Greater Resume: Lewis or Holmes? - Page 11

Cojimar 1945 · 06-23-2007, 01:35 AM

Given the advancements occurring in sports and the fact that athletes continue breaking records all the time I would suspect Holmes rating on a head to head basis would be going downhill as the years pass.

Senya13 · 06-23-2007, 01:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr. magoo

So basically what this said was that Ali, Dundee, and some unamed magazine felt that Norton was nobody before Muhammad's first meeting with him.

Hauser's book is not a contemporary source, actually. He met with Ali and his wife in October 1988 to discuss the possibility of writing that book, so some of those opinions about Norton were said in 1988-1991 (the book was first published in 1991) and still none of them thought highly of Norton. While you have presented nothing at all to back your bare words up, and it's been how long? But I expected that, as it's hard to find much respect for Norton in the contemporary sources, it only started to change many years after where people were trying to raise Ali's status as truly the greatest heavyweight there was, and thus instead of admitting that Ali lost to a virtually nobody, they started calling Norton great, and it has gone so far that he was accepted into IBHOF, which is BS to say the least.

Quote:

Hmmmmm......I wonder how all three entities felt after the match, let alone 2 more fights later, plus maybe half a decade of Kenny tearing up the division....

The 3rd fight meant nothing at all. Everyone figured Ali was done by that time, was completely past it.

Quote:

Funny how a " nobody " can all of a sudden become somebody, when given a chance. Is this not what great fighters are made of?

Except that Norton doesn't have anything significant other than 1 single win over aged undertrained Ali. He has 2 losses in rematches and a loss to Holmes, if you are not aware of that. He blew his chances, and him being awarded the title was a joke. He has never truly won a world champion title, he was a journeyman (who entered the ratings only because the system or ranking fighter was very bad, he didn't have a single win over ranked fighter prior to meeting with Ali) who accidentally became a mediocre contender once, blew his chances in rematches, and got handed a gift in a fight vs another former journeyman.

fightking12 · 06-23-2007, 02:09 AM

Lewis is better

My dinner with Conteh · 06-23-2007, 02:48 AM

If Norton was a journeyman, what was McCall?

dalek · 06-23-2007, 03:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill1234

No, Ive scored against Larry before. I only had Larry winning by a round, and understand how people think Spinks won it. But the rematch, Larry won clearly.

PS I don't love him and you can go fuck your self.

i bet it was the holyfield fight that you scored against larry right.seriously if you had larry winning the first spinks fight then you have ZERO credibility as far as i'm concerned.

My dinner with Conteh · 06-23-2007, 04:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalek

i bet it was the holyfield fight that you scored against larry right.seriously if you had larry winning the first spinks fight then you have ZERO credibility as far as i'm concerned.

Zero credibility? That's a compliment to Bill. He's been hanging around in the minus section for the past few years.

JohnThomas1 · 06-23-2007, 04:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by My dinner with Conteh

Zero credibility? That's a compliment to Bill. He's been hanging around in the minus section for the past few years.

ThinBlack · 04-27-2013, 05:32 PM

Lewis may slightly edge Holmes.

nostir a · 04-27-2013, 08:04 PM

lewis resume looks better on paper, but when viewed in depth it is no where near what it seems

tezel8764 · 04-27-2013, 08:25 PM

Lewis, Don King fucked up Larry's resume.

Theron · 04-28-2013, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dostoevsky

Lewis:
Mercer
Tyson
Holyfield
Ruddock
Weaver
Biggs
Tucker
Bruno
McCall
Tua
Morrison
Golota
Klitschko

Holmes:
Ali
Norton
Shavers
Cooney
Berbick
Witherspoon
Smith

I think Lewis takes it in terms of competition.

Sangria · 04-28-2013, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theron

Horseshit comparison. Doestovsky used Mercer AND Weaver for Lewis yet forgot to place better versions of them on Holmes' resume? That's out.

This is close. I lean towards Holmes since he didn't lose twice, by one punch KO, against B level comp in the heart of his prime. Holmes also beat an overall better skilled opposition than Lewis did with the power guys. Still it's close. Holmes edges it.

tezel8764 · 04-28-2013, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dostoevsky

Lewis:
Mercer
Tyson
Holyfield
Ruddock
Weaver
Biggs
Tucker
Bruno
McCall
Tua
Morrison
Golota
Klitschko

Holmes:
Ali
Norton
Shavers
Cooney
Berbick
Witherspoon
Smith

I think Lewis takes it in terms of competition.

UnleashtheFURY · 04-28-2013, 02:09 AM

i would have to say Lewis. Holmes fought tons of bums and guys who were well past their primes.

Sangria · 04-28-2013, 02:26 AM

Lewis:
Mercer
Tyson
Holyfield
Ruddock
Weaver
Biggs
Tucker
Bruno
McCall
Tua
Morrison
Golota
Klitschko
Briggs
Mavrovic

Holmes:
Ali
Norton
Shavers (x2)
Cooney
Berbick
Witherspoon
Smith
Weaver
Mercer
Ocasio
Snipes
C. Williams
Frazier
Eric Esch

Fixed to even the playing field a bit.

06-23-2007, 01:35 AM	#151
Cojimar 1945 Journeyman ESB Jr Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 185 vCash: 1000	Re: Greater Resume: Lewis or Holmes? Given the advancements occurring in sports and the fact that athletes continue breaking records all the time I would suspect Holmes rating on a head to head basis would be going downhill as the years pass.
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06-23-2007, 02:09 AM	#153
fightking12 Journeyman ESB Jr Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: SF Posts: 197 vCash: 1000	Re: Greater Resume: Lewis or Holmes? Lewis is better
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06-23-2007, 02:48 AM	#154
My dinner with Conteh P4P King East Side VIP Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 21,600 vCash: 1000	Re: Greater Resume: Lewis or Holmes? If Norton was a journeyman, what was McCall?
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04-27-2013, 05:32 PM	#158
ThinBlack Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,974 vCash: 1000	Re: Greater Resume: Lewis or Holmes? Lewis may slightly edge Holmes.
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04-27-2013, 08:04 PM	#159
nostir a Journeyman ESB Jr Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 150 vCash: 500	Re: Greater Resume: Lewis or Holmes? lewis resume looks better on paper, but when viewed in depth it is no where near what it seems
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04-27-2013, 08:25 PM	#160
tezel8764 Ain't No Stopping Us Now ESB Addict Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 4,806 vCash: 527	Re: Greater Resume: Lewis or Holmes? Lewis, Don King fucked up Larry's resume.
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04-28-2013, 02:09 AM	#164
UnleashtheFURY Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 1,750 vCash: 500	Re: Greater Resume: Lewis or Holmes? i would have to say Lewis. Holmes fought tons of bums and guys who were well past their primes.
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04-28-2013, 02:26 AM	#165
Sangria Contender ESB Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Pasadena, California Posts: 1,147 vCash: 500	Re: Greater Resume: Lewis or Holmes? Lewis: Mercer Tyson Holyfield Ruddock Weaver Biggs Tucker Bruno McCall Tua Morrison Golota Klitschko Briggs Mavrovic Holmes: Ali Norton Shavers (x2) Cooney Berbick Witherspoon Smith Weaver Mercer Ocasio Snipes C. Williams Frazier Eric Esch Fixed to even the playing field a bit.
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