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View Poll Results: Who you got?
McCallum KO 2 9.09%
McCallum Pts 11 50.00%
Griffith KO 2 9.09%
Griffith Pts 7 31.82%
Voters: 22. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-26-2013, 03:12 PM   #61
lora
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

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Bomber Graham and Watson both beat Charles Burley






The petulant spitefulness of this post is genius
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Old 03-26-2013, 03:23 PM   #62
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

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I wonder would Bennie Briscoe have been McCallum's best scalp?
No, but he would have been up in the top 5 comfortably if he was in his prime.

He was past his best when he fought Griff though.That version that was neck and neck in fights with Curto and Hart was no longer the same bad Bennie that took on Monzon and Valdez earlier, though still very good and looked very solid against Muhammed.

Mind you, Eddie as usual never moved out of second gear.Just stayed in boxing mode throughout and it was still debatable.Lazy bastard.

Griffith aged remarkably well as a fighter.A testament to his skills that he was even able to hang with a guy like Briscoe at that stage of his career, even if Benny had seen better days himself.
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Old 03-26-2013, 03:27 PM   #63
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

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Griffith was a strong bastard, but he was no Carmen Basilio by any means who could get even middleweight bulls like Fullmer to utilise movement.
Ooooo i dunno, when he beefed up a bit he could put it about, he looked bull against Dick Tiger for spells. Tiger one of the few guys that could get Basilio or Fulmer in a headlock and run their hair.
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Old 03-26-2013, 03:38 PM   #64
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

Probably need to watch the Tiger fight again.I mostly just remember him having a lot of his success on the outside and at mid-range with the straight punches by taking advantage of Tiger's tendency to reset himself and try starting from scratch when turned(rather than just punch, even if off balance) he did use his subtle footwork to keep big Dick off balance so he could slip inside and pound away for a bit, but i don't remember it being the main strategy, just something he'd do so as not to become too predictable or polite.
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Old 03-26-2013, 03:43 PM   #65
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

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Probably need to watch the Tiger fight again.I mostly just remember him having a lot of his success on the outside and at mid-range with the straight punches by taking advantage of Tiger's tendency to reset himself and try starting from scratch when turned(rather than just punch, even if off balance) he did use his subtle footwork to keep big Dick off balance so he could slip inside and pound away for a bit, but i don't remember it being the main strategy, just something he'd do so as not to become too predictable or polite.
This is exactly how I remember it, though I give Griffith's strength kudos for the times he did hold his own there.

I can see your point. Strength wise I don't see anyone muscling Griffith around, even if I do agree with your hypothesis that he wouldn't impose himself on everyone at the weight as well as he did to welters.
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Old 03-26-2013, 03:47 PM   #66
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

Yeah, he certainly didn't steamroll him or anything just didn't get steamrolled himself. I think the extra weight suited Griffith, suited his style.
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Old 03-26-2013, 03:52 PM   #67
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

A bit like the man in your avatar when his legs started failing him and he needed to rough house peeps (i.e Tyson I) the extra weight was good.

Griffith was ****ed and had no choice mind you. He had outgrown welter, or at least had passed the window in which he could make the weight.

Are we in agreement that he changed to negative Emile in the second Paret fight? Or is that when, as per lora's assessment, he realised that when faced with cultured left hands he shouldn't trade too openly on his?

Mind you his left hook was still ultra crisp in the first Monzon fight. Got in and out nicely until Monzon broke him down. And he couldn't really jab with Monzon.
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Old 03-26-2013, 03:54 PM   #68
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

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Is that what gets him in your top ten? What about failing to conclusively beat Bruce Curry twice?
those were @ 140 and/or catchweight , u bleeding rectum , Wilfredo was drained there about as he was vs Ray Leonard.

when he was not drained , he outpointed Duran and Palomino and was difficult 4 a prime Hearns .
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Old 03-26-2013, 04:00 PM   #69
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

I been keeping it secret, cos you two are such bullies, but I actually really like Griffith in the second fight

BORKED

At 3:13 he gets Parret's left hand, the problem you mention, totally under control with his left and then he throws an uppercut around himself James Toney style and he actually misses but he's always trying shit like that in this fight, really ultra cute little inside moves, I like it. He moves Parret out and across the ring, head in his shoulder again, doesn't take a shot and then he lands above five single shots, all uppercuts, in a row. Keep watching, it's an uppercut masterclass, slips a jab, throws one up the middle. He did turn it into a certain kind of fight but he looks much the beter of the two to me, anyway. I've become a bit of a fan actually, of his supposedly more horrible boxing.
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Old 03-26-2013, 04:04 PM   #70
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

BORKED

Here's Tiger I. At 1:15 he bundles Tiger back. At 2:35, Tiger is getting a bit fruity and Griffith ties him and marches him. Clancey spoke about it as a big part of their strategy here, and Griffith wasn't convinced but after the early clinches was like "yeah that'll work."
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Old 03-26-2013, 04:12 PM   #71
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

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Originally Posted by frankenfrank View Post
those were @ 140 and/or catchweight , u bleeding rectum , Wilfredo was drained there about as he was vs Ray Leonard.

when he was not drained , he outpointed Duran and Palomino and was difficult 4 a prime Hearns .
Shut up you soft cunt. Benitez weighed in over 140. He was a welter.

Or was it his one defence that gets him in the top ten?

No? Just the masterclass over Palomino? In which case I would still say Benitez is not a top ten welter.

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I been keeping it secret, cos you two are such bullies, but I actually really like Griffith in the second fight

BORKED

At 3:13 he gets Parret's left hand, the problem you mention, totally under control with his left and then he throws an uppercut around himself James Toney style and he actually misses but he's always trying shit like that in this fight, really ultra cute little inside moves, I like it. He moves Parret out and across the ring, head in his shoulder again, doesn't take a shot and then he lands above five single shots, all uppercuts, in a row. Keep watching, it's an uppercut masterclass, slips a jab, throws one up the middle. He did turn it into a certain kind of fight but he looks much the beter of the two to me, anyway. I've become a bit of a fan actually, of his supposedly more horrible boxing.
I said pretty much the same in the 'what fights did you watch today' thread yesterday. I love Griffith, no objections here.

My favourite thing he does in the second fight is the right uppercut in close. Every limb bar that is tied up and he smashes it in. Paret might be slapping more with the left to head and body but his head is the one jolting back when Griffith works with the right.

Shall I upload the first and second fights to youtube in one piece or is there no demand?
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Old 03-26-2013, 04:13 PM   #72
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

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Originally Posted by McGrain View Post
Tiger is getting a bit fruity

Griffith wasn't convinced
Find that hard to believe.
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Old 03-26-2013, 04:14 PM   #73
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

I'd love to see the whole of the second fight. You'll probably get some hits uploading the first one from sick bastards like lora, looking for the third one, so only if that kind of thing interests you. I hit a million yt views on my channel the other week there.
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Old 03-26-2013, 04:14 PM   #74
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

Andre Ward is the Lidl version of Emile Griffith.
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Old 03-26-2013, 04:16 PM   #75
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Default Re: Emile Griffith v Mike McCallum @154

Lidl has a great bakery.
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