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Old 03-14-2013, 08:34 PM   #1381
MagnaNasakki
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Wlad has knocked out more men than Rocky has. They both did a pretty good job of concussively kayoing people, too. They each have a huge CV of concussive kayos.

They are both very effective puncher's.

Wlad will have a MUCH easier time hit Rocky then Rocky will him. That's kind of the basis for the pro-Wlad ****ysis, if you've been reading. Gimme a long jab and straight hand anyday; It's the easiest combination to land if you have the range and speed in boxing.

Fact is, and it is a FACT: Marciano primarily used accumulation and beatings to finish fights. Wlad primarily got his stoppages with big knockdowns and concussive knockouts. If effect on opponent is the measure, Wlad is clearly the harder puncher. Go through each of their fights on film, it's there to be seen.

Rocky only has a handful of true stoppages off of one punch. Wlad has about ten. To say that he doesn't have power is ludicrous. He hit just as hard, if not harder, than Lennox Lewis and David Tua. Did they have one punch power by your definition?
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Old 03-14-2013, 08:44 PM   #1382
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Rocky was NOT that easy to hit.
If Wlad punches down on and misses then gets cought by Rock punching from a crouch with a full body'd thrust he's getting put to sleep on the spot.
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Old 03-14-2013, 08:45 PM   #1383
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Originally Posted by MagnaNasakki View Post
Wlad has knocked out more men than Rocky has. They both did a pretty good job of concussively kayoing people, too. They each have a huge CV of concussive kayos.

They are both very effective puncher's.

Wlad will have a MUCH easier time hit Rocky then Rocky will him. That's kind of the basis for the pro-Wlad ****ysis, if you've been reading. Gimme a long jab and straight hand anyday; It's the easiest combination to land if you have the range and speed in boxing.

Fact is, and it is a FACT: Marciano primarily used accumulation and beatings to finish fights. Wlad primarily got his stoppages with big knockdowns and concussive knockouts. If effect on opponent is the measure, Wlad is clearly the harder puncher. Go through each of their fights on film, it's there to be seen.

Rocky only has a handful of true stoppages off of one punch. Wlad has about ten. To say that he doesn't have power is ludicrous. He hit just as hard, if not harder, than Lennox Lewis and David Tua. Did they have one punch power by your definition?
wait wait...the taller man with the SIGNIFICANTLY longer reach and the all time great jab, who also happens to be far superior technicality with a straighter right hand and much better acuracy will have an easier time landing?!

that sounds reasonable and based on facts...dino is allergic to that you insensitive *****
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Old 03-14-2013, 08:50 PM   #1384
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Originally Posted by dinovelvet View Post
Rocky was NOT that easy to hit.
If Wlad punches down on and misses then gets cought by Rock punching from a crouch with a full body'd thrust he's getting put to sleep on the spot.
so if wlad, the technically superior fighter, swings and misses cartoonishly and throws himself (amazingly) off balance and completely vulnerable AND rocky leaps 8 inches with full force and nails wlad with a right hand, he'll knock him out?

in this scenario, why doesn't he just throw a ****ing fireball or sonic boom?

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Old 03-14-2013, 08:57 PM   #1385
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Marciano hit on the move for the most part, when he sat down on his punches and delivered them his opponents were ruined and almost killed.
Wlad needs to set up his big shots from a distance. He does not have that power in close where Rock will be unloading on him.
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Old 03-15-2013, 02:23 AM   #1386
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Originally Posted by dinovelvet View Post
Marciano hit on the move for the most part, when he sat down on his punches and delivered them his opponents were ruined and almost killed.
Wlad needs to set up his big shots from a distance. He does not have that power in close where Rock will be unloading on him.
dude where is marciano gonna hit wlad??? on the kneecap?? the *****??
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Old 03-15-2013, 02:57 AM   #1387
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

I'm a big Marciano fan as most know. I'd favor Wlad easily. I think it's too much of a physical obstacle to overcome. Of course, a neutral referee is more important than Marciano's power as far as I'm concerned. Maybe then Rocky could have a chance at winning one or two times out of ten, if that at all.

I'd favor Wlad over Dempsey, too. I'm not ready to relinquish that position with Frazier, though. Let me pick the referee and Frazier wins more times than not. Nothing rose-colored about that. Wlad actually have a better chance against Ali than Frazier. Styles might suggest so.

The Eddie Chambers bit doesn't mean all that much to me either, sorry. Not that I disrespect a professional fighter like Eddie's position, but I don't know enough. I mean, almost every fighters picks the fighter of their generation to win fantasy fights. Hell, it's not a fighter thing but a generational thing. So it can almost be the opposite effect of nostalgia. I'd have to hear more about his position on other fighters against his generation to get a better perspective.
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Old 03-15-2013, 03:03 AM   #1388
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

My main issue is guys like Dempsey and Louis actually have victories over championship calibre super heavyweights so they have more in the argument.

I think Frazier has the perfect style to beat Wlad with his bob and weave and a leaping left hook.

Rocky, I'll happily agree that if he can last longer than 5, and I'm not talking shell or back foot fighting, but making wlad work and making him pay for it, then yeah rockys chances increase with every round, but no way can a man so small take punches off a man so big.
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Old 03-15-2013, 03:10 AM   #1389
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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My main issue is guys like Dempsey and Louis actually have victories over championship calibre super heavyweights so they have more in the argument.
Yeah, I'd ever so slightly favor Dempsey's chances over Marciano's but that chance is increasingly more marginal by the day because styles is an often overused crux for when quality is clearly lacking. Same goes for the bigger men in regards to Dempsey. I'd see no other scenario than Marciano demolishing Firpo, who would just be a bigger target for Marciano to abuse. It just may take a little longer. I'm not going to argue with Louis when he beat many very good big men and had plenty of quality. Louis was simply a much better fighter than Dempsey in my view.

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I think Frazier has the perfect style to beat Wlad with his bob and weave and a leaping left hook.
Yep. Tyson has the best attributes and a serving style. I'm 100% convinced Tyson wins ten times out of ten at his absolute peak. Frazier has the most ideal style. The biggest concerns would be his durability and the referee. Those concerns won't even matter with Tyson, however.

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Rocky, I'll happily agree that if he can last longer than 5, and I'm not talking shell or back foot fighting, but making wlad work and making him pay for it, then yeah rockys chances increase with every round, but no way can a man so small take punches off a man so big.
It's a huge IF but a sensible one if it's somehow physically possible. If anyone could prove such physical disparities aren't everything, it's surely a legend like Marciano. Still almost the work of Hollywood movie-making, almost.
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Old 03-15-2013, 03:17 AM   #1390
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Originally Posted by PetethePrince View Post
I'm a big Marciano fan as most know. I'd favor Wlad easily. I think it's too much of a physical obstacle to overcome. Of course, a neutral referee is more important than Marciano's power as far as I'm concerned. Maybe then Rocky could have a chance at winning one or two times out of ten, if that at all.

I'd favor Wlad over Dempsey, too. I'm not ready to relinquish that position with Frazier, though. Let me pick the referee and Frazier wins more times than not. Nothing rose-colored about that. Wlad actually have a better chance against Ali than Frazier. Styles might suggest so.

The Eddie Chambers bit doesn't mean all that much to me either, sorry. Not that I disrespect a professional fighter like Eddie's position, but I don't know enough. I mean, almost every fighters picks the fighter of their generation to win fantasy fights. Hell, it's not a fighter thing but a generational thing. So it can almost be the opposite effect of nostalgia. I'd have to hear more about his position on other fighters against his generation to get a better perspective.
Truth. Good call on Frazier, too. A little bit more sound, steady pressure, took a few less risks, bigger guy.

I'd probably pick Frazier too. I'd pick Ali, simply because of his speed, movement, and penchant for dragging out the worst in fighters. If Wlad has a panic button(We know he does), Muhammad Ali is gonna push it.

I think Wlad and Dempsey would end early, one way or another. Both could be hurt, and put down. Again, give me the bigger, straighter puncher in that one.

Tyson wrecks Wlad. I think Holyfield would be soundly outboxed as he had a habit of getting caught at the end of long punches, and that hurts me to say, he's one of my favorite fighters. Bowe and Lewis win because they'd fight inside, and have the strength and size to not get dominated physically and to get leverage, as well as avoid being leaned on or redirected with the left(Wlad's best trick that nobody talks about).

Yeah, I'd probably take Liston and Holmes, too. I don't think Wlad would adjust well to being outjabbed. I think he'd start overcommitting to his power shots, which would allow them to establish range to land their own stuff. I think Liston would be the easier assignment, though.

I go back and for on Louis. I think Wlad has a ton of advantages, including styles, but Louis is such a compact, efficient puncher who can turn it over and on with so little, that I think one little opening, one lazy clinch, would be all he needed to put it away. Could he avoid getting pinned out on the jab and bombed out, though? His head movement wasn't great, and his left hand was lazy, which is the only bad habit I can think of the actively draws Wlad's right hand(The second Brock started shifting guard to search for bigger punches, he started getting blasted). Gun to my head, Louis, but I think it's an interesting fight.

Think Old George beats Wlad, too, in a pure stylistic and mental thing. So much pressure, so much heat, so much strength, such painful punches. George on the attack is a fearsome thing, it's very hard to resist. He's like the immovable object, you've got to box around him. Wlad has shown in the Thompson and Wach fights that he can move a bit, but I don't think his foot speed and mental toughness is where it would need to be for that sort of challenge.
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Old 03-15-2013, 03:18 AM   #1391
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

Tyson would bomb Wlad out of the ring within 2 minutes of the first round.

Wlad would be scared sh!tless and would never be able to handle the kind of aggression and immense pressure Tyson would erupt forward with ... nor can his chin handle the KO power Tyson had

Frazier would probably lose as would Joe Louis
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Old 03-15-2013, 05:04 AM   #1392
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Tyson would bomb Wlad out of the ring within 2 minutes of the first round.

Wlad would be scared sh!tless and would never be able to handle the kind of aggression and immense pressure Tyson would erupt forward with ... nor can his chin handle the KO power Tyson had

Frazier would probably lose as would Joe Louis
Doubt Frazier but probably Louis. In fact Wlad would probably have Louis on ***** street with a few stiff jabs.
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Old 03-15-2013, 06:48 AM   #1393
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Doubt Frazier but probably Louis. In fact Wlad would probably have Louis on ***** street with a few stiff jabs.
Is that meant to be a joke? You'll get cought cold by jabs if you walk in straight lines....When was Louis known to attack like a train on tracks?....Louis would circle away from his power hands and position himself from angles to the point where Wlad wont know where he is......Records are paramount and Wlads skills and power are untested at Elite level....Bombing out unconditioned nobody's means nothing......Bute was thought to be the hardest puncher in the SMW division till he fought Froch and his shots just bonced off him......... The closest Wlad came to Elite was Haye(whose far from an A level fighter) and he walked out of the ring without out a scratch.
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Old 03-15-2013, 09:31 AM   #1394
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Originally Posted by dinovelvet View Post
Is that meant to be a joke? You'll get cought cold by jabs if you walk in straight lines....When was Louis known to attack like a train on tracks?....Louis would circle away from his power hands and position himself from angles to the point where Wlad wont know where he is......Records are paramount and Wlads skills and power are untested at Elite level....Bombing out unconditioned nobody's means nothing......Bute was thought to be the hardest puncher in the SMW division till he fought Froch and his shots just bonced off him......... The closest Wlad came to Elite was Haye(whose far from an A level fighter) and he walked out of the ring without out a scratch.
louis knocks wlad out. i have no argument with that
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Old 03-15-2013, 09:35 AM   #1395
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Default Re: Wladimir Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano

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Doubt Frazier but probably Louis. In fact Wlad would probably have Louis on ***** street with a few stiff jabs.
????????????? loooooooooooool. Arguably the smartest boxer to get into the ring with the arguably the smartest trainer in his corner are going to let Wladimir stand there and jab him??
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