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Old 01-29-2013, 06:11 PM   #31
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

Not surprised.

He weighed in at what...148/149 the other week?

A real shame though. He didn't need 'em and didn't need to bulk up, he was the optimum feather.
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Old 01-29-2013, 06:27 PM   #32
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

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Originally Posted by shaunster101 View Post
This is David Walsh, the Sunday Times journalist explaining why you should never just allow doping in sports. Well worth a watch for his perspective.

BORKED


That video is cringeworthy. For all the outrage and anger Walsh has shown towards Armstrong, he has no objection to Merckx, who was also a cheat. I have no issue with people being against Armstrong but that is a massive level of hypocrisy. It'd be like saying "I dislike Luis Resto for cheating, but my favourite fighter is Antonio Margarito".

It's laughable that someone who has made plenty of money from being this supposed beacon of integrity in the fight against drugs in cycling is willing to hold Merckx up as the greatest of all time. If Walsh was an honest, fair man, he'd call Merckx out as the cheat he was. However, Walsh isn't honest and fair, he's a lying, hypocrite.

I have no time for people like him. They have no integrity at all. He'll try to differentiate between EPO and other PEDs but the fact is, a cheat is a cheat. Merckx took what was available to him and Armstrong took what was available to him. There's no difference between the two riders, and they should be judged in the same bracket, along with every other cheat.
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Old 01-29-2013, 06:30 PM   #33
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

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Originally Posted by Flea Man View Post
Not surprised.

He weighed in at what...148/149 the other week?

A real shame though. He didn't need 'em and didn't need to bulk up, he was the optimum feather.
Yeah, I agree with this. There's a thread at the moment about how ignorant boxers are in regards to their nutrition, and that's something I agree with, but they're also very ignorant about the benefits and negatives of PEDs. People think they are superdrugs which will transform themselves into stronger, faster, better athletes with more stamina but that's not really the case. Look at the negative effects steroids had on Vargas when he took them for the fight with De La Hoya. It's not uncommon to hear of a guy cheating after a sub-par performance.

PEDs do come with a negative side. For many fighters, and I'd include Gamboa in this, they're better off staying natural.
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Old 01-29-2013, 08:06 PM   #34
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

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Originally Posted by shaunster101 View Post
This is David Walsh, the Sunday Times journalist explaining why you should never just allow doping in sports. Well worth a watch for his perspective.

BORKED
That is just an explanation of why you shouldn't accept cheating. The argument is to lift the restrictions so that it is no longer cheating.
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Old 01-29-2013, 08:06 PM   #35
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

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Originally Posted by Flea Man View Post
Not surprised.

He weighed in at what...148/149 the other week?

A real shame though. He didn't need 'em and didn't need to bulk up, he was the optimum feather.
There not just for bulking up.
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Old 01-29-2013, 08:49 PM   #36
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

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That is just an explanation of why you shouldn't accept cheating. The argument is to lift the restrictions so that it is no longer cheating.
You can't have a sport that allows participants to take substances that are prohibited by the laws of the country.
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Old 01-29-2013, 09:12 PM   #37
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

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Originally Posted by shaunster101 View Post
You can't have a sport that allows participants to take substances that are prohibited by the laws of the country.
i agree. just saying the video doesn't really make any argument as you mentioned.

so whats the answer for you?
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Old 01-29-2013, 09:55 PM   #38
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

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i agree. just saying the video doesn't really make any argument as you mentioned.

so whats the answer for you?
NO idea to be honest.

I think there are so many factors involved that I can't really see a simple approach.

I just think that when it's in the interest of the governing bodies and £multimillion companies that the top athlete's are fit, healthy, producing exciting performances and have a good reputation then I don't really see that there is any real incentive for the powers in charge to stop doping. You only have to look at the UCI and cycling in the 90s to see that.

From the perspective of anti-doping agencies wanting to eradicate doping, which I sincerely believe they do, they face that problem that when there is so much money at stake people will always cheat. And because of the resources available the dopers will always be ahead of the testers, so you're never going to stamp out cheating. And then you have to take into consideration that they are probably working against the might of the governing bodies and sponsors who have both £millions and their reputations tied up in these guys who also don't want to see them caught.

Also, the commercialisation of sport and the money available has increased athlete's itineraries to an unprecedented level (think matches/tournaments/races per season), to the point that it's so demanding that it is actually bad for their bodies and some PEDS are probably necessary to stop their bodies from falling to pieces (i.e increasing the hormones that help the body to heal and recover). This is another reason why I don't think governing bodies will want to catch dopers. You don't put them in a position where doping is a necessity to keep to their schedule and then throw then under the bus for ensuring they perform.
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Old 01-29-2013, 10:14 PM   #39
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

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Originally Posted by shaunster101 View Post
NO idea to be honest.

I think there are so many factors involved that I can't really see a simple approach.

I just think that when it's in the interest of the governing bodies and £multimillion companies that the top athlete's are fit, healthy, producing exciting performances and have a good reputation then I don't really see that there is any real incentive for the powers in charge to stop doping. You only have to look at the UCI and cycling in the 90s to see that.

From the perspective of anti-doping agencies wanting to eradicate doping, which I sincerely believe they do, they face that problem that when there is so much money at stake people will always cheat. And because of the resources available the dopers will always be ahead of the testers, so you're never going to stamp out cheating. And then you have to take into consideration that they are probably working against the might of the governing bodies and sponsors who have both £millions and their reputations tied up in these guys who also don't want to see them caught.

Also, the commercialisation of sport and the money available has increased athlete's itineraries to an unprecedented level (think matches/tournaments/races per season), to the point that it's so demanding that it is actually bad for their bodies and some PEDS are probably necessary to stop their bodies from falling to pieces (i.e increasing the hormones that help the body to heal and recover). This is another reason why I don't think governing bodies will want to catch dopers. You don't put them in a position where doping is a necessity to keep to their schedule and then throw then under the bus for ensuring they perform.
I think theres two things that will help.

1. Zero tolerance on positive tests.
2. Sponsors adding stipulations to contracts with athletes, organisations and broadcasters where they must return money if athletes are not clean.

If you create a situation where the consequences of getting caught are so severe that it would not be worth cheating. This has worked well in society, so would well in sport.
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Old 01-30-2013, 02:35 AM   #40
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

Yep, I read that.......................
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Old 01-30-2013, 03:33 AM   #41
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

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Originally Posted by shaunster101 View Post
You can't have a sport that allows participants to take substances that are prohibited by the laws of the country.
In the UK it is legal to import and use steroids providing you bring them in yourself and only take them yourself.

I think the current situation is a farce. We hear about many alleged cover ups by governing bodies across all sports who turn a blind eye to athletes caught using.

Sport has never been "clean". We are sold bullshit about Corinthian ideals but from the earliest times sportspeople have looked for an edge and used whatever was thought capable of giving them improved performance.
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Old 01-30-2013, 03:59 AM   #42
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Default Re: Gamboa - doper!

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Originally Posted by happydrinks View Post
Testosterone is produced in your body. It doesn't get more natural than that.
Shit is produced in your body, but try eating it for a week and see how well you are.
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Old 01-30-2013, 05:26 AM   #43
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

why does this not suprise me
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Old 01-30-2013, 10:59 AM   #44
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

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Originally Posted by Jack View Post


That video is cringeworthy. For all the outrage and anger Walsh has shown towards Armstrong, he has no objection to Merckx, who was also a cheat. I have no issue with people being against Armstrong but that is a massive level of hypocrisy. It'd be like saying "I dislike Luis Resto for cheating, but my favourite fighter is Antonio Margarito".

It's laughable that someone who has made plenty of money from being this supposed beacon of integrity in the fight against drugs in cycling is willing to hold Merckx up as the greatest of all time. If Walsh was an honest, fair man, he'd call Merckx out as the cheat he was. However, Walsh isn't honest and fair, he's a lying, hypocrite.

I have no time for people like him. They have no integrity at all. He'll try to differentiate between EPO and other PEDs but the fact is, a cheat is a cheat. Merckx took what was available to him and Armstrong took what was available to him. There's no difference between the two riders, and they should be judged in the same bracket, along with every other cheat.

bollox, there is a huge difference between a cyclist on peds vs a cyclist on peds plus EPO

you ****ing mug you dont have a clue, merckx never attacked walsh about his dead son either something armstrong done on numerous occasions, get your head out of your arse please
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Old 01-30-2013, 11:39 AM   #45
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Default Re: Gamboa - allegedly used PEDs

Man I ****in hope this isnt true.
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