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View Poll Results: A prime Duke vs. a post-Manila Ali
Morrison by KO/TKO 18 14.17%
Morrison by decision 1 0.79%
Draw 1 0.79%
Ali by KO/TKO 87 68.50%
Ali by decision 20 15.75%
Voters: 127. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-26-2013, 12:00 PM   #76
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

Tommy Morrsion sure gets a lot of love on this forum, but its pretty logical to go with Ali in this matchup. Tommy lacks the chin to go the distance with Ali, who withstood beastly left hooks and bodyshots from power punchers in 15 round fights.

Ali's long jab and straight right would be landed throughout the fight, and somewhere in the middle of the fight Tommy is either going down or getting cut to pieces resulting in a stoppage.
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Old 06-26-2013, 04:40 PM   #77
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

[quote]
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Originally Posted by Tommo View Post
Morrison's chin isn't the one getting tested in this fight. Ali has never taken hits flush like that. I'm sorry but in jungle fight George was not fast or sharp enough to land anything clean on Ali's head, I seen. Obviously with Tommy that would not be the case.
There is a reason why Morrison's record turned out the way he did.

He simply wasn't all that good.

His only major asset was power, and that is the one that seems to carry least weigh against Ali.

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Bentt was a big hitter
Who cares if Bentt was a big hitter, he was still Bentt.

This is not a fighter that a world class player should be loosing to under any circumstances.

The fact that he was abig hitter, and finished his career with the record he did, just proves that power is a very over rated comodity.

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Morrison was beating Mercer before he got hit with 15 punches in a row that woulda dropped anybody, He was fighting Lewis blind for rounds before finally getting knocked down by accumulation from a giant. That's it. I think he can handle Ali's shots! He's faster than Ali's victims too to minimize the damage.
Ali might not have been a big puncher, but he was certainly knocking out durable fighters, which Morrison was not.

Morrison would do what he always did when he faced elite opposition.

Loose.
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Old 06-26-2013, 04:49 PM   #78
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

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Old 06-26-2013, 04:55 PM   #79
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

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Originally Posted by John Galt View Post
Tommo, Ali definitely never faced anyone similar to Morrison's size, speed, power combination. There is no model to look at for this fight to determine how Ali would perform. Ali at his best struggled with Chuvalo, Mildenberger, etc. Morrison would be far more dangerous and Ali wouldn't have his usual size and speed advantage against Morrison.
Honestly, I think that Chuvalo might well have knocked Morrison out.
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Old 06-26-2013, 05:06 PM   #80
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

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Old 06-26-2013, 05:12 PM   #81
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

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Originally Posted by John Galt View Post
If Chuvalo could take the punishment from Morrison long enough, he might win if Morrison got tired. But Chuvalo would probably get stopped, either from taking too much punishment or from cuts before Morrison tired. Morrison was big, fast, and hard hitting - and remember...Chuvalo lost to Eduardo Corletti prior to the first Ali fight. Chuvalo, even in his prime, was capable of losing to fighters who were mediocre, or less.
Yes but that is exactly what we see with Morrison.

I can't understand why this guys is enjoying a resurgence!

He looked very good on film/paper, but consistently failed to deliver on that promise in the ring, like so many fighters that have looked good on film/paper.

There is absolutely no reason to think that he would have got a different result in another era.
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Old 06-27-2013, 06:18 AM   #82
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

[quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommo View Post
Morrison has a really good record (?) Pretty much comparable to Ali's without even considering Morrison's heavier opposition.
This ios one of the most aqbsurd statments ever written on this forum.

Ali defeated more than 30 opponents who were currently ranked.

Morrison fought a handfull, and lost to most of them.

Morrison isn't worthy to shine Ali's spit bucket.

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He had power, speed and sound boxing skills.
Lots of fighters have these atributes, but it dosn't mean that they will go on to become anything.

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Ali controversially never had to face anybody with such power (George Foreman is of course but due to the snap of Tommy's, his opponents didn't get back up for more) and definitely not somebody who could also deliver it as well.
There are lots of fighters who have power, but never go on to atain greatness. Earnie Shavers probably hit harder than Morrison and any of Ali's other opponents. Nobody is disputing that Morrison hit hard, but that in itself dosn't make him great.

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That's modern HW boxing. Even lesser opponents have good punchers chance for upsets. It happened to Lennox and Wladimir and is bound to happen. That's what makes the sport exciting!
But conspicuously dosn't happen to the greatest fighters in the sports history such as Louis and Ali.

They don't let it happen.

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Ali never really scored proper knockouts, Ali certainly did stop some durable opponents, agreed. However the perception of how durable those opponents were must be adjusted to the truth that those opponents were either not at Morrison's era's standard or atleast comparable.
The fact that one of Ali's former opponents, was able to come back and win the title in Morrisons era when he was almost 50, rather undermines the idea that Morrison was fighting in a stronger era.

Even if we accepted that Morrison was in a stronger era it would be irrelevant, because he never came close to the top of it.

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Morrison on the other hand smashed the living shit out of his opposition. Ruddock alone was better than any on Ali's resume (except perhaps Foreman) and he beat old Foreman too who was far more heftier and smarter than the young version.
Hogwash.

Ruddock was shot when Morrison fought him, and he was never great at his best.

Are you seriously going to suggest that beating a 40+ Foreman is somehow batter than beating a prime version?

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Apart from the upset loss to Bentt which happens from time to time
It dosn't happen from time to time.

Great fighters don't loose to oponents like Bentt, ever!

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Morrison only lost 2 other fights! He was in fact beating Mercer and whilst was outclassed by Lewis, was fighting blind for most of the fight and still managed a decent run. The main point is that there is no shame in losing to these guys at all because they are topper than practically anything on Ali's resume! He played in a different league!
So basicaly he lost to prety much every top fighter he ever faced.

You cannot assume that he was playing in a different league to Ali, because it is not suported by the facts, and is activley contradicted by some.

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Chuvalo was basically a chin on legs. He has no skill or speed compared to Morrison to speak of and the best he could hope for is for that chin to hold up against the most vicious beating of his life for a UD loss. But I think he would have gone the way of a KO. Morrison has displayed stamina issues that is true. But if he can maintain the work rate he did against big George with him stalking him for 12 rounds he could easily do it against Chuvalo.
Or Chuvalo might just find his chin and spark him.

I wouldn't bet money on Morrison beating any genuinely world class opponent.

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Well his record is very good, again (?)...
No it isnt.

It is average for a fighter at world level.

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And by saying he looked good on film but isn't any good, what you are really saying is you don't believe your own eyes!
No, I am saying that for every 20 fighters that look good on fil, you are lucky to get one who atains greatness.

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You can watch Ali struggle with comparatively weaker opponents and put on a visually stinker of a performance. I find his fights thoroughly unimpressive on the whole myself!
The fact that you have to attack Ali based on fights that he won, itself shows that he is in a different class to Morrison.

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And you can watch Morrison bang out his heftier opponents in spectacular fashion, put it together with some elite fighters and display solid boxing skills with speed and power, you said yourself he looked good!
Morrison never KOd anybody who was world class at the time.

He was spectacular against tomato cans, but he couldn't do it at world level.

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But you can't understand how he would fare better in an era full of easier opposition?
He didn't fare well against world class opposition period.

He generaly lost when he stepped up, and that would have been the case inb any era.

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I hope your analytical skills aren't necessary for your day job Janitor
This is coming from somebody trying to argue that Morrison has a better record than Ali.
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Old 06-29-2013, 11:20 AM   #83
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

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Originally Posted by Tommo View Post
70's Ali might be able to survive Morrison.

60's Ali would have been on his bike pedalling like he was in the tour de France. Tell you what Janitor, he would've ****in gone if he copped one of those punches mate. And he wouldn't have gotten up!
No one in the history of boxing can take a shot like Ali. But a 70s Ali takes a better shot then a 60s Ali because...... that protective fat? increased bone density? or that relative theory of relativity?
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Old 06-29-2013, 03:46 PM   #84
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

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Come on man, take a look at that 60's Ali closely. I seen more meat on the T-bone steak I had for dinner! I believe old Angelo would be wise to have him eat cheeseburgers all day for a month before their fight. His protective fat in his 70's I swear helped him through a lot of beltings, particularly Foreman. I don't think he'd have survived without it!

I just refuse to believe Tommy Gunn couldn't have banged him out!
Honestly, you need to forget everything you think you know about boxing, and start again. You overvalue size and visual appearance, and overlook pretty much everything else.

Perhaps you are a maverick who has discovered a universal truth that has eluded everybody else, but it is much more likely that you are just very wrong.
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Old 06-29-2013, 03:55 PM   #85
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

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Originally Posted by SP_Mauler View Post
No one in the history of boxing can take a shot like Ali. But a 70s Ali takes a better shot then a 60s Ali because...... that protective fat? increased bone density? or that relative theory of relativity?
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Old 06-29-2013, 04:02 PM   #86
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

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Originally Posted by Fnatic View Post
It's true
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Old 06-29-2013, 06:48 PM   #87
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

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Originally Posted by SP_Mauler View Post
It's true
What about Hagler, McCall, Vitali, Wach, G. Jones? Ali was dropped and hurt by 185 lb men, Wach and McCall took shots of 250 lb men without flinching.
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Old 06-29-2013, 07:10 PM   #88
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

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What about Hagler, McCall, Vitali, Wach, G. Jones? Ali was dropped and hurt by 185 lb men, Wach and McCall took shots of 250 lb men without flinching.
Vitali was hurt very badly against the worst version of Lennox Lewis
Holyfield took prime Lennox Lewis shots over and over
One shot from 40year old Foreman stunned Holyfield
Ali took a beating by a mean prime Foreman for 8rounds.

Lol Ali was dropped by a 185lb man ok you win. Lets just ignore everything else you've convinced me
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Old 06-30-2013, 06:43 AM   #89
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

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Originally Posted by Tommo View Post
Seriously though, the 70's Ali had...

(a) more total bodyweight, composed of...
(b) more muscles, and...
(c) some protective body fat. And also visibly had,

(d) a fuller face and jaw...
(e) and a thicker neck! And likely,
(f) thicker cartilage and denser bones because he was matured and further trained.

Of COURSE he had better chin and punch resistance than his 60's self! Anyone who thinks that 60's Ali could take anywhere near as much damage is a bloody idiot!

Janitor you have absolutely no clue about boxing or anything! I'm surprised you can even manage to feed yourself and aren't bedded up in hospital on a drip!
The fact that you think that you can tell anything form a, b, c, d, e or f, proved that you know next to about boxing.

You have got a lot of misconceptions about boxing firmly entrenched in your mind, and untill you start to question them, you will never learn anything.
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Old 06-30-2013, 03:00 PM   #90
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Default Re: Tommy Morrison vs. Muhammad Ali

If Ali could easily handle Jerry Quarry, who was three times the fighter Morrison was, he would have Tommy for lunch. Let's also remember, Tommy admitted to taking steroids, read that as cheating. Are we talking Tommy without the juice? He would do even worse.
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