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Old 02-16-2013, 05:54 AM   #16
McGrain
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

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Originally Posted by LittleRed View Post
Also, you don't have Loughran. Certainly he rates above Sanchez?
i

I'm gonna take out McAuliffe I think, but I'm not sure who i'll add in his place. Front runners seem to be

Fighting Harada
Tommy Loughran
Micheal Spinks
Carlos Ortiz

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Only as clearly as B. Leonard over Pep or something. You know yourself about that bantamweight-featherweight gap and how hard it is to jump. It was all a lot less organised back then of course, and I do believe the general boxing knowledge back then was less widespread (though conditions were tougher to almost make up for it), but nevertheless, a younger George Dixon was reportedly the great boxer of the day who was, quite importantly, a real ring innovator who shared his secrets with Walcott himself. I never like to take into account fame or political influence and things like that, but the invention or at least original implementation of boxing methods and techniques goes a long way in my book.
Both boxers fought significantly heavier opponents and both suffer incomplete records. They were also affected by racism. Dixon in particular - I have heard - deserved more decisions than given credit for.
It's a nice pocket argument, but is it really a clear case for having Walcott lower?
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:06 AM   #17
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

Having Tunney 2 tiers ahead of Holyfield just seems wrong, imo.
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:07 AM   #18
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

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also, you don't have loughran. Certainly he rates above sanchez?

Outside shout to rosenbloom. Although no clue where to put him. Or ted lewis. Or carlos ortiz. Or freddie miller. Or tommy ryan.
+1
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:10 AM   #19
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

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Originally Posted by McGrain View Post
i

I'm gonna take out McAuliffe I think, but I'm not sure who i'll add in his place. Front runners seem to be

Fighting Harada
Tommy Loughran
Micheal Spinks
Carlos Ortiz


It's a nice pocket argument, but is it really a clear case for having Walcott lower?
Of course not, but then we could go back and forth about B. Leonard versus Fitzsimmons. Preference.

My main issue with lists is the common ratings of Napoles and I. Williams; like they're clearly below Burley or H. Williams. It can be argued, I suppose, but I'm quite strongly opposed. Both, like Gavilan and Rodriguez, have an extensive list of contenders under their belts, and cannot be separated. On my list, like I said, they would typically feature around #28-#32, with Burley and H. Williams just underneath.
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:14 AM   #20
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

I can't help you with such things, simply because Ranking Lists are impossible with 100% uncertainty, that's the only accurate thing about them.

for me it's Elite, Great and small g great where most top fighters fall into, and the important thing is, there is very little between fighters in these categories, a 'fine' line...

Elite/Great/great.
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:20 AM   #21
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

B Leonard switched for Ali.
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:22 AM   #22
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

Ali stays my dude.
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:22 AM   #23
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

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Of course not, but then we could go back and forth about B. Leonard versus Fitzsimmons. Preference.
Maybe the two belong in the same tier.
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:29 AM   #24
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

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Maybe the two belong in the same tier.
**** yeah. Remember, you are responsible for me moving Fitzsimmons from around #16 to #10. I'd like to persuade you to move Leonard up a bit. If in doubt, refer to this:

Streak: 80-2-1

Record against Hall of Famers within streak: 15-2-1

Ted Kid Lewis 0-0-1
Jack Britton 2-1
Johnny Dundee 4-0
Freddie Welsh 1-0
Johnny Kilbane 1-0
Lew Tendler 2-0
Rocky Kansas 4-0
Willie Ritchie 1-1

Notes: one loss disqualification, one loss four rounder (avenged by knockout).
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:30 AM   #25
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

He's an utter bastard of a fighter - but does #8 really make your eyes water?
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:34 AM   #26
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

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He's an utter bastard of a fighter - but does #8 really make your eyes water?
Yep! Leonard, in my eyes, was a true legend in the same pot as the top three, and only an early retirement prevents him from pushing one of them out.
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Old 02-16-2013, 06:34 AM   #27
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

I can live with 8 I guess.

McFarland for Williams, Williams for Hagler
Jofre for Saddler, Saddler for Hearns
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Old 02-16-2013, 07:22 AM   #28
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

delete

Last edited by Boxed Ears; 06-04-2013 at 07:05 AM.
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Old 02-16-2013, 08:04 AM   #29
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

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That is simply ridiculous. What the hell did they make this man out of?

But, even with statistics like that...was he as great as the other great Benny? [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
You might get a bit closer with Benny Lynch

Another impressive statistic from Leonard is that apart from being stopped four times when he was just sixteen, nobody beat him inside the distance again until Jimmy McLarnin after Leonard was far, far removed from what he had once been. That is some two hundred (just under) bouts in a row without being stopped.
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Old 02-16-2013, 08:14 AM   #30
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Default Re: Help me sort out this top 50 pound for pound

Lose Tunney and replace with Jack Johnson. I think jack should actually be up higher but i dont know who to lose. Im not a fan of tiers cos i end up not knowing where to stop
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