Reading it again, seeing the same old arguments today

"you're biased towards old timers"

"he doesn't posses the great skills set of the classic champions"

Crazy stuff.
The Fitz/Langford/Corbett/Jeffries era was considered a golden era similar to the way the 70s is today. That is so often forgotten when reviewing boxing today.

Johnson did hate the weight shift of the new champions, so obviously he is going to be more biased. Whether this makes him more right or less right is not clear, but his record both in the ring and in making predictions of fault, is not too shabby and probably gives him as much credibility as anyone.

Incidentally, I am surprised that the Dempsey pitchfork brigade didnt pick on the fact that Dempsey not only ducked Jack Johnson in prize fighting, but also in actual sparring. What an absolute tragedy that we cant even witness a sparring session on film between these two greats.
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Old 01-22-2013, 10:09 PM   #48
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boilermaker View Post
The Fitz/Langford/Corbett/Jeffries era was considered a golden era similar to the way the 70s is today. That is so often forgotten when reviewing boxing today.

Johnson did hate the weight shift of the new champions, so obviously he is going to be more biased. Whether this makes him more right or less right is not clear, but his record both in the ring and in making predictions of fault, is not too shabby and probably gives him as much credibility as anyone.

Incidentally, I am surprised that the Dempsey pitchfork brigade didnt pick on the fact that Dempsey not only ducked Jack Johnson in prize fighting, but also in actual sparring. What an absolute tragedy that we cant even witness a sparring session on film between these two greats.
B,I,as a member of Dempsey's "pitchfork brigade",ask aren't you carrying this
denigration of Dempsey just more than a tad too far. Now you have Dempsey "ducking " Jack Johnson of all people who was a shot FORTY ONE
year old fighter in 1919 when Dempsey first became champ and Johnson
was for all purposes retired soon after...Why knock Dempsey for even
this ? I can understand some ESB posters disappointment that Dempsey
didn't hook up with a Harry Wills or a Harry Greb who were viable fighters in 1919-26, but Jack Johnson ??? Johnson was 11 years older than even Harry Wills...Dempsey is more villified than Benedict Arnold on ESB...???
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Old 01-22-2013, 11:01 PM   #49
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

I appreciate Jack humble remarks and respect to Sam Langford, well deserved, however if a fight between the 2 happened it would be a bit more competitive and brutal than some think. Sam was the most equip 5"7 Heavyweight wanna be at the time but lets not undermine Jack Dempsey, who even rusted and not oiled vs Sharkey and Tunney, KO'd Sharkey with a hook and almost got to Gene with a fast an powerful combo....JD was no slouch and he may have a good shot of keeping Sam on his ass but not an easy task
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Old 01-23-2013, 02:07 AM   #50
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

Ducking sparring sessions is not a real thing.
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:06 AM   #51
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

Quote:
Originally Posted by KuRuPT View Post
do you really think Dempsey blows Corbett out of the water or something?
I definatley believe Dempsey beats Corbett
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Old 01-23-2013, 04:49 PM   #52
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

I've not seen enough of Corbett to call a fight involving him.

He looked good against fitz to begin with but on film like that it's hard to judge how great his jab and movement really is. Seeing fitz counter is beautiful though.
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Old 01-24-2013, 03:59 AM   #53
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

Quote:
Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
I've not seen enough of Corbett to call a fight involving him.

He looked good against fitz to begin with but on film like that it's hard to judge how great his jab and movement really is. Seeing fitz counter is beautiful though.
I wish i could see that fight on a little better film would see a lot more of what made them both great.
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Old 01-24-2013, 04:25 AM   #54
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

Tommy Gibbons was a pretty excellent well-schooled boxer with a good straight left and right.
... and he didn't do any of that stuff that boxers are supposed to do to 'expose' the 'crude' Jack Dempsey.
Tunney did, but we have good grounds to say Dempsey was past his best for those fights, and even Tunney almost got KO'd.

Corbett, yeah he was probably a great fighter, but he was KO'd by the flat-footed Fitzsimmons and he was beaten up by Tom Sharkey, who was a lot cruder than Dempsey ... so, I don't think he'd be a lock to make a monkey outta Dempsey.
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Old 01-24-2013, 04:34 AM   #55
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

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Originally Posted by Unforgiven View Post
Tommy Gibbons was a pretty excellent well-schooled boxer with a good straight left and right.
... and he didn't do any of that stuff that boxers are supposed to do to 'expose' the 'crude' Jack Dempsey.
Tunney did, but we have good grounds to say Dempsey was past his best for those fights, and even Tunney almost got KO'd.

Corbett, yeah he was probably a great fighter, but he was KO'd by the flat-footed Fitzsimmons and he was beaten up by Tom Sharkey, who was a lot cruder than Dempsey ... so, I don't think he'd be a lock to make a monkey outta Dempsey.
I broadly agree with this but it is said Corbett , for whatever reason, did not train for the second Sharkey fight.
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Old 01-24-2013, 10:58 AM   #56
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

True gibbons being outboxed by Dempsey is a truly great victory and perhaps his greatest.
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Old 01-24-2013, 11:55 AM   #57
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

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Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
True gibbons being outboxed by Dempsey is a truly great victory and perhaps his greatest.
...and something Greb did three times.
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Old 01-24-2013, 12:01 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seamus View Post
...and something Greb did three times.
yet Dempsey wouldn't step foot in the ring with him!

Bigger duck than wills.
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Old 01-24-2013, 12:12 PM   #59
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Default Re: Dempsey v Langford

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Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
yet Dempsey wouldn't step foot in the ring with him!

Bigger duck than wills.
Dempsey asked Greb to train him for the first Tunney fight.
I forget how much Greb wanted but he did say after refusing Dempsey's lower offer,"besides I hope to fight you myself,",Dempsey replied ,"who'd pay to see that fight?"

I'd like to see some concrete, big money offers for Dempsey to fight Greb. So far , I never have.
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Old 01-24-2013, 12:14 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcvey View Post
Dempsey asked Greb to train him for the first Tunney fight.
I forget how much Greb wanted but he did say after refusing Dempsey's lower offer,"besides I hope to fight you myself,",Dempsey replied ,"who'd pay to see that fight?"

I'd like to see some concrete, big money offers for Dempsey to fight Greb. So far , I never have.
he asked Dempsey for a fight to his face. He shouldn't have to spar or train with him that's no prerequisite lol.
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