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Old 06-19-2013, 03:05 PM   #46
Joe E
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

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Little Gene Tunney isn't capable of exploiting Tyson's fragile psyche any more than Hopkins is. Both are too small and not strong enough to make an impression on a charging rhino like Tyson. He would have no problem hitting either fighter. Tunney is not going to be surviving shots from a prime Mike Tyson. And Tyson WILL land them.
Stop with the Hopkins non sense. Tunney was well capable of exploiting Tysons mental health issues. Tillis, Tucker, and Douglas did it with movement and their skills. Neither were close to being the mechanic that Tunney was. Tunney was also an excellent strategist and much stronger physically then being given credit for, and certainly far stronger then Tyson had demonstrated in the mind. Tunney may not win, but this bout would be far more competitive then people may think.
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Old 06-19-2013, 03:21 PM   #47
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

People are talking as if Tunney is a midleweight here.

I will grant you that he is giving up weight, but we are essentialy matching a smal heavyweight against a cruiserweight with height and reach advantages.
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Old 06-19-2013, 03:41 PM   #48
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

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Stop with the Hopkins non sense. Tunney was well capable of exploiting Tysons mental health issues. Tillis, Tucker, and Douglas did it with movement and their skills. Neither were close to being the mechanic that Tunney was.
Not nonsense at all. In fact it underscores my point. Just because you have superior skills it doesn't mean that you can apply them with any degree of success against someone who is so much bigger, stronger, FASTER and harder-hitting than you are. The thought of Tunney trying to apply his "science" against an elemental force like Tyson is laughable to me. He'd get completely overwhelmed.

Tillis, Tucker and Douglas were also far bigger, stronger and harder-hitting than Tunney. And you overrate Tunney when you refer to him being some sort of sublime pugilistic "mechanic". I realize that this is the popular notion of him. But if you really study his career you realize that he wasn't. A tough and capable boxer, yes. But some untouchable heavyweight Willie Pep? Endowed with the mechanical genius of Archie Moore? Not even close.
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Old 06-19-2013, 03:44 PM   #49
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

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People are talking as if Tunney is a midleweight here.

I will grant you that he is giving up weight, but we are essentialy matching a smal heavyweight against a cruiserweight with height and reach advantages.
No, you are matching a scrawny 185 pound man against a monstrous 220 pound man. Tunney would look silly in there. And just about everyone Tyson fought had height and reach advantages. I think it's safe to say that Tunney's few advantages would quickly become a non-issue as soon as the quick-footed Tyson closed the gap.
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Old 06-19-2013, 03:58 PM   #50
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

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No, you are matching a scrawny 185 pound man against a monstrous 220 pound man. Tunney would look silly in there. And just about everyone Tyson fought had height and reach advantages. I think it's safe to say that Tunney's few advantages would quickly become a non-issue as soon as the quick-footed Tyson closed the gap.
If he closed it.
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Old 06-19-2013, 04:40 PM   #51
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

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Not nonsense at all. In fact it underscores my point. Just because you have superior skills it doesn't mean that you can apply them with any degree of success against someone who is so much bigger, stronger, FASTER and harder-hitting than you are. The thought of Tunney trying to apply his "science" against an elemental force like Tyson is laughable to me. He'd get completely overwhelmed.

Tillis, Tucker and Douglas were also far bigger, stronger and harder-hitting than Tunney. And you overrate Tunney when you refer to him being some sort of sublime pugilistic "mechanic". I realize that this is the popular notion of him. But if you really study his career you realize that he wasn't. A tough and capable boxer, yes. But some untouchable heavyweight Willie Pep? Endowed with the mechanical genius of Archie Moore? Not even close.
Tunney was also bigger then Tyson. What's the point? You grossly overestimate Tysons abilities in speed, footwork, and boxing ability, assuming he had any real advantage in these departments, and rely only on Tysons advantage in brute strength while ignoring the one greatest flaw, his inability to deal with adversity. This is where you argument fails. Tyson demonstrated on any number of occasions that when the going got tough, he quit. His bout with Douglas and his bouts with Holyfield demonstrate this perfectly. Your boy had all the tools, except for one, he had little Heart.
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Old 06-19-2013, 05:02 PM   #52
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

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I think if you put Tunney's attributes (reach, jab, footwork, toughness and speed)
When did speed become something to brag about for Tunney? He had average speed. I don't recall reading his foot or hand speed being praised as anything special by contemporary writers.
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Old 06-19-2013, 05:07 PM   #53
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

On the two occasions I spoke to Mike he expressed a dislike for Gene and that doesn't bode too well for the old Greenwich Village Marine.
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Old 06-19-2013, 05:22 PM   #54
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

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Tyson laughs at Tunney's best and blasts him out within 3. Gene doesn't have the firepower to hold off a prime, speedy and powerful 220 pound monster like Tyson. Tyson has fast feet too and would cut off any escape Tunney attempted.

Gene never once beat a powerpuncher. Now he's going to survive against one of the most fast and powerful punchers in HW history?

Sorry guys. That's about as big a stretch as I've seen on these boards.
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Old 06-19-2013, 05:27 PM   #55
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

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On the two occasions I spoke to Mike he expressed a dislike for Gene and that doesn't bode too well for the old Greenwich Village Marine.
Ali praised Tunneys footwork. Saying Gene was the second fastest in the division, after him, at that time. Tyson was quick moving forward, but his lateral movement was average. Tyson was a stalker, simple as. He also had a tendency to follow his opponents around the Ring, like Liston or Louis.
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Old 06-19-2013, 05:35 PM   #56
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

Ali wasn't born when Tunney had his last fight. His words about Tunney's speed mean nothing at all.
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Old 06-19-2013, 05:36 PM   #57
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

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Ali wasn't born when Tunney had his last fight. His words about Tunney's speed mean nothing at all.
Right.
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Old 06-19-2013, 06:00 PM   #58
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

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Why not simply list the prime powerpunchers who tested Tunney's chin? You can't. A past-prime Dempsey is the best you're going to be able to do.

Last edited by Surf-Bat; 06-19-2013 at 06:32 PM.
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Old 06-19-2013, 06:10 PM   #59
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

Again this forum excels it's self. Are you joking? You must be right? Has anybody, picking Tunney seen the films of both these men fight? Do you understand the size and speed difference?

Tyson in less than 3 rounds.
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Old 06-19-2013, 06:10 PM   #60
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Default Re: Mike Tyson v Gene Tunney

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Tunney was also bigger then Tyson. What's the point?
6'0, 185-189 pounds is "bigger" than 5'10, 220 pounds?

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You grossly overestimate Tysons abilities in speed, footwork, and boxing ability, assuming he had any real advantage in these departments, and rely only on Tysons advantage in brute strength while ignoring the one greatest flaw, his inability to deal with adversity.
You can't "overestimate" Tyson's abilities in speed. It was tremendous. Some of the fastest hands in HW history.

Little scrawny Gene Tunney isn't going to be showing Tyson any "adversity". Of that I can assure you.


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Tyson demonstrated on any number of occasions that when the going got tough, he quit. His bout with Douglas and his bouts with Holyfield demonstrate this perfectly. Your boy had all the tools, except for one, he had little Heart.
It wouldn't require heart for Tyson to beat Tunney. It would require him to hit Gene (who wasn't so hard to hit and WOULD be hit). Unless you can show me evidence of Gene taking numerous power shots from a huge puncher round after round and surviving. And please don't try and cite a past-prime Dempsey, who rarely hit Tunney with anything of consequence (and when he did, Tunney was floored and badly hurt).
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