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View Poll Results: Does Ali/Ali's corners blatant use of banned substances to recover damage his legacy?
Yes 5 22.73%
No 17 77.27%
Voters: 22. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 04-05-2013, 05:03 PM   #1
xRedx
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Default Muhammad Ali and PEDs

It is a well known fact that Muhammad Ali had to use PEDs after being nearly knocked out by Henry Cooper, he was saved by the bell. One can clearly see his corner putting something under Ali's nose to revive him.


Watch this video from 7:25-8:45.

-Ali gets knocked down, beats the 10 count and is saved by the bell

-Ali is clearly hurt bad and his consciousness is messed up as he gets up from his stool when the rest between rounds just began

- Watch closely at 8:00 one can see the cornerman put something under Ali's nose and Ali becomes irritated (8:04). It is extremely clear at 8:06 that the cornerman is using smelling salts and Ali looks alert all of a sudden

-When the fight begins again at 8:37, Ali looks much better than before clearly the effects of the smelling salts have worked.

BORKED

What do you guys think of this? I think it delegitimizes Ali's career somewhat since he was basically about to get knocked out by a journeyman. Admittedly it was his early career and he still was developing, but he shouldn't have had big problems with a man like Cooper.

=================================================

UPDATE: I've heard from a couple posters that Dundee spit Ali's glove to give him extra time and that the extra time Ali got was edited in the fight film. What is your take on this?

Last edited by xRedx; 04-07-2013 at 04:23 PM.
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:10 PM   #2
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by orriray59 View Post
Smelling salts, and many great boxers have used them.

Yes, but they were illegal in British boxing when the match took place.
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:13 PM   #3
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by Mendoza View Post
Yes, but they were illegal in British boxing when the match took place.
Should be changed to a nc.

There is proof of cheating, ref didn't see it so no DQ win for Cooper but it can be still a nc.
And Ali proved he was the better man in the rematch, the nc is purely for the reason that cheating shouldn't give you a win.
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:17 PM   #4
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

I think it's pretty obvious that Ali most likely would have been knocked out had those smelling salts not been used.
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:23 PM   #5
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by xRedx View Post
I think it's pretty obvious that Ali most likely would have been knocked out had those smelling salts not been used.
I thinks it pretty obvious your talking bullshit!
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:23 PM   #6
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

So this is the guy who's going to end up leaving in the next few weeks. He'll stand firm for a while, start posting lol all the time, then claim he's being misunderstood and trolling incessantly, then he'll fade away like the rest of the 'tards.
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:27 PM   #7
Wass1985
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by Flea Man View Post
So this is the guy who's going to end up leaving in the next few weeks. He'll stand firm for a while, start posting lol all the time, then claim he's being misunderstood and trolling incessantly, then he'll fade away like the rest of the 'tards.
Who are you on about?
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:32 PM   #8
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by Flea Man View Post
So this is the guy who's going to end up leaving in the next few weeks. He'll stand firm for a while, start posting lol all the time, then claim he's being misunderstood and trolling incessantly, then he'll fade away like the rest of the 'tards.
Well... it can be quite fair to change the result to a NC, Ali defeated him in the rematch anyway.
There would be zero loss for Ali but it should set an example that cheating should never give you a win, even if the chance to win the fight was 99%, cheating shouldn't be allowed under any circumstance.
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:37 PM   #9
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by Flea Man View Post
So this is the guy who's going to end up leaving in the next few weeks. He'll stand firm for a while, start posting lol all the time, then claim he's being misunderstood and trolling incessantly, then he'll fade away like the rest of the 'tards.
How is this trolling? My OP is based on facts. If you don't like the evidence, don't attack the person giving the evidence but attack the evidence itself.

Next please.
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:43 PM   #10
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by xRedx View Post
How is this trolling? My OP is based on facts. If you don't like the evidence, don't attack the person giving the evidence but attack the evidence itself.

Next please.
Its the way you state that its a dead on cert he was going to get knocked out, when there's all the evidence in the world that it would be highly unlikely!!

He got dropped, but he got up immediately and was on strong legs, these are facts not assumptions!!
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Old 04-05-2013, 05:46 PM   #11
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by Wass1985 View Post
Its the way you state that its a dead on cert he was going to get knocked out, when there's all the evidence in the world that it would be highly unlikely!!

He got dropped, but he got up immediately and was on strong legs, these are facts not assumptions!!
I didn't say it's 100% certain he would get knocked out, I just said its most likely he would get knocked out around 80% and my OP showed why.

Muhammad Ali didn't even know where he was after that knockdown, he got out of his stool out when Dundee slapped him on the leg (dundee slapping him on the leg to wake him up) indicating he was partially unconscious and was operating on his determination alone.
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Old 04-05-2013, 06:10 PM   #12
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by xRedx View Post
I didn't say it's 100% certain he would get knocked out, I just said its most likely he would get knocked out around 80% and my OP showed why.

Muhammad Ali didn't even know where he was after that knockdown, he got out of his stool out when Dundee slapped him on the leg (dundee slapping him on the leg to wake him up) indicating he was partially unconscious and was operating on his determination alone.
That's the great thing about ali, he was a warrior and a survivor. The corner was in panic mode, for all we know ali might have had all his faculties and was merely wanting to stand up to show he was ok. Unless you was in the corner you don't know what happened!
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Old 04-05-2013, 06:23 PM   #13
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by Wass1985 View Post
That's the great thing about ali, he was a warrior and a survivor. The corner was in panic mode, for all we know ali might have had all his faculties and was merely wanting to stand up to show he was ok. Unless you was in the corner you don't know what happened!
Nah.. you can see it in the video. He stands up because he's semi unconscious. Who gets up like that, losing precious seconds to rest, just to show he can stand when he already showed that by returning to the corner?

I agree with the OP, it's very probable Ali would get KO'd. Smelling salts just revived him and it was showing in the 5th. It should have been a DQ loss for him actually.
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Old 04-05-2013, 06:31 PM   #14
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by freelaw View Post
Nah.. you can see it in the video. He stands up because he's semi unconscious. Who gets up like that, losing precious seconds to rest, just to show he can stand when he already showed that by returning to the corner?

I agree with the OP, it's very probable Ali would get KO'd. Smelling salts just revived him and it was showing in the 5th. It should have been a DQ loss for him actually.
You don't know why he stood up so your just assuming. His legs sure as hell didn't show that he was semi conscious. What makes you think he'd have been kod if he hadn't had been given the salts?
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Old 04-05-2013, 06:35 PM   #15
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Default Re: Muhammad Ali and PEDs

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Originally Posted by dyna View Post
Should be changed to a nc.

There is proof of cheating, ref didn't see it so no DQ win for Cooper but it can be still a nc.
And Ali proved he was the better man in the rematch, the nc is purely for the reason that cheating shouldn't give you a win.
We should also change any fight where to an NC where the winner low blowed or headbutted or clinched excessively. It'll be fun, let's start a thread
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