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Old 04-22-2013, 01:39 PM   #31
RockyJim
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

A war between 2 of my all time favs...I think that prime Dempsey wins by TKO...
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Old 04-22-2013, 02:06 PM   #32
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

Dempsey-starts out faster, slight edge in power, better chin. If Dempsey doesn't get him early i'll say by the 7th round then Frazier's chances greatly increase
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Old 04-22-2013, 02:10 PM   #33
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

Just to be clear I am picking Dempsey to win, good point by Burt also bringing up that Dempsey has a two handed attack where as Frazier lives and dies by his left hook.
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Old 04-23-2013, 05:32 PM   #34
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

Thanks Burt...I also remember Ray Arcel, when asked if Dempsey would've done well in the Ali era claimed that Dempsey would've had a "picnic" against the fighters of the period (I think it was the mid 70's) and Arcel saw them all so I wouldn't sell Jack short against anyone.
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Old 04-23-2013, 05:36 PM   #35
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

Dempsey,
TKO
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Old 04-23-2013, 06:25 PM   #36
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

Joe Frazier.
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Old 04-23-2013, 08:57 PM   #37
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

dempsey may have been the best first round fighter in history. frazier was vulnerable early on in bouts ; too much so to last long with dempsey imo. dempsey in one
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Old 04-23-2013, 10:11 PM   #38
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

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Originally Posted by gentleman jim View Post
Thanks Burt...I also remember Ray Arcel, when asked if Dempsey would've done well in the Ali era claimed that Dempsey would've had a "picnic" against the fighters of the period (I think it was the mid 70's) and Arcel saw them all so I wouldn't sell Jack short against anyone.
I have a ton of respect for Ray Arcel but that's crazy to say Dempsey would've had a picnic.
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Old 04-23-2013, 10:42 PM   #39
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

I do love Dempsey, but he remains the most overrated heavyweight I've seen on this forum. Arcel's opinion is great, but it's clear he has some generation bias.
Dempsey's chin: Massively overrated.
Dempsey's power: Massively overrated.

I do give Dempsey a chance to hurt Frazier, but if he floors him, he won't keep him there. Joe beats the **** out of Dempsey. One-handed fighters beat offensive two-handed fighters all the time. Too much is made of that.

Like Merchant wisely said in a vid I had once: "Yeah Frazier was one-dimensional, but that was some dimension!" I paraphrased, but he also said everyone knows going in about the hook- they just can't do anything about it. Dempsey would be no exception.

Frazier ends up putting Dempsey through a meat grinder. Less and less competitive with each passing round.
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Old 04-23-2013, 11:14 PM   #40
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

[quote=DaveK;15231213]I do love Dempsey, but he remains the most overrated heavyweight I've seen on this forum. Arcel's opinion is great, but it's clear he has some generation bias.
Dempsey's chin: Massively overrated.
Dempsey's power: Massively overrated.

I do give Dempsey a chance to hurt Frazier, but if he floors him, he won't keep him there. Joe beats the **** out of Dempsey. One-handed fighters beat offensive two-handed fighters all the time. Too much is made of that.

Like Merchant wisely said in a vid I had once: "Yeah Frazier was one-dimensional, but that was some dimension!" I paraphrased, but he also said everyone knows going in about the hook- they just can't do anything about it. Dempsey would be no exception.

Frazier ends up putting Dempsey through a meat grinder. Less and less competitive with each passing round.[/quote
I will take Ray Arcel's opinion over yours D ,anytime, anyplace.
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Old 04-24-2013, 12:00 AM   #41
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

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Originally Posted by burt bienstock View Post
I will take Ray Arcel's opinion over yours D ,anytime, anyplace.
I'm shocked!
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Old 04-24-2013, 12:07 AM   #42
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

Respected and wise people say stupid **** all the time-

Dempsey would have a "picnic" in one of the toughest times in heavyweight history? That qualifies for a stupid statement, and one that is obviously generated by a bias of some sort.

Nothing objective about him having a "picnic" in the '70's heavyweight scene. I think it realistic to say he'd be in the top ten, but not a cut above, such as Ali and Frazier. He'd be winning and losing against the B-class fighters of the era which is no insult AT ALL, and by the way, would be top dawgs in Dempsey's days...

A "picnic"... *****, get out of here... Ridiculous.
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Old 04-24-2013, 01:48 AM   #43
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

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Originally Posted by DaveK View Post
Respected and wise people say stupid **** all the time-

Dempsey would have a "picnic" in one of the toughest times in heavyweight history? That qualifies for a stupid statement, and one that is obviously generated by a bias of some sort.

Nothing objective about him having a "picnic" in the '70's heavyweight scene. I think it realistic to say he'd be in the top ten, but not a cut above, such as Ali and Frazier. He'd be winning and losing against the B-class fighters of the era which is no insult AT ALL, and by the way, would be top dawgs in Dempsey's days...

A "picnic"... *****, get out of here... Ridiculous.
I agree. It just shows that Ray was human just like all of us.

On the other hand lets not call Joe Frazier a one handed fighter. He was far from that. His righthand was always in the mix. He was accurate with it. He may not have put guys to sleep with it but Im sure he got their attention.
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:49 PM   #44
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

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I favor Dempsey just a little. A bit better at pushing opportunities to the limit; also, I don't think he would be at a disadvantage in such parts of the fight that were wars of attrition -- I think a fair number of his inside punches might have shoveled inside of Joe's. I've read Ambers boxed Armstrong like this in their rematch. But, ultimately, Armstrong and Ambers split and, if Dempsey and Frazier fought twice, I'd expect a split, too. I think Dempsey would take three ought of five.
(Nine years ago post ..... LOL, I can't even remember posting it).

Anyways, I'm nowadays no way near so confident a prognosticator, and I'm not at all sure who would win a Dempsey-Frazier encounter. If you pressed me, I might go 6-to-5 odds, Dempsey favored.

Last edited by guilalah; 04-25-2013 at 09:15 PM.
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Old 04-24-2013, 06:57 PM   #45
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Default Re: Frazier v. Dempsey 15 rds

Arcel was a boyhood Dempsey fan, his opinion is biased because of that and his opinions on Dempsey are pretty ridiculous.
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