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Old 08-23-2007, 05:09 AM   #46
divac
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Default Re: Where does Chavez rank among the

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Originally Posted by sweet_scientist
At the end of the day it's sparring, and sparring and fighting are somwhat different things, so even if it is true, you can only attach so much importance to it. But this sounds like it was no Spadafora-Mayweather match. As Steward said, Camacho was at the top of his game. I take it that means he wasn't coming in like Mayweather did for the Spadafora fight not having trained for a while.

In any case, I think Whitaker would beat Camacho no matter where or when they fought. Pernell was just more tenacious, and I think he'd press the fight and force Camacho to fight him like he did to Buddy McGirt. Camacho would probably oblige for a while too, for he probably wouldn't respect Pernell's power all that much. In that time he would get a lesson on infighting and bodypunching, until he'd slown down a tad and Pernell would pick him apart on the outside in the second half of the fight.
Emmanuel saying that Camacho was at the top of his game could mean that he was at the height of his career, and not neccesarily his training regimen.

We're on the right page in questioning Camacho's tenacity.
He was never the same fighter after his struggle with Rosario.
He tasted something from Rosario that he never wanted to experience again, and it affected Camacho as a fighter.

.....but I have great respect for Camacho's skillset. His offensive skills were by far superior to Pernell Whitaker's.
Camacho also had a more varied offensive attack to that of Meldrick Taylor.
What Camacho lacked was toughness in not deviating from his plan once he tasted hard leather.
That was brought on from his experience with Rosario.

Btw, I have so much respect for Camacho's skillset, that I have no doubt in my mind that he would have given Chavez a handful in a prime for prime match......before Rosario put the fear in him!

Whitaker was'nt one to attack and be aggresive however. I look at a prime for prime between Whitaker and Camacho as a near pickem, with a slight edge to Camacho.

Whitaker could be Hopkins nasty in that ring, and there is a chance he could make Camacho lose his cool and throw him off his game plan.
No doubt, Whitaker was mentally the tougher fighter.
Check that, maybe not an edge to Camacho, more like a clear pickem fight!
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Old 08-23-2007, 12:07 PM   #47
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Default Re: Where does Chavez rank among the

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Originally Posted by divac
Emmanuel saying that Camacho was at the top of his game could mean that he was at the height of his career, and not neccesarily his training regimen.
That's true.

Quote:
We're on the right page in questioning Camacho's tenacity.
He was never the same fighter after his struggle with Rosario.
He tasted something from Rosario that he never wanted to experience again, and it affected Camacho as a fighter.
I have a different theory on this one. The Rosario fight didn't change Hector. It revealed what was latent in him. I think Camacho's fall had more to do with partying and not training and being as sharp as he used to be. It wasn't so much mental scarring as it was laziness and other priorities imo which lead to a physical decline.

Quote:
.....but I have great respect for Camacho's skillset. His offensive skills were by far superior to Pernell Whitaker's.
Camacho also had a more varied offensive attack to that of Meldrick Taylor.
What Camacho lacked was toughness in not deviating from his plan once he tasted hard leather.
That was brought on from his experience with Rosario.
By far superior to Whitaker's? How so?

Speed I concede, Whitaker wasn't on Camacho's level, but what else made Hector's offense so superior?

Did he throw more than Whitaker, who regularly threw 1000 punches per 12 round fight? Was he more accurate than Whitaker? Did he have better infighting skills than Whitaker? I answer no to all those questions.

Quote:
Btw, I have so much respect for Camacho's skillset, that I have no doubt in my mind that he would have given Chavez a handful in a prime for prime match......before Rosario put the fear in him!
I also think it would be close, but Chavez would have hit Camacho and made him want none of it too imo. It just might have taken a few more punches than the powerful single shots Rosario fed him.

Quote:
Whitaker was'nt one to attack and be aggresive however. I look at a prime for prime between Whitaker and Camacho as a near pickem, with a slight edge to Camacho.

Whitaker could be Hopkins nasty in that ring, and there is a chance he could make Camacho lose his cool and throw him off his game plan.
No doubt, Whitaker was mentally the tougher fighter.
Check that, maybe not an edge to Camacho, more like a clear pickem fight!
Whitaker could be aggressive though. You can't tell me he wasn't aggressive against the likes of Roger Mayweather, Jorge Paez, Buddy McGirt, Diosbeyls Hurtado, Felix Trinidad. If he saw he was getting outboxed by Camacho, I think there's no doubt he'd try and get nasty and s**** with Camacho.
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